[Cheiro]

I find the controversy over mask wearing interesting. It seems we Americans are very slow to adapt many patriotic if not lifesaving changes in the way we live our lives. Today we get into our cars and before even starting the engine, we put on our seat belt and we do this without a second thought. Are we not old enough to remember the massive controversy in the 1970's over the issues of wearing seat belts in our cars? At the time it was presented as such a life-saving practice that thousands of lives could be saved by this simple device. However, Americans resisted it "tooth and nail." Eventually, the practicality and efficacy, much less the lives it saved, became obvious to Americans and we adopted the practice. And here we are again. A simple "live-saving" device is being resisted and for the same bogus reason, so-called "freedom." We like to think of ourselves as being "free" do to whatever we like. The reality is, of course, that is not true. Our activities are restricted every day by laws, practices and courtesy and especially in this instance since freedom does not allow you to infect another person with your disease. So, please wear your mask and protect not only yourself, but your fellow Americans.
Thank you.

[timjones]

Too many people take propganda as "gospel", without teasing out the truth.

Example; Tom Brokaw writes a book called "the Greatest Generation". Its a popular book, partly because it validates that generation that still lives and provides their children with some comfort as they contemplate the loss or coming loss of their parents.
All good stuff, but our society then concludes that the book's title is undisputed truth.

But it is disputed, at least by me. I believe America's greatest generation was the last 25 years of the 18th century - the revolutionary generation was the greatest! Theirs was a greater individual sacrifice and produced greater results for our collective posterity than any other!

But my world war 2 parents trained me to "do your own thinking". Follow others only to the extent you believe they are right.

As the OP stated

Originally Posted by Windguy

most Americans did their patriotic duty to help in the war effort

. This is probably true, but its also true that a significant minority were "selfish" - they only sought to "game the system" for their own benefit.

Today I observe a majority of people conforming to the so-called guidelines, while a significant minority takes an alternative approach. At this level I see no difference in the generations. (BTW a similar statement could be made of the real greatest generation - the revolutionary generation)

Personally, I take the guidelines under consideration and employ them only when I determine they may be tactically useful. In short, I take in new information (doing my best to ignore the accompanying propaganda) and incorporate it into my thinking.

Thus I still do my own thinking while refraining from telling others how they should think.

Though I do sometimes share my thoughts with others, partly because I perceive it may benefit them but mostly to invite them to criticize my thinking so I might find more truth to improve my own thinking.

American's constant need to analogize anything in terms of war(empty rhetoric mostly coming from politicians). War on crime, war on drugs, war on cancer, war on disease, etc.

The war analogy is an over simplification. In this COVID war, how do we deal with the conscientious objects? You know who I am referring, those doctors and nurses (as well as those in the food production and delivery pipeline) that decide not to work. Do we force them to work or put them in prison them like in a real war, of course not BECAUSE IT IS NOT A WAR!

Originally Posted by Windguy

Be a REAL patriot. Wear a mask.

Since its not a war the label of patriot does not compute in this context.

Be a REAL INDIVIDUAL HUMAN, do your own thinking while continuously being humane!.

Meritorious criticism encouraged.

[crazydeb10@yahoo.ca]

Originally Posted by Windguy

During World War II, Americans were asked to make many sacrifices. They were asked to limit their consumption of meat and processed foods because the soldiers abroad needed them. Sugar rations were half of what people normally consumed. Gasoline was limited to three gallons per week. People were asked to wear warmer clothes so that less fuel was needed to heat their homes and offices. People were asked to take shorter showers. People were even asked to contribute their rubber hoses so they could be converted into tires. These were REAL sacrifices and, thankfully, most Americans did their patriotic duty to help in the war effort. And, although such sacrifices were hard on civilians, they were NOTHING compared to what many men and women sacrificed when the put their very lives on the line to fight the enemy. I doubt that a large percentage of the populace complained that their rights were being taken away. People were true patriots then and they showed it by making sacrifices to help with the war effort instead of merely wrapping themselves in the flag and proclaiming their “rights.”

We are at war again. But this time the enemy is invisible. The enemy doesn’t honor front lines, but sneaks past those who risk their lives every day to fight this war. If the enemy touches you, you become an unwitting assistant in its battle against us. This increases the risk to our friends, families, and our front-line “soldiers,” the people who work in our hospitals and clinics. But, we know how to win this war. It really is quite easy. If we all made the tiniest sacrifice of wearing a mask, we could beat this enemy in no time. Such sacrifices are NOTHING compared to what our parents made to win WW2. So, we now call them “The Greatest Generation.” Sounds pretty good, doesn’t it? Do you think we rate such a moniker? I don’t think so. Because of our defiance in helping with the war effort, we will probably be known in the future as something more like “The Selfish Generation.” Many of us refused to wear a mask because it was our “right” to go uncovered. Really? Oh, the humanity! We greedily hoarded toilet paper, sanitizer, and the PPE that robbed our front-line soldiers of the battle gear they needed to fight the war. We are NOT patriots. We pale in comparison to our parents. We should be ashamed.

Be a REAL patriot. Wear a mask.

Amen 🙏. Well said.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Eg_cruz@comcast.net

Read the John Hopkins study on mask....they absolutely Slow the spread

YOU read it, or re-read it, and then tell me where it states wearing a mask while driving in a car alone with the windows up slows the spread

[Bucco]

All simply rhetoric.

The COS of our WH said this today...
________________________________
“We are not going to get control of the pandemic.”

Says we will instead try to get therapeutics and vaccines rather than trying to control the spread
_________________________

Given that he is speaking for our government, it appears we just have given up.

We were told perhaps by mid October, now it appears it will be well into 2021 before we will have general availability. My source is the New York Times which follows all trials closely and maintains a log of each.

Coronavirus Vaccine Tracker - The New York Times

I have zero medical background, but it seems we, as a country are going with the herd immunity...my words, because nobody seems to want to address the virus at all. From my reading, this strategy comes with extensive more sickness and death, yet we still mock folks who wear them.

I am confused...but it's probably just me.

UPDATE "We will know whether a vaccine is safe and effective by the end of November, beginning of December," the director of the US National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases said. "The amount of doses that will be available in December will not certainly be enough to vaccinate everybody -- you'll have to wait several months into 2021."

[JimJohnson]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

YOU read it, or re-read it, and then tell me where it states wearing a mask while driving in a car alone with the windows up slows the spread

Calm down golfing eagle. I love you and even more so if you can love others!

[kdbaumann11]

If Londoners had behaved during WWII (blackout curtains) the way Americans are behaving now, we’d be using a very different salute today.

[crazydeb10@yahoo.ca]

Me too. They don't deserve your help. Bothers me that the President talks like this virus is nothing. And now Pence is out when 5 of his people have tested positive for Covid-19. Selfish and they have no Respect for others.

[Lindsyburnsy]

As I recall, there is a "patriot" who thinks those that gave their lives are suckers and losers. Won't even wear a mask and ridicules those that do.
We are at war again. But this time the enemy is invisible. The enemy doesn’t honor front lines, but sneaks past those who risk their lives every day to fight this war. If the enemy touches you, you become an unwitting assistant in its battle against us. This increases the risk to our friends, families, and our front-line “soldiers,” the people who work in our hospitals and clinics. But, we know how to win this war. It really is quite easy. If we all made the tiniest sacrifice of wearing a mask, we could beat this enemy in no time. Such sacrifices are NOTHING compared to what our parents made to win WW2. So, we now call them “The Greatest Generation.” Sounds pretty good, doesn’t it? Do you think we rate such a moniker? I don’t think so. Because of our defiance in helping with the war effort, we will probably be known in the future as something more like “The Selfish Generation.” Many of us refused to wear a mask because it was our “right” to go uncovered. Really? Oh, the humanity! We greedily hoarded toilet paper, sanitizer, and the PPE that robbed our front-line soldiers of the battle gear they needed to fight the war. We are NOT patriots. We pale in comparison to our parents. We should be ashamed.

Be a REAL patriot. Wear a mask.[/QUOTE]

[nick demis]

Originally Posted by Windguy

During World War II, Americans were asked to make many sacrifices. They were asked to limit their consumption of meat and processed foods because the soldiers abroad needed them. Sugar rations were half of what people normally consumed. Gasoline was limited to three gallons per week. People were asked to wear warmer clothes so that less fuel was needed to heat their homes and offices. People were asked to take shorter showers. People were even asked to contribute their rubber hoses so they could be converted into tires. These were REAL sacrifices and, thankfully, most Americans did their patriotic duty to help in the war effort. And, although such sacrifices were hard on civilians, they were NOTHING compared to what many men and women sacrificed when the put their very lives on the line to fight the enemy. I doubt that a large percentage of the populace complained that their rights were being taken away. People were true patriots then and they showed it by making sacrifices to help with the war effort instead of merely wrapping themselves in the flag and proclaiming their “rights.”

We are at war again. But this time the enemy is invisible. The enemy doesn’t honor front lines, but sneaks past those who risk their lives every day to fight this war. If the enemy touches you, you become an unwitting assistant in its battle against us. This increases the risk to our friends, families, and our front-line “soldiers,” the people who work in our hospitals and clinics. But, we know how to win this war. It really is quite easy. If we all made the tiniest sacrifice of wearing a mask, we could beat this enemy in no time. Such sacrifices are NOTHING compared to what our parents made to win WW2. So, we now call them “The Greatest Generation.” Sounds pretty good, doesn’t it? Do you think we rate such a moniker? I don’t think so. Because of our defiance in helping with the war effort, we will probably be known in the future as something more like “The Selfish Generation.” Many of us refused to wear a mask because it was our “right” to go uncovered. Really? Oh, the humanity! We greedily hoarded toilet paper, sanitizer, and the PPE that robbed our front-line soldiers of the battle gear they needed to fight the war. We are NOT patriots. We pale in comparison to our parents. We should be ashamed.

Be a REAL patriot. Wear a mask.

World wide there are a large percentage of scientist whose research prove that unless you are wearing a very effective mask, they are useless, that means that 99% of the masks being used are useless. I guess the science only matters if it fits your narrative.

[Byte1]

So, lets see if I have this correct.
If you wear a mask, you are patriotic? If you don't, you are not? Hmmmm, I guess my service in combat zones in SE Asia and the Middle East, doesn't count.
If I do not agree on the multitude of mask wearing theories, then I am not patriotic? I am selfish if I do not see it the hysterical, panicked way?
Gotta love it when someone says stuff like this. Kind of like how folks say you are being selfish if you do not wear a seatbelt to protect yourself, because if you get injured someone else's insurance may go up.
Sorry, but that dog just don't hunt.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Byte1

So, lets see if I have this correct.
If you wear a mask, you are patriotic? If you don't, you are not? Hmmmm, I guess my service in combat zones in SE Asia and the Middle East, doesn't count.
If I do not agree on the multitude of mask wearing theories, then I am not patriotic? I am selfish if I do not see it the hysterical, panicked way?
Gotta love it when someone says stuff like this. Kind of like how folks say you are being selfish if you do not wear a seatbelt to protect yourself, because if you get injured someone else's insurance may go up.
Sorry, but that dog just don't hunt.

Thank you for your service!

Here's a reply from another mask thread to those who think not wearing a mask (except when appropriate) are selfish/unpatriotic/entitled, so I'll steal it

"Seriously?

I’ll bet you spent the last 50 years allowing well over a million people to die from the flu and you never wore a mask once.

If you want to mask shame someone, go look in the mirror."

I think that says it best

[Byte1]

Someone suggested that there are those that "mock" those that wear masks. Sensitive much? Do you call it "mocking" if someone does not agree with your view? I have not heard of anyone mocking, but I have heard of those that feel they are right say that "if you do not agree with me, then you are not patriotic" or "if you do not agree with me, then you are selfish." Get over it, some folks agree and some do not. Leave it at that. Yes, I believe that a mask has a certain amount of protection from pollen and germs. SOME. It is easy to say it helps, but they also say that coughing into your sleeve is a form of protection. How much protection is sufficient? Is the placebo effect, good enough to get the hysterical off your back? Will a simple paper mask, loosely connected to the face going to give the hysterical a warm and fuzzy feeling? How about a military gas mask with a hazmat suit? Maybe I believe that is the ONLY way to be sure of protecting yourself. Maybe I believe that you are being selfish unless you spend a handful of money on a certified, medically approved mask. Maybe I demand that you wear a pair of gloves and eye protection. How much is enough? How much will make the hysterical feel comfortable about leaving their homes?
It has nothing to do with patriotism. Patriotism is when you volunteer to take someone's place in a factory making certified masks when the regular employee is sick and unable to work. Patriotism is when you volunteer at a hot zone hospital assisting hospital personnel treating sick patients. Patriotism is volunteering for a vaccine test.
Some of you believe that guilt trips are convincing. You believe that if someone does not agree with you then they are selfish and unpatriotic. Maybe its' just that some do not agree with your view on the subject. Before making accusations, you should walk in their shoes, try to compare their sacrifice for their country to what you perceive to be an adequate example of your view on "patriotism."
FYI: I do not disagree with the wearing of masks. But, I do disagree with those that feel they are the experts on who should wear the masks and when. I also feel that it is not my responsibility to protect you when you are too ******* to stay away from folks that scare you. I do not feel that I must drive an electric car just so you can feel warm and fuzzy about saving the planet. But, if you wish to drive an electric car, then go for it. Wear your mask for the rest of your life, just to be sure to feel safe. After all, the flu season is close. Oops, is that "mocking" you? Hmm, perhaps it is.

[GPGuar]

Originally Posted by Windguy

During World War II, Americans were asked to make many sacrifices. They were asked to limit their consumption of meat and processed foods because the soldiers abroad needed them. Sugar rations were half of what people normally consumed. Gasoline was limited to three gallons per week. People were asked to wear warmer clothes so that less fuel was needed to heat their homes and offices. People were asked to take shorter showers. People were even asked to contribute their rubber hoses so they could be converted into tires. These were REAL sacrifices and, thankfully, most Americans did their patriotic duty to help in the war effort. And, although such sacrifices were hard on civilians, they were NOTHING compared to what many men and women sacrificed when the put their very lives on the line to fight the enemy. I doubt that a large percentage of the populace complained that their rights were being taken away. People were true patriots then and they showed it by making sacrifices to help with the war effort instead of merely wrapping themselves in the flag and proclaiming their “rights.”

We are at war again. But this time the enemy is invisible. The enemy doesn’t honor front lines, but sneaks past those who risk their lives every day to fight this war. If the enemy touches you, you become an unwitting assistant in its battle against us. This increases the risk to our friends, families, and our front-line “soldiers,” the people who work in our hospitals and clinics. But, we know how to win this war. It really is quite easy. If we all made the tiniest sacrifice of wearing a mask, we could beat this enemy in no time. Such sacrifices are NOTHING compared to what our parents made to win WW2. So, we now call them “The Greatest Generation.” Sounds pretty good, doesn’t it? Do you think we rate such a moniker? I don’t think so. Because of our defiance in helping with the war effort, we will probably be known in the future as something more like “The Selfish Generation.” Many of us refused to wear a mask because it was our “right” to go uncovered. Really? Oh, the humanity! We greedily hoarded toilet paper, sanitizer, and the PPE that robbed our front-line soldiers of the battle gear they needed to fight the war. We are NOT patriots. We pale in comparison to our parents. We should be ashamed.

Be a REAL patriot. Wear a mask.

OMG... just how many posts do we have to have about wearing masks?! Enough already, people will do what they want. There’s three posts just today on the subject and God knows how many over the last few months!

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by nick demis

World wide there are a large percentage of scientist whose research prove that unless you are wearing a very effective mask, they are useless, that means that 99% of the masks being used are useless. I guess the science only matters if it fits your narrative.

Do you have links to those world wide scientists ?

Thanks