[Pugchief]

In a previous thread, there was a discussion of going cashless. There were some posters of the opinion that it was a conspiracy theory that CBDCs would be used to control the population via de-banking, restricted purchasing or any other CCP (China-like) tactic.

Well, for those disbelievers, there is currently a bill in CA that will force cars to have speed limiting devices installed in new vehicles by 2027. Whether or not you think speeding is a scourge, do we really want to be told by "elites" how to drive? The speed-limiter will use GPS to guess the speed limit. My Tesla already tells me the speed limit of the road I'm on, and it is wrong at least 10% of the time. Also there are plenty of times it is not safe to to stay under the limit (avoid a collision with another car or person).

I'm going to predict that many will think this is a good idea. And many will think it's insane. Have at it!

Link to Story

[Bill14564]

So you title the thread "Central Bank Digital Currency" because you want to discuss a proposal that would require, by 2027 in cars sold in CA, a system to restrict speeds to 10mph over the posted limit?

[Pugchief]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

So you title the thread "Central Bank Digital Currency" because you want to discuss a proposal that would require, by 2027 in cars sold in CA, a system to restrict speeds to 10mph over the posted limit?

No, I titled it that because the entire point of posting that story was to show that overreach is not a conspiracy theory. But it's a fair criticism, and if there was away to change it, I would comply.

[coralway]

Gee - do you think that maybe, just maybe, the “elites” would like to reduce the more than 12,000 folks killed each year in auto accidents due to speeding? Or perhaps reduce the number of folks injured each year in auto crashes?

But, then again, we certainly don’t want the “elites” telling us what to do.

[MightyDog]

Originally Posted by coralway

Gee - do you think that maybe, just maybe, the “elites” would like to reduce the more than 12,000 folks killed each year in auto accidents due to speeding? Or perhaps reduce the number of folks injured each year in auto crashes?

But, then again, we certainly don’t want the “elites” telling us what to do.

The car / speeding bit was an analogy; it isn't the issue introduced for discussion. I agree that providing one that is rather off-topic is not helpful however, I still understood the point being made.

Of course, the elites want more and more control over the plebeians - there is a clear pattern of that. They also want more of our money - that is blindingly clear.

I have little doubt that CBDCs will come about at some point, probably by force. And, I have the same little doubt that people will not like that program once they understand it plus the limitations of it and the lack of anonymity.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Regarding speed limiters:

Some rental car agencies already put governors on their rental cars. When we were in Puerto Rico years ago on vacation we rented a car that wouldn't go more than 45mph. It was set up that way on purpose. Some rental agencies have devices on their rental cars that report to them whenever the customer exceeds a certain speed, or hits the brakes hard. So this isn't a new thing at all, it's already being done in the rental market.

As for me personally - I feel my safety is more important than your freedom. And your safety is more important than mine. Yes, my car CAN go over 100mph. But the top speed limit in Florida that I'm aware of is 70 on the turnpike. So if my car was no longer capable of speeds over 80mph, I'd be okay with it.

[Bill14564]

Speed limiters - bad idea due to being a safety risk
- Would encourage "foot-down" driving. If the car will limit the top speed then why not just put the pedal to the floor and let the car do the rest similar to how I drive my golf cart? It would effectively increase all speed limits by 10mph
- Would likely not pick up reduced-speed areas (work zones, school zones, variable speed zones). Could result in high speeds through dangerous areas.
- Could potentially pick up lower speed limits in error. My car reads signs to let me know what the speed limit is. It frequently picks up the signs for exit ramps and tells me that the limit is now 45mph rather than the 70mph I was traveling. If the vehicle also engaged the brakes to slow down to that incorrect speed it could cause an accident.
- Could limit options to emergency situations. Let's say I'm attempting to pass a car when suddenly an oncoming car appears (might have come around a curve, been hidden by an obstacle, rose out of a low area, maybe I just overlooked it). Depending on where I am in the pass, the right answer might be to accelerate to complete the pass and get out of the way. If the vehicle took away that option by preventing me from accelerating that would create the potential for an accident.

Central bank control of digital currency - Not sure if I care / living it now
- I use cash so infrequently now that I am effectively living in a cashless society already
- There are already restrictions on what I can purchase with a credit card - Marijuana products for example.
- Even cash is difficult to use for very high value exchanges.
- It's hard to be supportive of a concern that if cash goes away then people will have harder time conducting illegal activities.
- I feel like the focus should be on changing laws that restrict activities rather then ensuring there is a method to violate the laws


I am much more concerned about the slow whittling away of our freedoms happening now (restricted access to books, internet, high school and college courses, "public" information, speech, voting) than I am about a conspiracy about global elites taking away my ability to buy THC gummies.

[Topspinmo]

Paper money worthless anyway when just print train loads daily. digital will be same, only difference it will be totally controlled down to .o1 digit. Even coins are made mostly out of tin since 1965. Control has always been goal. The top 30 precent has the most to lose and they will be taking it in future.

We in villages have no clue how poor people really live so we can boost our nonsense like we know. Digital or not the hole has been dug too deep. We get what we sow and you know what I mean by that. None of us has been really hungry, but in future we might experience that and I’m not taking missing meal or two. Most can’t get through day without being high on something which alter mind to make rational decisions. Top it off we have bigger worries WW3 nearly upon us. But, not to worry the low end will only suffer at first.

[Topspinmo]

Originally Posted by coralway

Gee - do you think that maybe, just maybe, the “elites” would like to reduce the more than 12,000 folks killed each year in auto accidents due to speeding? Or perhaps reduce the number of folks injured each year in auto crashes?

But, then again, we certainly don’t want the “elites” telling us what to do.

They will only care when there are speed limits in sky. Elites don’t follow low class rules many examples have been shown over the years. Majority auto crashes don’t involve speeds way over speed limits. The ones that do majority are running from law or impaired on something.

[Pugchief]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

Speed limiters - bad idea due to being a safety risk
- Would encourage "foot-down" driving. If the car will limit the top speed then why not just put the pedal to the floor and let the car do the rest similar to how I drive my golf cart? It would effectively increase all speed limits by 10mph
- Would likely not pick up reduced-speed areas (work zones, school zones, variable speed zones). Could result in high speeds through dangerous areas.
- Could potentially pick up lower speed limits in error. My car reads signs to let me know what the speed limit is. It frequently picks up the signs for exit ramps and tells me that the limit is now 45mph rather than the 70mph I was traveling. If the vehicle also engaged the brakes to slow down to that incorrect speed it could cause an accident.
- Could limit options to emergency situations. Let's say I'm attempting to pass a car when suddenly an oncoming car appears (might have come around a curve, been hidden by an obstacle, rose out of a low area, maybe I just overlooked it). Depending on where I am in the pass, the right answer might be to accelerate to complete the pass and get out of the way. If the vehicle took away that option by preventing me from accelerating that would create the potential for an accident.

Central bank control of digital currency - Not sure if I care / living it now
- I use cash so infrequently now that I am effectively living in a cashless society already
- There are already restrictions on what I can purchase with a credit card - Marijuana products for example.
- Even cash is difficult to use for very high value exchanges.
- It's hard to be supportive of a concern that if cash goes away then people will have harder time conducting illegal activities.
- I feel like the focus should be on changing laws that restrict activities rather then ensuring there is a method to violate the laws


I am much more concerned about the slow whittling away of our freedoms happening now (restricted access to books, internet, high school and college courses, "public" information, speech, voting) than I am about a conspiracy about global elites taking away my ability to buy THC gummies.

I really like your analysis on the speed thing. It's very well thought out, and it points out some of the unintended consequences of the idea, including not only defeating the stated purpose, but actually exacerbating it.

I wish you could use the same critical analysis of what the unintended consequences of CBDC might be. No one cares about THC gummies. Did you think what Canada did to the truckers (de-banking) was acceptable? The Canadian courts ruled last week that the measures taken were unconstitutional. Yay, but that doesn't make the situation the truckers were put in at the time any less difficult.

Yes, we are mostly cashless already, and yes it would help prevent scammers of the tax system and other illegal activity. The issue is complete control over your ability to spend as you see fit (legally, of course) and bank where you choose.

[Pugchief]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

Regarding speed limiters:

As for me personally - I feel my safety is more important than your freedom.

Ya, how well did that philosophy work out with covid?

[CoachKandSportsguy]

So is the conceptual goal to force compliance versus punish violators?

Both require surveillance, one depends upon technology the other people. This appears to be an extension of technology use for labor reduction in the corporate world to the reduction of labor in the surveillance world, to force compliance.

The US legal system of innocent until proven guilty is a reactionary process, where forced compliance is a proactive process. The issue which many "proactive compliance dupes" forget is that all technology is crackable, by passable, and the attempts will again fail after a few years.

These attempts of control of the masses is how largely autocratic societies run by plutocrats come about. And many times, these are the seeds of proletariat revolution if you read enough history to understand human behaviors.

Right now, the marginal sociopaths / grifters / global technologists have gained a majority in large decision making positions. . and who knows how this situation will play out in the end. . whenever that end will be. .

good luck to us. . i fear it will get a lot worse before it gets better. .

[Pugchief]

Originally Posted by CoachKandSportsguy

So is the conceptual goal to force compliance versus punish violators? YES

These attempts of control of the masses is how largely autocratic societies run by plutocrats come about. YES

Right now, the marginal sociopaths / grifters / global technologists have gained a majority in large decision making positions. . and who knows how this situation will play out in the end. . whenever that end will be. . CORRECT

I fear it will get a lot worse before it gets better. Sadly, probably also correct.

Somebody gets it.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by JRcorvette

The Government wants to control everything about your life… Your money… Your health… Your mode of transportation… Perhaps one day your Religion…. You need to take a stand now not later.

Your childrens' education. Your bedroom. Your outfit. Your wife's womb.

Ship = sailed

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by Pugchief

Ya, how well did that philosophy work out with covid?

It worked great for me. I wore a mask, social distanced, washed my hands, and got vaccinated when the vaccine became available to me. I was able to do all the things I needed to do, and most of the things I wanted to do, while some people were dying or laid up being horribly ill, or isolated completely because their loved ones were sick and they weren't allowed in the same room.