[Stu from NYC]

This trade war was a long time coming. We do need to balance our foreign trade stop allowing other countries to take advantage of us

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by Stu from NYC

This trade war was a long time coming. We do need to balance our foreign trade stop allowing other countries to take advantage of us

"take advantage of" == "sell products at prices US consumers want to pay"

"Stop allowing other countries to take advantage of us" ->
"Stop allowing other countries to sell products at prices US consumers want to pay"

[fdpaq0580]

Originally Posted by kkingston57

Problem is that if and when US stops buying Chinese made products stores like Walmart can take over the spaces left by Dollar Store Dollar General Just bought a new thermometer for my American made Weber grill. Two choice a Weber branded thermometer and a non branded thermometer, both made in (guess where)

Let me guess. The penguin island! Good you got them before the tariff causes the price to go up.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by bopat

FTFY: "KEY POINT: This marks week one of the U.S. finally responding to China's ongoing trade war, with Boeing deliveries scheduled over the next two years. Much could shift in that timeframe."

China started muscling in on U.S. manufacturing back in the ‘80s, waving cheap labor like a carrot to snatch American factories. Come the ‘90s, with trade deals greased and China crashing the WTO in 2000, they hit the gas—sucking up jobs and swiping our tech through slick business deals. A million U.S. factory jobs got wiped out by 2007 while China’s plants churned. That’s when they dug their claws in, and we’re still feeling the sting.

In the 80s US companies went to China to get cheap labor AND US companies wanted to get away from UNIONS. So, that made the US middle class weaker and poorer. What fine PATRIOTS they are.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by Ralph Cramdon

It’s fascinating how often people blame China for the loss of U.S. jobs, rather than the companies that chose to move operations there in pursuit of higher profits.

Exactly.

[tophcfa]

Originally Posted by Ralph Cramdon

It’s fascinating how often people blame China for the loss of U.S. jobs, rather than the companies that chose to move operations there in pursuit of higher profits.

Do you blame the companies for moving in pursuit of higher profits, or the laws and regulations that prohibit the companies from making the same profits operating domestically?

[Topspinmo]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

"take advantage of" == "sell products at prices US consumers want to pay"

"Stop allowing other countries to take advantage of us" ->
"Stop allowing other countries to sell products at prices US consumers want to pay"

So, why do they tariff our products? I consider tariff manipulation of market where is’t not free trade it’s unbalanced trade which mean it’s unfair trade. Only fair trade is zero tariff and zero trumped up taxes on imports. Time world gets in balance, USA has carried world long enough. What did we get for it. Cheated.

[Pugchief]

Originally Posted by tophcfa

Do you blame the companies for moving in pursuit of higher profits, or the laws and regulations that prohibit the companies from making the same profits operating domestically?

Boom.
Just like how health care was destroyed as I pointed out in the other thread.

[Topspinmo]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

In the 80s US companies went to China to get cheap labor AND US companies wanted to get away from UNIONS. So, that made the US middle class weaker and poorer. What fine PATRIOTS they are.

IMO it started long before 80’s. In 60’s when metric hardware was allowed. It snowballed from then.

[Topspinmo]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

Exactly.

No I blame our government for letting it happened.

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by Topspinmo

So, why do they tariff out products? I consider tariff manipulation of market where is’t not free trade it’s unbalanced trade which mean it’s unfair trade. Only fair trade is zero tariff and zero trumped up taxes on imports. Time world gets in balance, USA has carried world long enough. What did we get for it. Cheated.

You seem to be confusing a few different concepts.

- Zero tariffs would be nice. There might be a good reason to have a specific, non-zero tariff but that would be on a case-by-case basis

- A trade imbalance can be an indication of supply and demand, not unfair practices. The US will ALWAYS have trade imbalance on bananas and will ALWAYS have a trade imbalance with Lesotho. The former is because the US does not grow bananas (at least not in quantity) so we will always import more than we export. The latter is because Lesotho is a particularly poor country that exports diamonds and there is no way that they will ever import as much product from the US as they export diamonds to us.

- By "trumped up taxes" do you mean the current criticism of VAT? If products manufactured in their country are charged a VAT when sold then how is it a "trumped up tax" if products imported to their country are charged the same tax? Should a country only tax only homegrown products and not imports? Does it feel like a "trumped up tax" when Florida charges sales tax on imported products? Should Florida only charge sales tax on US-made products and not imported products?

- How is the US "carrying the world?" The US Govt isn't spending a lot of money on bananas or diamonds or iPhones or imported autos, the US citizen consumer is. How does my buying an iPhone translate to the US Govt carrying the world?

If there are unreasonable barriers to trade then absolutely, fix those. A disparity in wealth or in population (there are more of us to buy things) or a higher standard of living (our wage rate is higher and taxes are lower) are not trade barriers that should be defeated, they are successes that should be celebrated.

[Normal]

Originally Posted by jimjamuser

In the 80s US companies went to China to get cheap labor AND US companies wanted to get away from UNIONS. So, that made the US middle class weaker and poorer. What fine PATRIOTS they are.

Yes, it is time to correct this. You can’t keep kicking the can down the road for the next guy. We might as well go all-in to get er done.

[bopat]

In today's conversations about manufacturing and innovation, a crucial aspect often gets overlooked: the importance of quality products. We can learn from the past when toys, tools, furniture, and kitchenware were crafted with care and durability, often becoming family heirlooms passed down through generations.

Compare the timeless reliability of classic Craftsman tools to modern alternatives like Harbor Freight's affordable yet ephemeral hand tools, which may not
survive a single project.

And let's not forget computer and phone software - in an earlier era, programs were efficient, reliable, and built to last. Now, rebooting is often the
go-to solution, with little regard for whether it actually solves the problem.

I'm nostalgic for the days when American engineering, manufacturing expertise, and commitment to quality products brought jobs and prosperity to our great nation. It's time to bring those values back, create new opportunities, and let other countries focus on their goals.

If China feels they'll be better served without Boeing, so be it. But part of that solution is for Boeing to stop outsourcing and get their process under control.

[Topspinmo]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

You seem to be confusing a few different concepts.

- Zero tariffs would be nice. There might be a good reason to have a specific, non-zero tariff but that would be on a case-by-case basis

- A trade imbalance can be an indication of supply and demand, not unfair practices. The US will ALWAYS have trade imbalance on bananas and will ALWAYS have a trade imbalance with Lesotho. The former is because the US does not grow bananas (at least not in quantity) so we will always import more than we export. The latter is because Lesotho is a particularly poor country that exports diamonds and there is no way that they will ever import as much product from the US as they export diamonds to us.

- By "trumped up taxes" do you mean the current criticism of VAT? If products manufactured in their country are charged a VAT when sold then how is it a "trumped up tax" if products imported to their country are charged the same tax? Should a country only tax only homegrown products and not imports? Does it feel like a "trumped up tax" when Florida charges sales tax on imported products? Should Florida only charge sales tax on US-made products and not imported products?

- How is the US "carrying the world?" The US Govt isn't spending a lot of money on bananas or diamonds or iPhones or imported autos, the US citizen consumer is. How does my buying an iPhone translate to the US Govt carrying the world?

If there are unreasonable barriers to trade then absolutely, fix those. A disparity in wealth or in population (there are more of us to buy things) or a higher standard of living (our wage rate is higher and taxes are lower) are not trade barriers that should be defeated, they are successes that should be celebrated.

Didn’t England pull out of euro? I wonder why?

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by Topspinmo

Didn’t England pull out of euro? I wonder why?

For the same reason the dodo went extinct?