[tucson]

Originally Posted by Villages PL

The fact that a topic has the potential to be political doesn't necessarily make it political. Imagining the poster's intentions to be political, for example, doesn't necessarily make his or her statements political.

If I say, "I'm happy for George Zimmerman." That statement is not political but you certainly could read a lot into it. The fact that you read a certain meaning into a statement -a meaning that was not expressed- is not the fault of the poster.

Peace.

Great post !

[JB in TV]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

I was very much not into the political forum because at that time it was dominated by a couple of really strong personalities that bashed and beat up people verbally. At least that is how it appeared to me.

In the last week the climate of our entire country has changed in a not good way and for the first time in my life I am mad about the race issue. I always thought I was fair and kind of open minded. Last night Piers Morgan made me so upset that I could hardly sleep.

I think these discussions have been therapeutic to all of us and I am very pleased about the way most posters have presented their views and I admit I have had my opinions changed some due to their articulate presentations.

We need somehow to help each other through this time that appears to be the threshold of something awful.

Gracie! Thank you! Once again you are the voice of reason!

I think your post hits the nail on the head on why I felt the need to reach out to my friends on the forum by starting this discussion. I also believe that the climate of our country has changed in the last week, and we may be on the threshold of something awful. Apparently, we are not alone in that thought... I haven't slept well in several days.

That may be the reason there have been so many threads and so much discussion on TOTV relating to the recent trial and assorted issues. People need to discuss with friends what is happening. Other viewpoints often help us deal with our emotions. These kinds of issues seem to divide our citizenry, not unlike political issues. Thanks to Village PL, I now agree that the author of the posts are not making it political, perhaps it's the reader (me!) who read them that way.

And thank you all, friends, who have taken the time to calmly and eloquently discuss the issues... it really helps those of us who are having a hard time with this.

[yabbadu]

Politics s/b put under a heading marked political and in this way those who are interested will read them and those who are not will bypass such subjects.!

[eweissenbach]

Originally Posted by JB in TV

That may be the reason there have been so many threads and so much discussion on TOTV relating to the recent trial and assorted issues. People need to discuss with friends what is happening. Other viewpoints often help us deal with our emotions. These kinds of issues seem to divide our citizenry, not unlike political issues. Thanks to Village PL, I now agree that the author of the posts are not making it political, perhaps it's the reader (me!) who read them that way.

And thank you all, friends, who have taken the time to calmly and eloquently discuss the issues... it really helps those of us who are having a hard time with this.

Oh wouldst it were that simple. Seems to me that the majority of people today are so politically and ideologically polarized that a discussion of controversial issues among friends may quickly turn ugly and fracture relationships. I am neither a right or left winger, but when I post something on Facebook regarding a current event, I generally get attacked by one wing or the other, depending on the side of the issue I take, and these are my Facebook "friends". In fact you often get attacked for even saying that you are independent or that people should listen to opposing points of view, charging you with being wishy washy, or having no ideals. I was taught that a person should listen to all points of view and discuss your differences rationally, and that changing one's position based on new and compelling information was a sign of wisdom. One problem we currently have is the overwhelming amount of vitriolic and inflammatory language from the talking heads on TV and radio. Limbaugh, Sharpton, Coulter, Schultz, and the rest are becoming wealthy by making people believe the other point of view is dangerous and evil.

[Golfingnut]

Originally Posted by eweissenbach

Oh wouldst it were that simple. Seems to me that the majority of people today are so politically and ideologically polarized that a discussion of controversial issues among friends may quickly turn ugly and fracture relationships. I am neither a right or left winger, but when I post something on Facebook regarding a current event, I generally get attacked by one wing or the other, depending on the side of the issue I take, and these are my Facebook "friends". In fact you often get attacked for even saying that you are independent or that people should listen to opposing points of view, charging you with being wishy washy, or having no ideals. I was taught that a person should listen to all points of view and discuss your differences rationally, and that changing one's position based on new and compelling information was a sign of wisdom. One problem we currently have is the overwhelming amount of vitriolic and inflammatory language from the talking heads on TV and radio. Limbaugh, Sharpton, Coulter, Schultz, and the rest are becoming wealthy by making people believe the other point of view is dangerous and evil.

[rubicon]

Both zonerboy, GG and btk make sense.

In my view the political forum provided an opportunity to express oneself. However like both political parties a few pirated the forum and worse yet made it too personal. so as zonerboy aptly states why would an advertiser stand still for it.

On the other hand as you view the threads most readers gravitate toward the Zimmerman like threads. Now if only we can keep the fringe people out we can have a decent dialogue. How long will each thread last...well in my view they eventually extinguish themselves

When in the corporate world people employees would complain that so and so was wrong because.....my suggestion was to not attacked the person but to address the grievance as to what effect it would have on a department, etc...in other words keep it businesslike. So too with political issues keep them in the context as what benefit or concern it would have on the country, its citizens, etc

[lightworker888]

I don't know how wise it is to believe that we are on the threshold of something awful. That will set you up to filter for proof of that and to filter what comes across your plate in that way. In fact it is my belief that EVERYTHING is going on "out there" both good and bad in equal balance. If you are getting all your info from media sources that have any form of "agenda" then you will certainly get a biased view and it will be your choice as to which biased view you wish to watch. Most people like to watch and read things that support their own views, so from my perspective, there is very little in public media that resonates with me and I choose not to watch much or to read the daily papers.

I do hear about what is going on in the news snippets that are on the radio, but I realize that there is so much more going on that we never hear about. Many moons ago, I heard a lecturer say that "the light" doesn't have a newspaper or a radio or TV station. and that thought has always helped me to maintain some perspective on the "news" that I hear or read. There is so much good going on and so much awakening of consciousness that I am looking forward to seeing how it will affect all of us. If we could keep our minds open and receptive to change and expansion, without holding on to our old ways of seeing things, usually out of fear, that are limiting, then we could more easily embrace the changes that are going on.

Life is grey and there is no real black and white in any situation, and I have learned that when I can't see any other side to a situation than my own, then I don't have enough information. I really believe that each person is speaking "his truth" even when it is not my truth, and as one of my trainers suggested, the question really is "what does he have to believe in order to come to that conclusion?" And then it becomes my job to get more info so that I can really see it from the other person's perspective, not just from what I think is the other person's perspective.

And of course, anyone who can't see my perspective must be blind!!!! LOL

LW888

[eweissenbach]

Originally Posted by lightworker888

I don't know how wise it is to believe that we are on the threshold of something awful. That will set you up to filter for proof of that and to filter what comes across your plate in that way. In fact it is my belief that EVERYTHING is going on "out there" both good and bad in equal balance. If you are getting all your info from media sources that have any form of "agenda" then you will certainly get a biased view and it will be your choice as to which biased view you wish to watch. Most people like to watch and read things that support their own views, so from my perspective, there is very little in public media that resonates with me and I choose not to watch much or to read the daily papers.

I do hear about what is going on in the news snippets that are on the radio, but I realize that there is so much more going on that we never hear about. Many moons ago, I heard a lecturer say that "the light" doesn't have a newspaper or a radio or TV station. and that thought has always helped me to maintain some perspective on the "news" that I hear or read. There is so much good going on and so much awakening of consciousness that I am looking forward to seeing how it will affect all of us. If we could keep our minds open and receptive to change and expansion, without holding on to our old ways of seeing things, usually out of fear, that are limiting, then we could more easily embrace the changes that are going on.

Life is grey and there is no real black and white in any situation, and I have learned that when I can't see any other side to a situation than my own, then I don't have enough information. I really believe that each person is speaking "his truth" even when it is not my truth, and as one of my trainers suggested, the question really is "what does he have to believe in order to come to that conclusion?" And then it becomes my job to get more info so that I can really see it from the other person's perspective, not just from what I think is the other person's perspective.

And of course, anyone who can't see my perspective must be blind!!!! LOL

LW888

Smart post

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by lightworker888

I don't know how wise it is to believe that we are on the threshold of something awful. That will set you up to filter for proof of that and to filter what comes across your plate in that way. In fact it is my belief that EVERYTHING is going on "out there" both good and bad in equal balance. If you are getting all your info from media sources that have any form of "agenda" then you will certainly get a biased view and it will be your choice as to which biased view you wish to watch. Most people like to watch and read things that support their own views, so from my perspective, there is very little in public media that resonates with me and I choose not to watch much or to read the daily papers.

I do hear about what is going on in the news snippets that are on the radio, but I realize that there is so much more going on that we never hear about. Many moons ago, I heard a lecturer say that "the light" doesn't have a newspaper or a radio or TV station. and that thought has always helped me to maintain some perspective on the "news" that I hear or read. There is so much good going on and so much awakening of consciousness that I am looking forward to seeing how it will affect all of us. If we could keep our minds open and receptive to change and expansion, without holding on to our old ways of seeing things, usually out of fear, that are limiting, then we could more easily embrace the changes that are going on.

Life is grey and there is no real black and white in any situation, and I have learned that when I can't see any other side to a situation than my own, then I don't have enough information. I really believe that each person is speaking "his truth" even when it is not my truth, and as one of my trainers suggested, the question really is "what does he have to believe in order to come to that conclusion?" And then it becomes my job to get more info so that I can really see it from the other person's perspective, not just from what I think is the other person's perspective.

And of course, anyone who can't see my perspective must be blind!!!! LOL

LW888

EXCELLENT post. I wish I could write as well as you, but just to add...

Of import in this day and age is to be able to recognize that ALL media or information givers have a bias....know it, be aware of it, and insure you take info from all bias's !!!

[Indydealmaker]

Political forums are pointless.

They consist of two or more opposing sides, each preaching to their own choirs. There are never converts from the forum postulating.

However, there are overflows of ill will that infect the rest of the forum community.

If someone feels that the Political Forum Vacuum is indicative of an unfulfilled need, then start one unrelated to the TOTV. Buy the software and go to it!

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by Indydealmaker

Political forums are pointless.

They consist of two or more opposing sides, each preaching to their own choirs. There are never converts from the forum postulating.

However, there are overflows of ill will that infect the rest of the forum community.

If someone feels that the Political Forum Vacuum is indicative of an unfulfilled need, then start one unrelated to the TOTV. Buy the software and go to it!

Always the bottom line and the voice of reason.

You are so right Steve.

[Jim&Fran]

Originally Posted by coralway

If a particular thread topic does not appeal to you - skip it.

Bingo!!!! Wow, what a great concept...... Turn the knob on the radio if the music bothers you..... Hmmmm... Let's see... Do I watch Fox News or MSNBC?
Facts are facts.... But in this case I think I'll just tune in to the
"proper etiquette when entering a traffic circle off of Buena Vista" for the 99th time here in TOTV.
Geesh people, the National reprocusions of the Zimmerman case are not going away anytime soon. In fact as Gomer Pyle said one day..

"SURPRISE, SURPRISE, SURPRISE"

If and when some of you remove your head from the sand or some other dark place you may be surprised to know others are fighting for your rights too.

KNOCK KNOCK,
WHO'S THERE?
THE GOVERNMENT,
THE GOVERNMENT WHO?
( you fill in the next line)

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

Always the bottom line and the voice of reason.

You are so right Steve.

I do not agree with either of you.

I learned a lot on the old political forum...From those who did not preach but read and used FACTS, not emotion to talk about issues.

We had/have a fellow who knows banking, which I have no clue about.....learned a ton from him...changed my viewpoint on a few things also.

That story could apply to any number of posters that I learned so much from.

No.....problem is the posters. Using fictious names.....having an agenda to do nothing but what I guess is called flaming...nothing more. Ignoring or not listening to anything that is said from any side of an issue, and especially ignoring ISSUES. I had strong feelings on candidates recently but that does not mean they were bad people...does not mean anything but I disagreed with their policies.

Second issue was what this does to the administrators who try to keep it civil. I would prefer a political forum with ONE STRIKE and you are out. Make the rules clear and if you violate them...good bye. There are forums out there like that and there are forums that make our old political forum look like a church picnic.

But I miss the viewpoint of people.....their input...great learning experience.

[Golfingnut]

Originally Posted by lightworker888

I don't know how wise it is to believe that we are on the threshold of something awful. That will set you up to filter for proof of that and to filter what comes across your plate in that way. In fact it is my belief that EVERYTHING is going on "out there" both good and bad in equal balance. If you are getting all your info from media sources that have any form of "agenda" then you will certainly get a biased view and it will be your choice as to which biased view you wish to watch. Most people like to watch and read things that support their own views, so from my perspective, there is very little in public media that resonates with me and I choose not to watch much or to read the daily papers.

I do hear about what is going on in the news snippets that are on the radio, but I realize that there is so much more going on that we never hear about. Many moons ago, I heard a lecturer say that "the light" doesn't have a newspaper or a radio or TV station. and that thought has always helped me to maintain some perspective on the "news" that I hear or read. There is so much good going on and so much awakening of consciousness that I am looking forward to seeing how it will affect all of us. If we could keep our minds open and receptive to change and expansion, without holding on to our old ways of seeing things, usually out of fear, that are limiting, then we could more easily embrace the changes that are going on.

Life is grey and there is no real black and white in any situation, and I have learned that when I can't see any other side to a situation than my own, then I don't have enough information. I really believe that each person is speaking "his truth" even when it is not my truth, and as one of my trainers suggested, the question really is "what does he have to believe in order to come to that conclusion?" And then it becomes my job to get more info so that I can really see it from the other person's perspective, not just from what I think is the other person's perspective.

And of course, anyone who can't see my perspective must be blind!!!! LOL

LW888

you put this entire thread back on track and should help some understand. Differing opinions must be heard and not simply dismissed. Admin is keeping this thread on track so individual expressions of what should or should not be allowed is a waste of bandwidth. One lady on here asked for more dialogue with members from a more diverse social background. I thought that was a great idea and insightful yet it was dismissed as being wrong. I sometimes think we have members that do not wish to debate or discuss anything not 100% in line with their way of thinking. That will not help any of us down the road. This site should not be a single path, but rather a multi lane highway running in all directions. Good morning to all and have a wonderful day.
Your neighbor
Golfingnut

[DougB]

Sometimes it hits a few roundabouts