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-   The Villages, Florida, Non Villages Discussion (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-non-villages-discussion-93/)
-   -   Law to Stop Video of Police Abuse (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-non-villages-discussion-93/law-stop-video-police-abuse-318942/)

ithos 04-25-2021 06:22 AM
Regarding the obligation of rendering medical aid by the police, it is interesting to note that even the paramedics refused to do so at the scene.

Bravinder said a crowd of people had gathered on the sidewalk and they appeared very “upset” and were yelling.

"We wanted to get away from that" because trying to resuscitate someone can be difficult and requires focus, he said.

Bravinder parked the ambulance about two blocks away. Once in back of the ambulance, he saw the cardiac monitor showing a flat line – indicating no heart activity.

tvbound 04-25-2021 06:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueash (Post 1934556)
Gracie, you know the context of my statement that Mr Floyd's history does not matter, and you KNOW I meant in context to Chauvin's actions.

If, as a father, he came to pick up my daughter for a date, and I knew his history I still don't have a right to kill him. If I am hiring a contractor and he bids on it and I learn his history, I don't have a right to kill him. If I live in a "safe" neighborhood and he is walking down the street wearing a sign that says "I AM A DRUG USING CRIMINAL" I don't have a right to kill him.

Is this sinking in yet? His past history does not impact how Chauvin's nine minutes on his neck are judged. I know, big scary Black man right? It does not matter. Neither you, nor I, nor convicted murderer Chauvin have the right to kill him.
"Is this sinking in yet? His past history does not impact how Chauvin's nine minutes on his neck are judged. I know, big scary Black man right? It does not matter. Neither you, nor I, nor convicted murderer Chauvin have the right to kill him."

For all too many, it will never sink in that a cop who has no idea at the time of a person's previous history, of whom are unarmed and that they have completely under control, doesn't give them the right to murder them. The attempt to justify Chauvin having the authority to act as judge, jury and executioner, is primarily driven as you stated because he was "a big scary black man." The "Chauvin probably killed him, BUT he had it coming" crowd - is pretty sickening.

tvbound 04-25-2021 06:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by graciegirl (Post 1934573)
Sir/Madam. It is apparent that YOU are part of a large demographic that seems to walk in lock-step as well. Watch your thinking. It is bigoted to think of groups as all thinking alike. For instance;.... Many people think of a group that does not get vaccinated against Covid-19. Sumter county who is largely from that group .... has the highest vaccination percentage of all of the counties in Florida.
"Watch your thinking."

"Watch my thinking?" My thinking is that there are a lot of people, whether they mean to or not, are showing their true colors when it comes to racism and bigotry. I choose to research and make up my own mind and have never needed to try and join any particular group, just to feel like I belong, nor do I change the subject or use examples that are not germane to the discussion at hand.

kenoc7 04-25-2021 06:45 AM
Gracie, you have many irrelevant pieces of information. Putting his knee on Floyd's neck for 9 minutes and 29 seconds including 3 minutes after he was non-responsive wasn't necessary restraint, it was murder. Period.

tvbound 04-25-2021 06:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenoc7 (Post 1934776)
Gracie, you have many irrelevant pieces of information. Putting his knee on Floyd's neck for 9 minutes and 29 seconds including 3 minutes after he was non-responsive wasn't necessary restraint, it was murder. Period.
No question about it. And trying to justify the murder after the fact, is disgusting. Period.

GrumpyOldMan 04-25-2021 06:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by J1ceasar (Post 1934749)
There are about 18,000 deaths of blacks by blacks yearly . About 250 by police . If I was black, I'd worry alot more about my friends
Seriously? What do the two have to do with each other? If something is a crime should we decide the seriousness of the crime based on other crimes?

holmesperdue 04-25-2021 06:59 AM
Way back, in the late sixties, I had the privilege of attenditang the US Army CID school. Of all the things that we learned was simply: if you took someone into custody you became responsible for their well being. It really is just that simple...

baramu 04-25-2021 07:35 AM
George Floyd died a herendous death at the hands of an evil cop. Sure, he did not have a stellar history but a lot of people don’t. Along with shooting people for protesting, all of this smacks of a totalitarian government. I suggest if anyone believes these laws are okay, see if there’s a plane to Russia and just get out. I prefer democracy which is slowly slipping away. Traitors in our government and traitors in our people.

diva1 04-25-2021 07:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by graciegirl (Post 1934563)
I will count you as such.

I will also say that what he had done previously does matter. When someone says "He is a known felon" that does sway the opinion of most people. DEREK CHAUVIN may have not been a great cop, in fact may have been a lousy police officer, but he did not deliberately aim to kill the man. He was trying to restrain him. He was trying to restrain him. George Floyd would be alive today in a cell somewhere, if he had sit when he was told to SIT.

WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE DONE EXACTLY, in that situation if it was you and George Floyd, Bill???????????? Pretend he is white. Pretend he is Asian. Pretend he is Australian Aboriginal. Pretend he is a Pacific Islander. I don't see race as a factor here. But maybe YOU do???
Obviously, nothing will change your mind. I've got that. But Chauvin was not 'trying to restrain him' for 9 minutes. Not for 8 minutes. Or maybe 7. He was murdering him at that point. Period.

Chitown 04-25-2021 08:13 AM
Not excusing the behavior of a few police officers, anyone interested in becoming a police officer today needs to have their heads examined. If I was already a police officer today I would answer my mandatory 911 calls dispatched to me and nothing else. No traffic stops, no issuing traffic citations, no stopping citizens, no interaction with the public at all. Maybe, just maybe you might make it to retirement.

spjvette 04-25-2021 08:23 AM
And how many police take downs of Criminals do you think would actually be shown to the public? Especially if they were done by the book. It’s not news to show good police action.

joseppe 04-25-2021 08:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueash (Post 1934473)
This law will only protect law enforcement. If you are a private citizen who misbehaves in a public park, saying yelling at a Black family for playing music too loud.. Your behavior can be recorded and posted on the internet. Or you are shopping at Walmart in your curlers or revealing clothes, there is a whole genre of online posting of those people. No protecting for your face or body from this legislation.

If you are a firefighter, no protection. If you are a paramedic, no protection. What is there about police that they need special protection against being caused emotional distress when their actions are exposed to the public? Don't want to be embarrassed? Don't do something that will reflect badly on you. Simple. This is a radical knee jerk reaction to an evil cop getting caught by the public. We need more of that, not less.
Maybe because the Cop's job is to interact with Violent perpetrators of crimes. None of the others have the job of having to arrest or restrain another human being. As yourself how you would have done your job if you would have been the one responsible for restraining and arresting George Floyd or some other violent person hopped up on drugs.

What did you do for a living before you retired? If you made a mistake in your job were you subject to criminal prosecution? Why aren't the people behind the cameras stepping up and showing us how Policing should be done?

Dr Winston O Boogie jr 04-25-2021 08:28 AM
Video from one angle does not always show what really happened. Videos can also be doctored to promote a certain viewpoint. I see nothing wring with prohibiting people from posting video of police actions online. Video shot of police doing their jobs can and should be given to the D.A.'s office if the person that shot the video believes that there was something wrong with the officer's actions.

Posting a video online only serves to give a lot of people part of the information while holding back what could be a lot of factors. All it does is to get people riled up and create a more divisive society.

Let the various government law enforcement agencies decide what is relevant and what may not be.

The problem now is that police are being tried in the court of public opinion before a court or jury can look at all of the evidence.

We just had an example of this in the case in Columbus, Ohio where the officer shot the teenage girl that was about to stab another teenage girl with a knife.

Instead of headlines that say, "Officer saves girl's life by shooting knife wielding attacker" we have immediate protests, celebrities making threatening quotes and the one that was shot being referred to as the victim as opposed to what she really was, the perpetrator.

Don't stop anyone from shooting video of anything that is out in public for people to see. But stop them from posting police actions online and give the video to the authorities.

DougandLaddi 04-25-2021 08:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by graciegirl (Post 1934563)
I will count you as such.

I will also say that what he had done previously does matter. When someone says "He is a known felon" that does sway the opinion of most people. DEREK CHAUVIN may have not been a great cop, in fact may have been a lousy police officer, but he did not deliberately aim to kill the man. He was trying to restrain him. He was trying to restrain him. George Floyd would be alive today in a cell somewhere, if he had sit when he was told to SIT.

WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE DONE EXACTLY, in that situation if it was you and George Floyd, Bill???????????? Pretend he is white. Pretend he is Asian. Pretend he is Australian Aboriginal. Pretend he is a Pacific Islander. I don't see race as a factor here. But maybe YOU do???
I agree 100%, his past was a huge factor in the strong use of force, if cops can not ratchet up force when merited they will be the looser far too often. Chauvin may not have been the best but few are perfect as they are human and cops need the backing required to do their job without risk of persecution like this. Bad cops get ferreted out by internal affairs all the time and the system works for the most part. I don't believe George Floyds skin color was a significant factor other than the drastic treatment Derek Chauvin got in the press to drive this terrible over reach. If G. Floyd was white there would not even be a story so which color of skin is likely over or under represented.

DAVES 04-25-2021 08:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueash (Post 1934455)
Chauvin sits in jail now, not because of citizen complaints, not because of his own body camera, not because his peers reported his behavior. He is only in jail because of the video taken by a teenager who then posted her video on the internet. The Federal Courts have held that police could not prohibit citizens from filming their behavior. It had been common for police to seize cameras back in the good old days. This protected right to film in public is actually is new, only in the last 15 years.

In response to this ability to hold bad cops responsible for bad behavior, the Oklahoma legislature is in the process of finalizing a law that will make it illegal to put a video of a cop online if it might make him really unhappy or cost him his job.
The law is supposedly to prevent doxing. No problem with that as a goal. But then it sneaks a couple extra lines into the language. You can read the bill HERE

It is very short. It prohibits web publication if such would


Clearly if a video like that of Chauvin were made in Oklahoma after this passes, the person who shot the video, Darnella Frazier, would be charged. Chauvin and his family certainly suffered emotional distress and financial loss.

You say I must be making this up. Read the bill. It prohibits publication of



Under this law if your video or still photo showed the name of the cop, his name tag, you are in violation. If it shows what police department he works for, you are in violation, if it shows his face you are in violation. Who is pushing this agenda? Why are the members of the Oklahoma legislature putting this through? Lines A, G, and I have only one goal, preventing the public from being able to police bad police.

If you want to prevent doxing, get rid of several of these items. Many on this forum have suggested that no one wants to protect the bad cops. Apparently a lot of people in Oklahoma have no problem with a law that will do just that, until of course the courts overturn this attempt to punish the public for providing documentation of those cops.
We seek, we demand perfection. Unfortunately perfection does not and cannot exist.

I do not have answers only questions based in reality. "No one wants to protect bad cops." What does that mean? When I was working, while I was responsible, dedicated, etc etc etc an mistake was in dollars and cents and I could or would correct almost all of them-even if it cost me money.

A cop is far different. A mistake made in a tenth of a second can cost someone their life. They do not know what they are walking into. They are regularly offered bribes everything from a free doughnut to sex, drugs and cash.

Our athletes, etc. We know that some of them fall prey to vice. Reality, perhaps, like cops, we only know a small part of what goes on.

I do not have solutions. Like most things the only real choice is to do the best we can.


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