Originally Posted by Sandtrap328

BFD

Your Antifa crap was not heard of until last week.
Your president (not mine) represents all that Adolf Hitler represented in 1933. Read your history books, Mr. Former Policeman.
Once again, BFD.

Your disrespect of a man who served our country in so many ways says everything we need to know about you.


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Originally Posted by Guest

Your disrespect of a man who served our country in so many ways says everything we need to know about you.


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Such a stupid stupid post. I know of many folks on here who have served far and wide, over and beyond. They just dont share it with you, and they, in some cases were drummed off this forum by people like you

Had to come back to add. Back a few years with the older political forum, we had a poster who was heavily decorated war hero from Vietnam. He never talked about it, but he and I shared a coffee at Starbucks one day, and found he served with a very good buddy of mine (a medic with a few medals himself). I mentioned him to my buddy in an email and he shared that this guy was a true hero, but never did anyone know that on the forum, and he had chances in discussions to bring it in, but never did.

Point is, everyone should respect Carl's service, but many on this forum have given more than you know.. disagreeing with someone and pointing out errors made is NOT disrespect, and Carl would be the first to tell you he deserves nor more respect on here than anyone. Judge on words and truth.

On the thread subject....our President tweeted this today about the situation in Boston...


"Looks like many anti-police agitators in Boston. Police are looking tough and smart! Thank you."

Does anyone have information as to what he is talking about ?

Who was anti police and how was that shown ?

This was a tweet from a reporter there...

"Just spoke with Boston Police Commissioner William Evans. He says things are going really well."

Leadership ?

Originally Posted by Guest

Just a bit of a different perspective on WHY they are there. Does not seem to be a protest against, as you say "object to the free speech provision.."

From the Boston newspaper...sorry, you were not covered..
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BOSTON -- Thousands of left-leaning counter-protesters marched through downtown Boston on Saturday, chanting anti-Nazi slogans and waving signs condemning white nationalism ahead of a rally being staged by conservative activists, just a week after a Virginia demonstration turned deadly.

Police Commissioner William Evans said Friday that 500 officers -- some in uniform, others undercover -- would be deployed to keep the two groups apart on Saturday. Boston's Democratic mayor, Marty Walsh, and Massachusetts' Republican governor, Charlie Baker, both warned that extremist unrest wouldn't be tolerated in this city famed as the cradle of American liberty.

Walsh said at a news conference Friday that the city has spoken to the Southern Poverty Law Center, which provided guidance on how to handle conflicts with white supremacists, CBS Boston reported.

Organizers of the midday event, billed as a "Free Speech Rally," have publicly distanced themselves from the neo-Nazis, white supremacists and others who fomented violence in Charlottesville on Aug. 12. A woman was killed at that Unite the Right rally, and scores of others were injured, when a car plowed into counter-demonstrators.

Police confined the "Free Speech" rally to the Parkman Bandstand on Boston Common as they blocked off the massive protests, CBS Boston reports.

The Boston Police Department announced at 1:30 p.m. that the "Free Speech" rally had ended."
-----------------------------------------------

Boston "free speech" rally ends after counter-protesters take to streets -- live updates - CBS News

Nothing is quite as simple as you post it.

I honor and respect the first amendment, but as most decent Americans do, am hesitant to support white nationalism, although it is also protected.

Just think, under the current circumstances, without perspective, you post could be inflammatory.

Or...do you support "white nationalism" ? I am on the record clearly as opposing any such thing as a Nazi movement (see white nationalism)

I will address the three points that I have highlighted in yellow.

1. OF COURSE the point of the counter-demonstration is to suppress Free Speech. The counter-demonstrators use the threat of violence, and actual violence, to break up the group they are demonstrating against.

2. The organizers of the rally distanced themselves from the White Supremacist groups. Note that the niece of Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. appeared on TV before the rally in support of the rally. She is not a White Supremacist.

Having said that, if some event (not this one) was the most virulent, disgusting, White Supremacist rally to ever be seen, it is still protected by the First Amendment. They still have the right to speak under the provisions of the First Amendment as decided by the Supreme Court. The Court has said that the First Amendment’s tradition of “protect[ing] the freedom to express ‘the thought that we hate’ ” includes the right to express even “discriminatory” viewpoints.

No "counter-demonstration" should be allowed to prevent the Free Speech of another group with a different viewpoint. That's why the Police show up.

3. You make a grave mistake when you equate my support of the First Amendment with support of White Nationalism. Actually, I know that you know better. You are just trying to make me angry by insulting me.

As in other cases, I wonder if you would be equally rude if you were speaking to me in person, or are you capable of exchanging ideas without sinking in the mire of personal insults?

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Carl in Tampa
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Originally Posted by Guest

I will address the three points that I have highlighted in yellow.

1. OF COURSE the point of the counter-demonstration is to suppress Free Speech. The counter-demonstrators use the threat of violence, and actual violence, to break up the group they are demonstrating against.

2. The organizers of the rally distanced themselves from the White Supremacist groups. Note that the niece of Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. appeared on TV before the rally in support of the rally. She is not a White Supremacist.

Having said that, if some event (not this one) was the most virulent, disgusting, White Supremacist rally to ever be seen, it is still protected by the First Amendment. They still have the right to speak under the provisions of the First Amendment as decided by the Supreme Court. The Court has said that the First Amendment’s tradition of “protect[ing] the freedom to express ‘the thought that we hate’ ” includes the right to express even “discriminatory” viewpoints.

No "counter-demonstration" should be allowed to prevent the Free Speech of another group with a different viewpoint. That's why the Police show up.

3. You make a grave mistake when you equate my support of the First Amendment with support of White Nationalism. Actually, I know that you know better. You are just trying to make me angry by insulting me.

As in other cases, I wonder if you would be equally rude if you were speaking to me in person, or are you capable of exchanging ideas without sinking in the mire of personal insults?

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Carl in Tampa
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I take great pride in not being rude, UNLESS responding to such.

My response to you was to simply put into context, what in my opinion was a misleading post, criticizing one group of people without investigating or posting any information on a group that by its own words is in support of white nationalism and who was a large part of Charlottesville.

How do you select what group is demonstrating against free speech ?

You seem, to me, to have made that judgement quite quickly.

Yes, and I did no accuse you if one thing relative to white nationalism, except to point out that this forum is easily 80% white nationalists.

I have been around for quite some time Carl....I am not a novice, I know the buzz words, notice as you and Rubicon discuss "identity politics" that is a favorite among the white nationalist groups. Not aimed at you, but please don't lecture me; you are not the only poster on here.

I rely on accurate information, not implication. I support my points of view with facts, not innuendo. Your OP was extremely misleading, and I took exception. So, that's it...alll the slights you think you see may not have been aimed at you after all.

Again, I am not a novice. I KNOW what white nationalist say, and what they do not say. Our President today labeled a group as "anti police agitators" and that is another buzz phrase, as you SHOULD know. That was uncalled for, and frankly I am concerned about this movement that closely mirrors naziism.

As you can read in most posts where someone finally discusses real issues, I endorse American working together, without labels.

On here there is too much labeling and attacking.

This isn't my first rodeo in politics, and I have watched the deterioration of what used to be a respected calling. IN MY OPINION...the current occupant of the Oval Office is a disgrace to our country and the morals that enabled our growth. He is becoming more and more every day a divider...he has yet to make one effort to unite this country. And please, blaming the left is ludicrious..,they are doing nothing and are not organized enough if they wanted.

The latest fiasco (not one person on this forum, nor anyone in the administration has yet to condemn the words used to describe a dead woman from Charlottesville) where we now seem to feel it is fine and dandy to wear brown shirts, wave Nazi flags, shout nazi hate slogans, and I still have in my memory, those little boys being led in a cheers celebrating Trump by Trump. This is not aimed at you, but does not leave my mind. The atrocities of WW2 should never leave our mind

I love this country; I have served this country in a number of ways; I have been privileged to meet many great leaders, and to me we are on such a backslide it scares me.

Oh, your buddy or please..perceived buddy, Rubicon will come on here in the morning and proclaim that all the ills of the world are to be laid at the feet of millions of Americans..,he has already shared that the election if Trump was too late, and from my perspective hearing stuff like that is damn scary.

And don't give me the Clinton/OBama stuff. I don't care because whatever you think, there is NO EXCUSE..ZERO EXCUSE for having a President lie chronically and to attack everyone who might disagree. Attacking someone else cannot be support for lying. There is a difference between supporting someone and giving up standards because you didn't like his opponent (and I sure don't or did support Clinton)

Sorry for the lecture...I am big on truth, context and discussion. Bottom line, I just did not think your OP was honest, not in context and misleading as to intent. Same way I feel about Trumps tweet..,no reason for that.

Originally Posted by Guest

BFD

Your Antifa crap was not heard of until last week.
Your president (not mine) represents all that Adolf Hitler represented in 1933. Read your history books, Mr. Former Policeman.
Once again, BFD.

You genuinely, honestly, never heard of Antifa until last week?

Really?

I guess you missed them at the anti-World Trade Organization protests in 1999 in Seattle.

And the 2011 Occupy Wall Street "lie in."

Antifa demonstrators have marched in more than a half dozen protests since Election Day in Portland, Oregon, according to police.

Earlier this year, Antifa activists were among those who smashed windows and set fires during protests at the University of California, Berkeley. I would have thought you might have seen that.

Antifa activists were in New York City on May Day.

Over the past year, Antifa members have been involved in clashes across the country and the world, including in Chicago, Philadelphia, Houston, Alabama and Nebraska, and at the G20 summit in Hamburg, Germany.

And..................you didn't hear about them until last week.

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Carl in Tampa
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Originally Posted by Carl in Tampa

I will address the three points that I have highlighted in yellow.

1. OF COURSE the point of the counter-demonstration is to suppress Free Speech. The counter-demonstrators use the threat of violence, and actual violence, to break up the group they are demonstrating against.

2. The organizers of the rally distanced themselves from the White Supremacist groups. Note that the niece of Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. appeared on TV before the rally in support of the rally. She is not a White Supremacist.

Having said that, if some event (not this one) was the most virulent, disgusting, White Supremacist rally to ever be seen, it is still protected by the First Amendment. They still have the right to speak under the provisions of the First Amendment as decided by the Supreme Court. The Court has said that the First Amendment’s tradition of “protect[ing] the freedom to express ‘the thought that we hate’ ” includes the right to express even “discriminatory” viewpoints.

No "counter-demonstration" should be allowed to prevent the Free Speech of another group with a different viewpoint. That's why the Police show up.

3. You make a grave mistake when you equate my support of the First Amendment with support of White Nationalism. Actually, I know that you know better. You are just trying to make me angry by insulting me.

As in other cases, I wonder if you would be equally rude if you were speaking to me in person, or are you capable of exchanging ideas without sinking in the mire of personal insults?

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Carl in Tampa
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No offense Carl, but tighten up your replies. This isn't an essay test where you might get a better grade by word count. You are much more succinct on the other side. And much more readable.

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by Guest

I take great pride in not being rude, UNLESS responding to such.

My response to you was to simply put into context, what in my opinion was a misleading post, criticizing one group of people without investigating or posting any information on a group that by its own words is in support of white nationalism and who was a large part of Charlottesville.

How do you select what group is demonstrating against free speech ?

You seem, to me, to have made that judgement quite quickly.

Yes, and I did no accuse you if one thing relative to white nationalism, except to point out that this forum is easily 80% white nationalists.

I have been around for quite some time Carl....I am not a novice, I know the buzz words, notice as you and Rubicon discuss "identity politics" that is a favorite among the white nationalist groups. Not aimed at you, but please don't lecture me; you are not the only poster on here.

I rely on accurate information, not implication. I support my points of view with facts, not innuendo. Your OP was extremely misleading, and I took exception. So, that's it...alll the slights you think you see may not have been aimed at you after all.

Again, I am not a novice. I KNOW what white nationalist say, and what they do not say. Our President today labeled a group as "anti police agitators" and that is another buzz phrase, as you SHOULD know. That was uncalled for, and frankly I am concerned about this movement that closely mirrors naziism.

As you can read in most posts where someone finally discusses real issues, I endorse American working together, without labels.

On here there is too much labeling and attacking.

This isn't my first rodeo in politics, and I have watched the deterioration of what used to be a respected calling. IN MY OPINION...the current occupant of the Oval Office is a disgrace to our country and the morals that enabled our growth. He is becoming more and more every day a divider...he has yet to make one effort to unite this country. And please, blaming the left is ludicrious..,they are doing nothing and are not organized enough if they wanted.

The latest fiasco (not one person on this forum, nor anyone in the administration has yet to condemn the words used to describe a dead woman from Charlottesville) where we now seem to feel it is fine and dandy to wear brown shirts, wave Nazi flags, shout nazi hate slogans, and I still have in my memory, those little boys being led in a cheers celebrating Trump by Trump. This is not aimed at you, but does not leave my mind. The atrocities of WW2 should never leave our mind

I love this country; I have served this country in a number of ways; I have been privileged to meet many great leaders, and to me we are on such a backslide it scares me.

Oh, your buddy or please..perceived buddy, Rubicon will come on here in the morning and proclaim that all the ills of the world are to be laid at the feet of millions of Americans..,he has already shared that the election if Trump was too late, and from my perspective hearing stuff like that is damn scary.

And don't give me the Clinton/OBama stuff. I don't care because whatever you think, there is NO EXCUSE..ZERO EXCUSE for having a President lie chronically and to attack everyone who might disagree. Attacking someone else cannot be support for lying. There is a difference between supporting someone and giving up standards because you didn't like his opponent (and I sure don't or did support Clinton)

Sorry for the lecture...I am big on truth, context and discussion. Bottom line, I just did not think your OP was honest, not in context and misleading as to intent. Same way I feel about Trumps tweet..,no reason for that.

Of course you were rude. And it was obviously deliberate and unjustified.

My original post was not in support of any group; it was in support of the First Amendment of the Constitution. As the Supreme Court has pointed out, hate speech is protected by the Constitution. That doesn't mean that I approve of it, nor does the Supreme Court.

You say that Rubicon and I discuss "identity politics." The use of quotation marks means the use of those exact words. First off, I don't know Rubicon, and we do not communicate privately about our postings. Secondly, I defy you to find any post of mine, anywhere, where I use the words "Identity Politics."

Most of the rest of your post has nothing to do with me or the original post regarding protecting the First Amendment, so I won't bother to address it.

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Carl in Tampa
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Originally Posted by Guest

No offense Carl, but tighten up your replies. This isn't an essay test where you might get a better grade by word count. You are much more succinct on the other side. And much more readable.

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

No offense taken.

I had already noticed that my posts have been getting very long when I try to respond to each point of some very long posts by others who criticize my posts. I guess I'm going to have to forego pointing out any must their most glaring errors.

Besides, they don't listen and comprehend anyway.

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Carl in Tampa

Originally Posted by Guest

Of course you were rude. And it was obviously deliberate and unjustified.

My original post was not in support of any group; it was in support of the First Amendment of the Constitution. As the Supreme Court has pointed out, hate speech is protected by the Constitution. That doesn't mean that I approve of it, nor does the Supreme Court.

You say that Rubicon and I discuss "identity politics." The use of quotation marks means the use of those exact words. First off, I don't know Rubicon, and we do not communicate privately about our postings. Secondly, I defy you to find any post of mine, anywhere, where I use the words "Identity Politics."

Most of the rest of your post has nothing to do with me or the original post regarding protecting the First Amendment, so I won't bother to address it.

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Carl in Tampa
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Just a note...I am not intimidated.

Save your braggadocio and accusations. They are meaningless.

Just speak the truth.

Originally Posted by Guest

No offense taken.

I had already noticed that my posts have been getting very long when I try to respond to each point of some very long posts by others who criticize my posts. I guess I'm going to have to forego pointing out any must their most glaring errors.

Besides, they don't listen and comprehend anyway.

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Carl in Tampa

We learn at your feet. Sorry for the "glaring errors". You must tire of us common folks and our links and back up

Antifa (United States - Wikipedia)

A link for the Antifa.

Originally Posted by Guest

We learn at your feet. Sorry for the "glaring errors". You must tire of us common folks and our links and back up

Geez, Rocky, take a break or something. You seem to be taking personal offense to everything posted that doesn't support your ideology /truth, and even posts such as mine where I merely ask for clarification. This is exactly why nothing is getting done in Washington - no one wants to entertain opposing viewpoints and have a real discussion about them. You always say you want real discussion on this forum, then proceed to try to shut down anyone who doesn't agree with your viewpoint! You need to quit hanging out with CNM so much.

Originally Posted by Guest

Geez, Rocky, take a break or something. You seem to be taking personal offense to everything posted that doesn't support your ideology /truth, and even posts such as mine where I merely ask for clarification. This is exactly why nothing is getting done in Washington - no one wants to entertain opposing viewpoints and have a real discussion about them. You always say you want real discussion on this forum, then proceed to try to shut down anyone who doesn't agree with your viewpoint! You need to quit hanging out with CNM so much.

Do you want a list of the obscene names I am called on here ? Why, only because I do not support Trump, because I object to lies, and object to being lectured based on made up lies.

The list is rather obscene and has nothing to do with disagreeing in any issue, because issues are not discussed here.


On this site, if you dare disagree with the President, you will be lectured and told how your sin is that you are a "libtard" which is humorous since I am a very conservative conservative. I just believe that truth is important, that hate NEVER is a basis for understanding and agreement, and that leadership requires listening and knowledge.

Sorry to you and all your followers. Maybe lecture the foul mouthed one line smart asses next time you have this need to set people straight.

Originally Posted by Rockyrd

Do you want a list of the obscene names I am called on here ? Why, only because I do not support Trump, because I object to lies, and object to being lectured based on made up lies.



The list is rather obscene and has nothing to do with disagreeing in any issue, because issues are not discussed here.





On this site, if you dare disagree with the President, you will be lectured and told how your sin is that you are a "libtard" which is humorous since I am a very conservative conservative. I just believe that truth is important, that hate NEVER is a basis for understanding and agreement, and that leadership requires listening and knowledge.



Sorry to you and all your followers. Maybe lecture the foul mouthed one line smart asses next time you have this need to set people straight.

Probably no worse than these...

George Carlin - 7 Words You Can't Say On TV - YouTube


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