I kind of agree with Richie on this one. Workplace violence is definitely the wrong phrasing of the Fort Hood killings. That is domestic terrorism - plain and simple. That Army major should be either locked away for the rest of his life or executed quickly.

As for a man killing his family because they would not convert to Islam. There are lots of crazies who do kill members of their families for "religious" reasons. These people are mentally off anyhow and their fanatical beliefs propel them to the killings. It might be Islam, Jim Jones, ultra-fundamentalist Baptist, or others. Look at the ones who handle snakes or will not seek a doctor's assistance, or have 15 wives who may be children. Too many crazies with religioius overtones.

Didn't need to. I knew it was some kind of profiling and indictment of Muslims. I've come to expect it from certain folks on here. :cus:

How do you react to a Muslim killing his family because they reject Islamic conversion?

It's profiling to notice a religion that demands the deaths of non-believers?

A man, who by following the teaching of his Islamic religion, kills his family is then judged to be "crazy"?

Knowing the facts of these Islamic teachings and speaking about them is now considered an "indictment" of Muslims?

Again, the rose colored glasses do not improve vision.

"Most of the fifty-five Founding Fathers who worked on the Constitution were members of orthodox Christian churches and many were even evangelical Christians. The first official act in the First Continental Congress was to open in Christian prayer, which ended in these words: "...the merits of Jesus Christ, Thy Son, our Savior. Amen". Sounds Christian to me."

"John Jay, the first Chief Justice of the United States Supreme Court, and one of the three men most responsible for the writing of the Constitution declared:

"Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers, and it is their duty-as well as privilege and interest- of our Christian nation to select and prefer Christians for their rulers." Still sounds like the Founding Fathers knew this was a Christian nation."

"This view, that we were a Christian nation, was hold for almost 150 years until the Everson v. Board of Education ruling in 1947. Before that momentous ruling, even the Supreme Court knew that we were a Christian nation. In 1892 the Court stated:

"No purpose of action against religion can be imputed to any legislation, state or national, because this is a religious people...This is a Christian nation." There it is again! From the Supreme Court of the United States. This court went on to cite 87 precedents (prior actions, words, and rulings) to conclude that this was a "Christian nation".

"Later, John Quincy Adams answered the question as to why, next to Christmas, was the Fourth of July this most joyous and venerated day in the United States. He answered: "...Is it not that the Declaration of Independence first organized the social compact on the foundation of the Redeemer’s mission upon earth? That it laid the cornerstone of human government upon the first precepts of Christianity?" Sounds like the founding of a Christian nation to me. John Quincy Adams went on to say that the biggest victory won in the American Revolution was that Christian principles and civil government would be tied together In what he called an "indissoluble" bond. The Founding Fathers understood that religion was inextricably part of our nation and government. The practice of the Christian religion in our government was not only welcomed but encouraged."

You missed the point. If this was done in a Muslim country it would neither be the actions of a crazy man nor would he be found guilty of a crime. Lets not let these primitive beliefs get a foot hold in this Christian nation.

Good History...But Why Then...???
 

Good history. But it seems to leave open the question of why the Supreme Court--which even after Barack Obama's appointments is still a conservative majority--seem to be ruling in favor of those that oppose the imbedding of Christianity into our government and culture.

Your history is clearcut. But what happened that permitted recent rulings by the Court which seem to overturn those ideas? Didn't the founding fathers get all the words right when they wrote the Constitution? I can't think of another reason why a Constitutionally conservative Court will rule as they have.

Well said my friend! :bigbow:

Missed the point entirely Richie. :cus:

I guess your point was a little too vague.

All the talk of being a Christian nation - where does that leave the non-Christians? I am not talking about Muslims who have a bad reputation but how about those of the Jewish faith and culture? What about Native Americans who are not Christian? How about an atheist? Buddhist, Shinto, Zoroastrstrims, Wiccans, Hindu, etc? Do they have a vote or are they allowed to be elected to public office?

Remember that the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution were written over 200 years ago. With the exception of a few Jews (maybe) there were only Christians in the USA. I am sure none of the founding fathers ever heard of a Muslim, a Buddhist, a Hindu, or a Wiccan. Things evolve over time and must be compensated for in the process.

You can talk of religious tolerance in America but the true history does not show the religious tolerance. http://www.smithsonianmag.com/histor...Tolerance.html

Always have been kind of a vagrant. :cus:

I very honestly am getting very tired of the United States being called a Christian nation. That is not entirely true. What is true, is that we were founded on Judeo Christian principles. The 10 Commandments. Things like that.

We harbor no resentment toward other religions that do not harbor resentment against us. Our Constitution says that we shall not establish a state religion. It says that we have freedom of religion. It does not say nor was it ever intended to say that we were guaranteed freedom from religion.

I'm tired of hearing people whine and moan and groan that we are unfair to other religions. There is no place in the world that has three religious freedom that this country was founded upon.

Just my two cents

thank you
 

thank you dklassen and village II for two very good posts.

Islam began in about 700AD, Buddhism and Hinduism began about 500BC...so were our founding fathers not aware of these religions? hmmmm...I think not. These were men well versed in the history of Europe. For starters, the Crusades were fought to defend Europe from Islamic domination, so i am pretty sure that they were well acquainted with what the Muslim's are all about.

John Jay's quote? Umm.. You're missing part of it.

Since we HAVE started wars, I think that would disqualify us from Jay's idea of being a true Christian nation.

Buggyone: You are *very* wrong. Thomas Jefferson himself was working on a translation of the Koran. Remember the flak that Rep. Keith Ellison (D-MN) got for taking hsi oath on a Koran? It was *Jefferson's* Koran that he specifically asked to borrow from the Library of Congress. So the Founders DID have knowledge of Islam.

How about a quote of his from "Notes on the State of Virgina - 1782":