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-   -   Seven Years of Global Temperature Data (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/weather-talk-515/seven-years-global-temperature-data-336474/)

Vermilion Villager 11-06-2022 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sounding (Post 2154706)
I already provided the Roy Spencer graph source -- nothing to hide here. Besides, there is no cherry-picking. I simply plotted all January through October temperature data from 2015 to 2022. Where is the cherry picking? When the November data comes in, I will plot that data -- and then subsequently for the December data ... a very simple straight forward process. And over the last 8 years of data, it shows a 7-year slight cooling trend.

Why start at 2015? Was the data not available before this year? If it was then why didn't you post it?

Vermilion Villager 11-06-2022 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sounding (Post 2154954)
During the Little Ice Age there were even more sources explaining why witches caused extreme weather and fast growing glaciers -- and most sources were from government and church leaders.

Oh great.......now he's talking about witches.:ohdear:

Maker 11-06-2022 09:15 AM

Many have problems with predictions of only doom and gloom. Assuming your temperature predictions are close, maybe that will lead to a much better world. More CO2 means more plant and tree growth. Additional new warmer regions become the best farm land in the history of the earth. As the population grows, newer more moderate areas will attract people to help reduce existing city overpopulation issues. If there is more precipitation, droughts will end.

Weather cycles are thousands of years long. Perhaps millions. Both warming and cooling. The speck of time is a blip on that scale. Weather forecasting is often still a 50/50 guess even 24 hours in the future. Predicting 100 years is impossible. Especially with the "long range" (3 to 6 month) forecasts being wrong more than they are right. There are too many unpredictable and unknown external factors that cause a shift.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tuccillo (Post 2155076)
Not exactly. We know we are in an interglacial period that started about 12,000 years ago. The concern is that additional anthropogenic warming on top of the interglacial warming will be an issue. The time scale of concern is primarily the next 100 years or so. Estimates put the anthropogenic warming at about 1C. The concerns are that it could be an additional several degrees by the end of the century. While that may not sound like a lot but that is a global change. The regional impacts would be large and could create political upheaval due to migrations away from those regions most impacted.


Old Bob 11-06-2022 09:47 AM

climate change
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sounding (Post 2154959)
Ditto -- and the best part is that CO2 helps make the earth greener and helps keep the earth comfortable for humans ... we are after all tropical life forms since we were born without fur. Man-made CO2 is helping to make our climate great again.

The planet has been going through warming and cooling cycles for millions of years, and will continue. I think it is foolish to think that man can do anything about it!

carlsondg 11-06-2022 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sounding (Post 2154695)
The October 2022 UAH (Univ of Alabama at Huntsville) Satellite DATA is now in and the 7-year trend is still in a slight downward trend. Even though this year (so far) is a tad warmer than last year, the global DATA trend for the last 7 years shows slight cooling. The NOAA global surface temperature DATA reflects a similar slight cooling trend. Plus, November brings early snows ... Mammoth ski season to open early with fresh snow - Los Angeles Times

never let science get in the way of a good story

fdpaq0580 11-06-2022 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Two Bills (Post 2155104)
80 years ago, the only 'greens' around were brassicas, and gays were just happy people!
The UK Clean Air Act of 1956 was introduced as a response to the 1952 Great Smog.
Nothing to do with any Environmental groups.
It was a time when politicians actually worked to solve problems, and not just spend all their time raising money to get reelected.

So, the politicians were the "greens" that regulated the industries for the benefit of the regular folks, causing industries to institute costly practices or face massive fines? I know that industry wasn't fond of the expensive clean-up Hey, have it your way, as long as we get a cleaner and healthier environment

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tuccillo (Post 2154705)
Here is the non cherry picked chart.

Latest Global Temps « Roy Spencer, PhD

It looks like that graph shows INCREASING TEMPERATURES. And I remember reading in various articles that the last 8 years are GLOBALLY, the warmest since 1880 when data began to be available. And I seem to remember that the Gulf of Mexico was at RECORD highs this summer.........we all know about the size and destruction of hurricane IAN.........which seems related to the Gulf temperatures. In fact, the TV meteorologists said that the Gulf temperatures "SUPERCHARGED" hurricane IAN. In fact, there seem to be only a few "naysayers" here locally that TRY to pump up anti-Global Warming sentiment. I wish I could figure out what is gained by an agenda of misinformation. The oil companies fought to conceal Global Warming way back in 1980. Man-caused Global Warming is pretty much settled-SCIENCE at this point.

I have a friend that lives near Naples and I right now removing wet and moldy insulation from his attic. he talks about the effect of Florida's recent HOTTER summers and increased Gulf temperatures. It would be hard to convince him that the Earth was cooling recently. I think most people believe otherwise!

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sounding (Post 2154716)
Anyone call claim what is good or not good, but the cooling trend began after 2015, which is why I plotted that data -- good or bad -- this data shows a cooling trend. The question is ... how long with this continue? Another question is ... why the cooling trend while CO2 continues its steady and steep upward slope?

Well, that is correct about the increased CO2 which is increasing the acidification of the oceans and "bleaching" / KILLING reef coral.

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Two Bills (Post 2154866)
I like that!

Attachment 95686

Unfortunately, the "End IS already here" for many animal species that have died out (very extinct) in recent years. Also sad is the Scientific prediction that by 2090 ONLY 10% of the world's coral reefs will be ALIVE. That IS going to be a bad / sad world that our great GRANDCHILDREN and future generations will have to live in. We are already seeing mass human migration northward from South America and Africa. And on the TV yesterday and today, there are pictures of hundreds of elephant and other large African animals lying very DEAD due to drought related to recent Climate
Change. There are predictions of up to 1/3 of Africa becoming uninhabitable for humans starting in 2060.

So, it looks like that "the end is near sign" is more of a Scientific prediction than some type of JOKE. But it is easier for this generation to "joke" because they will be gone and leave ALL the FUTURE hardships to new generations. Who needs a sense of fairness? Anyway, America was founded with the idea of "conquering the environment" so our ancestors must be VERY proud because it looks like we are FINALLY succeeding!

Driller703 11-06-2022 11:57 AM

Global warming
 
Is CO2 is heavier than air? If so, how is it ending up in the upper atmosphere.

YeOldeCurmudgeon 11-06-2022 12:05 PM

Global temperatures in past seven years hottest ever observed, new data show

The last year was the earth's sixth-warmest on record, while the past seven years were among the warmest ever recorded, according to research released Thursday by NASA and the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration.

The NOAA analysis found that while Earth was slightly cooler than 2019 and 2020, 2021 was still among the warmest on record dating back to 1880.

Every year from 2013 to 2021 was among the ten warmest recorded years, and 2021 was the 45th consecutive year with global temperatures above the 20th century average, according to the agency. The average land and ocean surface temperature during the year was about 1.5 degrees above the 20th-century average.

So, who do you believe? Who do you trust. Just watch the Weather Channel. I don't think they are lying to us.

dougjb 11-06-2022 12:14 PM

I guess this one observation from a very limited time frame from a very limited geographic location dispels the conclusions of hundreds of climatologists with advanced degrees from some very prestigious universities.

Thats one way to dispel the truth. As for me, I don't see the earth curving from my house windows. That is the case every time I have looked out each side of my house. It has been that way for many years. Since my observations suggest there is not curvature to the earth, the earth is flat.

See, I proved it!

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sounding (Post 2154959)
Ditto -- and the best part is that CO2 helps make the earth greener and helps keep the earth comfortable for humans ... we are after all tropical life forms since we were born without fur. Man-made CO2 is helping to make our climate great again.

...........by killing reef coral.....?

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sounding (Post 2154961)
"Had little to do with facts" is exactly right -- just like today. The facts are so little that no one can identify how much "man-made" CO2 warmed the earth last year.

Maybe the dead elephants can explain how Global Warming is happening.

Kenswing 11-06-2022 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimjamuser (Post 2155192)
Maybe the dead elephants can explain how Global Warming is happening.

Maybe you aren’t aware but species have been going extinct since the beginning of time. Man hasn’t even been around for most of them.

Cloudflare CAPTCHA

Laraine 11-06-2022 12:39 PM

1 Attachment(s)
It's been pointed out that 5 or 10 years is too short of a period to base a trend on. For that matter, 150 years is too short of a period, when talking about the earth. 150 years corresponds to how long we've been observing meteorology, and how long we've said global warming has been happening. 150 years ago also happens to correspond to the coldest period in the last 10,000 years, based upon ice cores in Greenland, peat bogs, tree rings, and other measurements. It only makes sense that the temperature has gone up in that period, but it is very difficult to say if man is causing it. In fact, temperatures about 4-5000 years ago were about 2.5 deg. C higher than our current temperatures, and temperatures about 1000 years ago (the Medieval Warm Period) were about 1 deg. C higher than now. Unlikely that industrialization was causing either of those warm periods.

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sounding (Post 2154990)
I picked the point at which slight global cooling started. This cooling is partially due to increasing incursions of polar outbreaks, accompanied by a cooling ENSO and PDO. This is why the hurricane trend has been decreasing for the past 2 years. Data also shows a weakening polar vortex, which is commonly indicative of more polar outbreaks to come -- at least in the near future.

It is better to remember that Hurricane FREQUENCY is decreasing, but Hurricane INTENSITY and human deaths and costs to society are INCREASING. According to Reuters and Bloomberg...... IAN will have done about 60 BILLION dollars worth of property damage to Florida - about 20 Billion will be uninsured. Insurance premiums all over Florida will INCREASE on top of ALREADY being 3 times higher than the national average. Many will lose coverage!

Today the warmest water in the Gulf is 84 degrees. on July 17 it was 90 degrees.

Love2Swim 11-06-2022 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tuccillo (Post 2154705)
Here is the non cherry picked chart.

Latest Global Temps « Roy Spencer, PhD

Thank you. Clearly, as most reputable scientists have said, there is an upward trend. You'd have to be brain dead not to notice the signs of global warming: The ocean temps are getting warmer, ice sheets are shrinking, glaciers are retreating, sea level is rising, extreme weather events are increasing in frequency. This is from climate.nasa.gov - while the sun has played a role in past climate changes, not this time around. It is manmade activities that are the principal driver of the greenhouse effect, a conclusion reached by scientistic experts from around the world.

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sounding (Post 2155019)
Fortunately, humans are helping to improve earth's climate by adding more CO2 to the air. It's odd that so many believe CO2 to be a satanic gas -- and yet no one even knows how much "man-made" CO2 warmed the earth last year. We all know exactly how much CO2 increased last year, or how much gasoline prices increased last year -- but not how much "man-made" CO2 increased earth's temperature. Think about that. Why is that not known? What is the news media hiding - besides the 7-year cooling trend? The answer is available through the use of a globally recognized equation which was created by the world's greatest scientists (including Einstein's contributions). This equation is publicly accessible via a computer program created by the US Government, which accurately describes (to the best of human knowledge) how CO2 and all other greenhouses gases affect our atmosphere. For those who don't know this equation or the program that runs it ... they will be discussed Nov 17 at 1:30 PM at Laurel Manor.

That's what the OIL industry said to fool Americans about pollution and Global Warming in 1980. I guess some still believe that and that Scientific knowledge is REGRESSING.

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nick demis (Post 2155050)
If you look at 5, 10 or100 year charts you are not looking at a true representation of what is taking place. Looking at 10,000, 100,000 year or greater duration charts to find out where we are in the climate cycle. Then you will see how little humans have on the changing climate.

To me, that sounds like a "DISTRACTOR" as commonly used in debates.

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tuccillo (Post 2155076)
Not exactly. We know we are in an interglacial period that started about 12,000 years ago. The concern is that additional anthropogenic warming on top of the interglacial warming will be an issue. The time scale of concern is primarily the next 100 years or so. Estimates put the anthropogenic warming at about 1C. The concerns are that it could be an additional several degrees by the end of the century. While that may not sound like a lot but that is a global change. The regional impacts would be large and could create political upheaval due to migrations away from those regions most impacted.

Yes, exactly!

Taltarzac725 11-06-2022 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimjamuser (Post 2155207)
To me, that sounds like a "DISTRACTOR" as commonly used in debates.

It does not address the issue. We have to live with the change caused by Global Warming now in 2022. We may not survive to 3022.

Aces4 11-06-2022 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimjamuser (Post 2155207)
To me, that sounds like a "DISTRACTOR" as commonly used in debates.


I think the whole subject is a distraction. The real elephant in the room is the threat of nuclear war and no one will care what the temperature will be when that happens. Isn’t anyone listening to the development and testing occurring in unscrupulous countries. The scariest fact is those terrorists may already be entrenched among us.

Byte1 11-06-2022 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimjamuser (Post 2155166)
Well, that is correct about the increased CO2 which is increasing the acidification of the oceans and "bleaching" / KILLING reef coral.

Yes, because "killing reef coral" is sooo important to our lifestyles....:pepper2:

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Two Bills (Post 2155085)
All the scientific stuff is way above my pay grade, but it is obvious that there is a change. The bit I cannot get my head round is that it is man made.
80+ years ago when I was growing up in UK, the air quality was dire. Smog, smoke from coal fires, lead from car exhausts, it was a killer.
Now the air has never been cleaner, but the 'Greens' claim it is still our fault and conditions are getting worse! How?
That's what I find hard to even start to believe.

An article from today's BBC UK service.
The BBC are Climate change zealots.

What is climate change? A really simple guide - BBC News

There is MUCH more to man-made Global Warming observations than simply AIR QUALITY improvement in the UK and the US. For one BIG FACTOR, there are double or triple the world population from 80 years ago. That BIG of a population change IS CONSIDERED BY most CLIMATE Scientists to have INCREASED the CO2 production which has produced the RAPID warming in recent years. The UK and the US simply OUTSOURCED their pollution and CO2 production in the last 80 years of our lifetimes to China and other 3rd world countries. The pollution drifts upward where we don't see it often, but it causes the RAPID WARMING of the planet. Also, Global Warming is considered a threat to US and 1st world industrial Corporations that have LOBBYISTS like for the OIL industry whose job it is to LIE to the American People. This started about 1980 and involves BIG money.

Today the Global Temperatures have increased more in the last eight years than in any similar period since 1880. Simply, the Industrial lobbyists have more money to spend on advertisement propaganda about Global Warming than Scientists have to spend on PR FOR Global Warming.

Another BIG factor is the cutting down of OLD GROWTH forest In the Amazon Rain Forest and other old-growth areas, which is needed to absorb the EXTRA CO2 and other pollutants produced by 1st world industry and IC auto engines. Those are some FACTORS that have change in the past 80 years.

Byte1 11-06-2022 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YeOldeCurmudgeon (Post 2155184)
Global temperatures in past seven years hottest ever observed, new data show

The last year was the earth's sixth-warmest on record, while the past seven years were among the warmest ever recorded, according to research released Thursday by NASA and the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration.

The NOAA analysis found that while Earth was slightly cooler than 2019 and 2020, 2021 was still among the warmest on record dating back to 1880.

Every year from 2013 to 2021 was among the ten warmest recorded years, and 2021 was the 45th consecutive year with global temperatures above the 20th century average, according to the agency. The average land and ocean surface temperature during the year was about 1.5 degrees above the 20th-century average.

So, who do you believe? Who do you trust. Just watch the Weather Channel. I don't think they are lying to us.

That still does not prove that mankind had anything to do with the change. Did mankind warm the earth enough to get us past the ice age?

Byte1 11-06-2022 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimjamuser (Post 2155192)
Maybe the dead elephants can explain how Global Warming is happening.

Or......we also see dead elephants that passed during the ice age. Does that indicate that since elephants are dying that the climate is cooling?

fdpaq0580 11-06-2022 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byte1 (Post 2155222)
Yes, because "killing reef coral" is sooo important to our lifestyles....:pepper2:

More so than you know.

Byte1 11-06-2022 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aces4 (Post 2155218)
I think the whole subject is a distraction. The real elephant in the room is the threat of nuclear war and no one will care what the temperature will be when that happens. Isn’t anyone listening to the development and testing occurring in unscrupulous countries. The scariest fact is those terrorists may already be entrenched among us.

There won't be anymore worry about global warming because the opposite will be evident....a nuclear winter. Then we'll be wishing for some global warming.

Love2Swim 11-06-2022 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byte1 (Post 2155222)
Yes, because "killing reef coral" is sooo important to our lifestyles....:pepper2:

Don't embarrass yourself.

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Two Bills (Post 2155085)
All the scientific stuff is way above my pay grade, but it is obvious that there is a change. The bit I cannot get my head round is that it is man made.
80+ years ago when I was growing up in UK, the air quality was dire. Smog, smoke from coal fires, lead from car exhausts, it was a killer.
Now the air has never been cleaner, but the 'Greens' claim it is still our fault and conditions are getting worse! How?
That's what I find hard to even start to believe.

An article from today's BBC UK service.
The BBC are Climate change zealots.

What is climate change? A really simple guide - BBC News

Those that are happy about AIR that "has never been cleaner" need to thank the "greens" that fought the good fight to make the PUBLIC AWARE that the IC auto engine produces smog and carcinogens and lowers life expectancies. The "GREENS" stimulated public awareness to force / drive the US laws for smog control devices ending in cleaner AIR.

Most of us can thank them for our longer life expectencies.

fdpaq0580 11-06-2022 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byte1 (Post 2155229)
That still does not prove that mankind had anything to do with the change. Did mankind warm the earth enough to get us past the ice age?

Ice age, smice age! Quit recycling old red herrings.
Human kinds influence accelerated dramatically with the start of the industrial revolution and runaway population growth. This has been stated over and over. Humans are not, by themselves, causing global warming, BUT, we are making it far worse than it would be without us. And, no, I am not advocating doing away with humanity.

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skarra (Post 2155087)
Please pseudo-scientists, return to your armchairs and let us all listen to what the overwhelming majority of scientists are telling us - there is a significant and accelerating change in the climate and it is warming.

Where is this energy being stored? It’s in the oceans as you would expect if you think about it. One of the ways we see this is through the melting ice caps both at the polar regions and various countries with significant amounts of snow and ice.

The real question is how will this impact life? It could be positive or negative - that’s probably the real question once we accept the reality of the situation. Water levels are rising - is that a big problem? I’m not saying either way.

So we need to stop turning it into a political battle and start thinking of the consequences and what if anything we need or want to do about it. Eg if polar bears become extinct as a result do we really care given it doesn’t impact our daily lives? Or if there’s more hurricanes do I really care if I live in a part of the country that is rarely impacted by them? Life is certainly going to be different in many ways that we haven’t really thought through but that we now have little control over given the time it takes for this slow moving ship to change course.

Most people care about whether the Polar Bear goes extinct. And the Climate-caused deaths of Elephants and large mammals on TV today in Africa should be hateful and frightening to ALL HUMANS. The passenger pigeons are extinct now. They once darkened the skies of early America. They could have BEEN a good source of protein today. If mammals keep going extinct ........maybe man is not far behind. Today man is capable of destroying the livable environment of the earth (nuclear war) .........mankind needs to come to its senses and co-exist with the environment rather than trying to "conquer the environment" as the early US colonists talked about. Conquering MAY backfire in the FUTURE !

fdpaq0580 11-06-2022 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byte1 (Post 2155232)
Or......we also see dead elephants that passed during the ice age. Does that indicate that since elephants are dying that the climate is cooling?

You know better.

fdpaq0580 11-06-2022 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aces4 (Post 2155218)
I think the whole subject is a distraction. The real elephant in the room is the threat of nuclear war and no one will care what the temperature will be when that happens. Isn’t anyone listening to the development and testing occurring in unscrupulous countries. The scariest fact is those terrorists may already be entrenched among us.

That is another issue for another thread. Go for it.

fdpaq0580 11-06-2022 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimjamuser (Post 2155226)
There is MUCH more to man-made Global Warming observations than simply AIR QUALITY improvement in the UK and the US. For one BIG FACTOR, there are double or triple the world population from 80 years ago. That BIG of a population change IS CONSIDERED BY most CLIMATE Scientists to have INCREASED the CO2 production which has produced the RAPID warming in recent years. The UK and the US simply OUTSOURCED their pollution and CO2 production in the last 80 years of our lifetimes to China and other 3rd world countries. The pollution drifts upward where we don't see it often, but it causes the RAPID WARMING of the planet. Also, Global Warming is considered a threat to US and 1st world industrial Corporations that have LOBBYISTS like for the OIL industry whose job it is to LIE to the American People. This started about 1980 and involves BIG money.

Today the Global Temperatures have increased more in the last eight years than in any similar period since 1880. Simply, the Industrial lobbyists have more money to spend on advertisement propaganda about Global Warming than Scientists have to spend on PR FOR Global Warming.

Another BIG factor is the cutting down of OLD GROWTH forest In the Amazon Rain Forest and other old-growth areas, which is needed to absorb the EXTRA CO2 and other pollutants produced by 1st world industry and IC auto engines. Those are some FACTORS that have change in the past 80 years.

Great post! Deserving of a second reading. Thanks!

fdpaq0580 11-06-2022 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Love2Swim (Post 2155235)
Don't embarrass yourself.

Too late. He already did .... .

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Driller703 (Post 2155180)
Is CO2 is heavier than air? If so, how is it ending up in the upper atmosphere.

Looked up a Columbia Climate School quote....."It is mainly DIFFUSION that allows CO2 to integrate at altitudes higher than its molecular weight ALONE would suggest - also UPDRAFT processes." My take........The earth gets warmer and there is MORE undrafted CO2 which is acting LIKE a blanket (layman's phrase) so MORE HEAT for the earth in a cycle that may reach or HAS reached a TIPPING POINT.

jimjamuser 11-06-2022 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YeOldeCurmudgeon (Post 2155184)
Global temperatures in past seven years hottest ever observed, new data show

The last year was the earth's sixth-warmest on record, while the past seven years were among the warmest ever recorded, according to research released Thursday by NASA and the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration.

The NOAA analysis found that while Earth was slightly cooler than 2019 and 2020, 2021 was still among the warmest on record dating back to 1880.

Every year from 2013 to 2021 was among the ten warmest recorded years, and 2021 was the 45th consecutive year with global temperatures above the 20th century average, according to the agency. The average land and ocean surface temperature during the year was about 1.5 degrees above the 20th-century average.

So, who do you believe? Who do you trust. Just watch the Weather Channel. I don't think they are lying to us.

Great post.

Aces4 11-06-2022 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fdpaq0580 (Post 2155251)
That is another issue for another thread. Go for it.

No thanks, I’m living my life for the moment. That’s all there is at this point. I’ll let the others chase unicorns.


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