[kittygilchrist]

I'm trying to get my head around why people think it's ok for dogs to go on private property (picked up or not). Can anybody help me who thinks that--what is the reasoning? I just don't get it.

I'm trying to think of analogies...bear with me please. I would like sincere responses from people who think it's ok to let pets go on private property how these situations may differ in your mind from your dog's picked up poop.

Say you're walking the dog in a small town and a guy spits his tobacco wad on your dog, says, "oops, I'll clean it up. they ought to put someplace to spit around here" and wipes the dog off.
The dog is your property, the guy cleaned it up.---Is this ok?
If it happened repeatedly, would you keep going there?

Say your car is parked at the grocery while you're shopping in the only shady spot. Staff have historically been smoking and eating lunch under that tree. Jane has eaten her messy oriental food from your hood. She is cleaning up the mess with iced tea on a napkin when you come out with groceries.
"Hey, the car is clean now. They should put picnic tables out here."
The car is your property. People have to eat-----Is this ok?
If this became the norm at groceries with shade, would you park in the shade?

[Polar Bear]

Originally Posted by kittygilchrist

...Say you're walking the dog in a small town and a guy spits his tobacco wad on your dog, says, "oops, I'll clean it up. they ought to put someplace to spit around here" and wipes the dog off.
The dog is your property, the guy cleaned it up.---Is this ok?
If it happened repeatedly, would you keep going there?

Say your car is parked at the grocery while you're shopping in the only shady spot. Staff have historically been smoking and eating lunch under that tree. Jane has eaten her messy oriental food from your hood. She is cleaning up the mess with iced tea on a napkin when you come out with groceries.
"Hey, the car is clean now. They should put picnic tables out here."
The car is your property. People have to eat-----Is this ok?
If this became the norm at groceries with shade, would you park in the shade?

Kitty, I generally agree with most of your posts in this thread, but you can't honestly think these are even remotely comparable examples, can you??!!??

[gerryann]

Originally Posted by Polar Bear

You can't honestly think these are even remotely comparable examples, can you??!!??

I agree. I don't get the comparison ????

[kittygilchrist]

Originally Posted by Polar Bear

Kitty, I generally agree with most of your posts in this thread, but you can't honestly think these are even remotely comparable examples, can you??!!??

Thank you for asking respectfully.

Person A owns property.
Person B adversely affects the property.
Person B cleans up the property.

Why are they not comparable situations?
Sincerely wondering?
Kitty

[Taltarzac725]

...but a constant companion, protector, friend, bodyguard, clown, sometimes bed mate, etc.

I have met almost no dogs that I did not find something good to say about them. Cannot say the same about many people.

I suppose if someone were walking their horse up and down my street and letting its manure stand on the street and on my yard's grass I would have a problem with this but I cannot think of any horse owner who would do this.

Originally Posted by kittygilchrist

Thank you for asking respectfully.

Person A owns property.
Person B adversely affects the property.
Person B cleans up the property.

Why are they not comparable situations?
Sincerely wondering?
Kitty

[zonerboy]

Kitty, although I am a dog owner I generally do my best not to allow my dog to place a paw on any one else"s property when we are out walking. But I am willing to speculate as to why other people might do so.
My guess is that they do so because they somehow think it is basically harmless. No harm, no foul, so to speak.
For example, I am strolling down the sidewalk alone. I encounter two ladies walking side by side in the opposite direction taking up the entire width of the sidewalk. They are chatting away and do not notice me. So to avoid being bumped into I step off the sidewalk and stand on your lawn until they pass. So technically I have just trespassed on your property. But since I can imagine no harm being done, I don't give it a second thought. Do you think that this is an unreasonable attitude on my part?
Or lets say I"m walking down the sidewalk with my dog beside me. I'm not paying attention and as we pass your yard, he suddenly lifts his leg and "marks" (pees on) one of your bushes. Half an hour later I see you outside and say "I'm sorry, but my dog peed on one of your bushes a while ago". Do you actually think you could go over and discover which bush it was without my telling you? If you went out and looked every day for a month, do you think you could tell which bush it was?
I pick up my dog's poop from my yard everyday. Most time it is solid enough that, after picking it up there is no visible residual. Is my yard still somehow to be considered contaminated in some manner? If the poop is somewhat mushy and there is a residual, how long should the area be considered contaminated in your opinion? In my experience, if I go looking the next day, I cannot pinpoint exactly where that poop had been. Is it still dangerous or to be considered somehow unpleasant? How long does such a condition persist?
Sorry to be commenting in such gross detail, but it seems a matter of such extreme concern for some people, that I felt I had little choice if I wished to understand where others are coming from.

[KeepingItReal]

Originally Posted by zonerboy

Kitty, although I am a dog owner I generally do my best not to allow my dog to place a paw on any one else"s property when we are out walking. But I am willing to speculate as to why other people might do so.
My guess is that they do so because they somehow think it is basically harmless. No harm, no foul, so to speak.
For example, I am strolling down the sidewalk alone. I encounter two ladies walking side by side in the opposite direction taking up the entire width of the sidewalk. They are chatting away and do not notice me. So to avoid being bumped into I step off the sidewalk and stand on your lawn until they pass. So technically I have just trespassed on your property. But since I can imagine no harm being done, I don't give it a second thought. Do you think that this is an unreasonable attitude on my part?
Or lets say I"m walking down the sidewalk with my dog beside me. I'm not paying attention and as we pass your yard, he suddenly lifts his leg and "marks" (pees on) one of your bushes. Half an hour later I see you outside and say "I'm sorry, but my dog peed on one of your bushes a while ago". Do you actually think you could go over and discover which bush it was without my telling you? If you went out and looked every day for a month, do you think you could tell which bush it was?
I pick up my dog's poop from my yard everyday. Most time it is solid enough that, after picking it up there is no visible residual. Is my yard still somehow to be considered contaminated in some manner? If the poop is somewhat mushy and there is a residual, how long should the area be considered contaminated in your opinion? In my experience, if I go looking the next day, I cannot pinpoint exactly where that poop had been. Is it still dangerous or to be considered somehow unpleasant? How long does such a condition persist?
Sorry to be commenting in such gross detail, but it seems a matter of such extreme concern for some people, that I felt I had little choice if I wished to understand where others are coming from.

Some of your questions are answered here. You sound like a very responsible owner.

Facts About the Dangers of Dog Poop
Dog poop is a problem we deal with on a daily basis. But is it dangerous? How much do you know? Is pet waste a health hazard?

Here are the dangerous facts:

1. Dog poop is NOT good fertilizer. It's toxic to your lawn! The high nutrient concentration in dog poop will burn and discolor the grass, creating "hot spots".

2. Nearly two decades ago, the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) classified pet waste as a dangerous pollutant in the same category as toxic chemicals and oil.

3. You may not live near water, but unscooped poop from your yard is carried by overland water flow or is washed into storm drains, ending up in far away streams, rivers and ground water.

4. The U.S. Center for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) confirms pet waste can spread parasites including hookworms, ringworms, tapeworms and Salmonella. When infected dog poop comes into contact with your lawn, the poop will eventually "disappear", but the parasite eggs can linger for years! When a human or animal comes into contact with that soil through everyday activities like walking barefoot, gardening or playing, they risk infection from those eggs ... even years after the poop is gone.

5. Pet waste is teaming with E. Coli and other harmful bacteria including fecal coliform bacteria, which causes serious kidney disorders, intestinal illness, cramps and diarrhea in humans. (There are 23 million fecal coliform bacteria in a single gram of pet waste!)

6. Dog poop often contains roundworm larvae, which cause blindness. If a human ingests a roundworm larva, it can migrate through the body causing disease to the brain, lungs, kidneys, liver, heart or eyes. So when people (especially children) touch soil, dog toys or anything that has been in contact with dog feces and then touch their mouths, they can become infected.

Dog poop doesn't just "wash away" or disappear. So if you're not disposing of your dog's waste, you're putting yourself, your family, your dog and your water supply at risk.

[Patty55]

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725

I suppose if someone were walking their horse up and down my street and letting its manure stand on the street and on my yard's grass I would have a problem with this but I cannot think of any horse owner who would do this.

It happens all the time, usually not on the street because the horses I know are a little too "UP" to be ridden on the street. They cut through other peoples property and they drop manure. It's not like they have a groom running behind them with a muck bucket.

[kittygilchrist]

Originally Posted by zonerboy

Kitty, although I am a dog owner I generally do my best not to allow my dog to place a paw on any one else"s property when we are out walking. But I am willing to speculate as to why other people might do so.
My guess is that they do so because they somehow think it is basically harmless. No harm, no foul, so to speak.
For example, I am strolling down the sidewalk alone. I encounter two ladies walking side by side in the opposite direction taking up the entire width of the sidewalk. They are chatting away and do not notice me. So to avoid being bumped into I step off the sidewalk and stand on your lawn until they pass. So technically I have just trespassed on your property. But since I can imagine no harm being done, I don't give it a second thought. Do you think that this is an unreasonable attitude on my part?
Or lets say I"m walking down the sidewalk with my dog beside me. I'm not paying attention and as we pass your yard, he suddenly lifts his leg and "marks" (pees on) one of your bushes. Half an hour later I see you outside and say "I'm sorry, but my dog peed on one of your bushes a while ago". Do you actually think you could go over and discover which bush it was without my telling you? If you went out and looked every day for a month, do you think you could tell which bush it was?
I pick up my dog's poop from my yard everyday. Most time it is solid enough that, after picking it up there is no visible residual. Is my yard still somehow to be considered contaminated in some manner? If the poop is somewhat mushy and there is a residual, how long should the area be considered contaminated in your opinion? In my experience, if I go looking the next day, I cannot pinpoint exactly where that poop had been. Is it still dangerous or to be considered somehow unpleasant? How long does such a condition persist?
Sorry to be commenting in such gross detail, but it seems a matter of such extreme concern for some people, that I felt I had little choice if I wished to understand where others are coming from.

It sounds like you do your best. To me it is black and white. If it is not my property, I have no right to be there, especially not allowing an animal to use it for a bathroom.It isn't a matter of whether there is lasting harm. I can think of countless ways to violate private property secretly and without leaving a trace.

For example a group of teenagers decides to party in the backyard of a vacant house in a new construction area--what's the harm if they pick everything up? They can't imagine why anyone would care, and who will know?

They might say, there was no harm so why do you care....does that make it ok?

[Patty55]

Originally Posted by kittygilchrist

It sounds like you do your best. To me it is black and white. If it is not my property, I have no right to be there, especially not allowing an animal to use it for a bathroom.It isn't a matter of whether there is lasting harm. I can think of countless ways to violate private property secretly and without leaving a trace.

For example a group of teenagers decides to party in the backyard of a vacant house in a new construction area--what's the harm if they pick everything up? They can't imagine why anyone would care, and who will know?

They might say, there was no harm so why do you care....does that make it ok?

So, what will you do? Have your dog never leave the little yard? Doesn't sound much of a life for her.

[Wi11iam]

Originally Posted by Patty55

I have lived in a lot of places and have never seen such anger and malice directed at people and animals.

A week or so ago someone posted that their friend left meat with exlax in their front yard "to get their point across". Judging by most of the pets I see that would be the equivalent of an adult man ingesting 15-20 pills. Grant it, nobody would allow their dog to eat such a thing but sometimes pets get loose.

You don't have to voice every thought that crosses your mind, you don't have to act on every impulse. Every time I see a child out of control running around the supermarket I resist the urge to stick out my foot to trip them. Sometimes it's not easy-LOL.

As far as your precious lawns, the grass here looks like crabgrass to me. You probably couldn't kill it if you tried.

yeah Patty
I do not know u .... But well said...it is becoming vicious toward man and beast.

[kittygilchrist]

Originally Posted by Patty55

So, what will you do? Have your dog never leave the little yard? Doesn't sound much of a life for her.

Not at all, Patty. I didn't say that and never will. Not sure how you got that idea. Simply don't walk the dog where it can go on private property.

[Polar Bear]

Originally Posted by kittygilchrist

Thank you for asking respectfully.

Person A owns property.
Person B adversely affects the property.
Person B cleans up the property.

Why are they not comparable situations?
Sincerely wondering?
Kitty

Simply because they are not. Your attempt at simplification does not change the fact that they are not even remotely comparable. It's too obvious to require specifics.

[Patty55]

Originally Posted by kittygilchrist

Not at all, Patty. I didn't say that and never will. Not sure how you got that idea. Simply don't walk the dog where it can go on private property.

Sounds like a plan, where would that be?

[gomoho]

I always wondered when walking in a national park with horse trails why I was required to pick up my dog's poop, but horse owners had no such obligation. Wonder how that would go down in TV???