[Cliff Fr]

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725

Bryan Kohberger accepts plea deal in fatal stabbings of 4 Idaho college students, prosecutors say - CBS News Bryan Kohberger accepts plea deal in fatal stabbings of 4 Idaho college students, prosecutors say - CBS News

At least, the families will have closure along with the members of the college community.

I think assisted suicide should be available to these admitted murderers

[CFrance]

Originally Posted by talonip

That story has dominated the news cycle for days. Don’t need it here too

I disagree. One of the purposes of this forum is to discuss current events, other than politics. Nobody is breaking any forum rules.

People who don't want to discuss a news item can simply move on.

[Taltarzac725]

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725

I was a student attorney and Co-director for the Legal Assistance to Minnesota Prisoners Stillwater Office. This was connected with the University of Minnesota Law School. I had to handle whoever 's case we received and still remember the hate directed at one of my clients. He was in the top security wing used for inmates who needed protection from other inmates. Cannot really say much of anything else because of attorney/client privilege. The judge I had to talk to on behalf of this client also chewed me out but I was just doing my job and the victim of this man would have been notified right away about this man's legal action . I did start fighting for victims rights connected to libraries is all sorts shortly after graduating from the U of Minnesota Law School. I graduated in May of 1989. Voiced my concerns about inadequacies in collections in law libraries for victims/ survivors of crimes soon after that.

As an interesting aside the prison newspaper of Minnesota Correctional Facility -Stillwater is called The Prison Mirror. The Prison Mirror | Minnesota Historical Society The Prison Mirror | Minnesota Historical Society

The Younger brothers started the newspaper after they were captured by towns people and others after their Northfield Raid and then imprisoned at Stillwater. The James brothers got out of Minnesota.

[dougjb]

Only barbarians seek the death penalty. It is a punishment that has been banned almost universally by the civilized countries of the world. That includes all of Western Europe and almost every 1st world country. Who still has it..besides some of the states of the US...Iran...Saudi Arabia...China... Are those the countries you wish to be associated with?

One commentator here says that a conviction based upon an eye witness account should be enough to execute the person. Yet, studies after studies have concluded that eye witness testimony is among the most unreliable "proof" that exists. In the excitement of the moment, people swear to things that simply did not occur!

As for lawyers making lots of money out of this, that argument is specious. Those states that have capital punishment attorneys (i.e. lawyers paid by the state) for appeals, these lawyers are among the worst paid. Most of the appellate attorneys work pro bono for large firms that wish to make sure that the accused has gotten a fair trial before allowing society to put a person to death! As for trial attorneys representing accused murderers, they are often unqualified (e.g. they have never handled a capital murder case before), incompetent (drunk) and even in the best of circumstances, underfunded. Nothing can match the investigatory powers of the state. They have unlimited funds, resources and manpower. Capital murder atttorneys, in some instances, may get less than $1000 to represent an accused murdered...out of which that attorney must conduct an investigation.

Before blaming the attorney or the court system, please keep in mind that putting a person to death is a BIG thing. For those of you that seek prison justice, please be aware justice is meeted out by our judicial system not by the barbaric pecking order that is in effect in many prisons.

[Taltarzac725]

Originally Posted by dougjb

Only barbarians seek the death penalty. It is a punishment that has been banned almost universally by the civilized countries of the world. That includes all of Western Europe and almost every 1st world country. Who still has it..besides some of the states of the US...Iran...Saudi Arabia...China... Are those the countries you wish to be associated with?

One commentator here says that a conviction based upon an eye witness account should be enough to execute the person. Yet, studies after studies have concluded that eye witness testimony is among the most unreliable "proof" that exists. In the excitement of the moment, people swear to things that simply did not occur!

As for lawyers making lots of money out of this, that argument is specious. Those states that have capital punishment attorneys (i.e. lawyers paid by the state) for appeals, these lawyers are among the worst paid. Most of the appellate attorneys work pro bono for large firms that wish to make sure that the accused has gotten a fair trial before allowing society to put a person to death! As for trial attorneys representing accused murderers, they are often unqualified (e.g. they have never handled a capital murder case before), incompetent (drunk) and even in the best of circumstances, underfunded. Nothing can match the investigatory powers of the state. They have unlimited funds, resources and manpower. Capital murder atttorneys, in some instances, may get less than $1000 to represent an accused murdered...out of which that attorney must conduct an investigation.

Before blaming the attorney or the court system, please keep in mind that putting a person to death is a BIG thing. For those of you that seek prison justice, please be aware justice is meeted out by our judicial system not by the barbaric pecking order that is in effect in many prisons.

My point was that lawyers in general make the law as complicated as possible to stay in business.


I do not particularly like the death penalty as people in the legal system do make mistakes and the prison system is punishment enough in most cases.

[ElDiabloJoe]

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725

You do seem to be onto something. Lawyers do seem to make things as complicated as possible so that they continue to have ways to make money. Equity and common sense should play a big role in our legal system.

For many years, even decades, the two biggest lobbying groups in politics were:
1. The National Rifle Association;
2. The Trial Lawyers Association.

Guess why we have so many tort laws and civil liability issues. Nearly vexatious at this point, in my opinion. Unlike, sayyyy, Mexico. In Mexico, if you trip on a crack in an uneven sidewalk, it is not the municipality or the contractor's fault. It's YOUR fault for not paying attention and looking where you are walking. Something to be said for that.

As for his chances in prison, I have some insight. I worked 7 years in the hub of the world's largest jail system - 4x larger than the largest prison in America (Attica). One of two things will happen. Either he will endure the brutality as long as he can before being shanked or offing himself, or he will adapt. Human beings are amazingly adept. He may adapt by becoming bulked up and brutal himself, victimizing others so he isn't victimized. Or he might become the resident jailhouse lawyer, or hustler/gopher, or he may put on a wig and be the cell block biatch. Or the go-to Pruno maker. One or the other will happen - and each has many different avenues.

[Regorp]

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725

Bryan Kohberger accepts plea deal in fatal stabbings of 4 Idaho college students, prosecutors say - CBS News Bryan Kohberger accepts plea deal in fatal stabbings of 4 Idaho college students, prosecutors say - CBS News. Not smart. Got off easy.

At least, the families will have closure along with the members of the college community.

. Idaho taxpayers now will support him for years with 3 meals a day, work for pay, education, and so much more than the victims will receive. So unfair to the families.

[Taltarzac725]

Originally Posted by Regorp

. Idaho taxpayers now will support him for years with 3 meals a day, work for pay, education, and so much more than the victims will receive. So unfair to the families.

Not sure what kind of alternative is available. Mob justice is seldom right and probably creates a lot of pain and suffering among members of the mob after the lust for vengeance has subsided . And they go after whomever makes an easy target for the lynch mob .

[MollyJo]

He’s a coward. There’s worse things than dying…

[Aces4]

Originally Posted by dougjb

Only barbarians seek the death penalty. It is a punishment that has been banned almost universally by the civilized countries of the world. That includes all of Western Europe and almost every 1st world country. Who still has it..besides some of the states of the US...Iran...Saudi Arabia...China... Are those the countries you wish to be associated with?

One commentator here says that a conviction based upon an eye witness account should be enough to execute the person. Yet, studies after studies have concluded that eye witness testimony is among the most unreliable "proof" that exists. In the excitement of the moment, people swear to things that simply did not occur!

As for lawyers making lots of money out of this, that argument is specious. Those states that have capital punishment attorneys (i.e. lawyers paid by the state) for appeals, these lawyers are among the worst paid. Most of the appellate attorneys work pro bono for large firms that wish to make sure that the accused has gotten a fair trial before allowing society to put a person to death! As for trial attorneys representing accused murderers, they are often unqualified (e.g. they have never handled a capital murder case before), incompetent (drunk) and even in the best of circumstances, underfunded. Nothing can match the investigatory powers of the state. They have unlimited funds, resources and manpower. Capital murder atttorneys, in some instances, may get less than $1000 to represent an accused murdered...out of which that attorney must conduct an investigation.

Before blaming the attorney or the court system, please keep in mind that putting a person to death is a BIG thing. For those of you that seek prison justice, please be aware justice is meeted out by our judicial system not by the barbaric pecking order that is in effect in many prisons.

Only a heinous, barbarian would research how to commit murder and get away with it and then proceed to viciously murder 4 young college students for no d*mn reason. Quit coddling these evil people.

This isn't the 1950's or 1960's era for collecting evidence. There are cellphones, computers, computerized records and tracking, ability to track car travel, security cameras, DNA and an additional plethora of ways to collect sound evidence. Plus the fact, the guy admitted to murdering these kids, someone's children, grandchildren and friends to others.

I'm all for bringing back the death penalty as soon as they can. It is not barbarious, it is criminal justice.

[Risuli]

To clarify, my prior post was BEFORE the court hearing and I obviously do not have inside information regarding this plea arrangement, so as I said, "... accepting a plea agreement doesn't NECESSARILY mean an admission to committing the murders". In this case he was required to admit to each count of murder and to burglary. Unfortunately it did not require him to state his motive or where the K-Bar knife is.

[Taltarzac725]

Originally Posted by MollyJo

He’s a coward. There’s worse things than dying…

Maybe he is afraid about what happens next? He may have to meet those he murdered.

[Bonanza]

Originally Posted by dougjb

Only barbarians seek the death penalty. It is a punishment that has been banned almost universally by the civilized countries of the world. That includes all of Western Europe and almost every 1st world country. Who still has it..besides some of the states of the US...Iran...Saudi Arabia...China... Are those the countries you wish to be associated with?

One commentator here says that a conviction based upon an eye witness account should be enough to execute the person. Yet, studies after studies have concluded that eye witness testimony is among the most unreliable "proof" that exists. In the excitement of the moment, people swear to things that simply did not occur!

As for lawyers making lots of money out of this, that argument is specious. Those states that have capital punishment attorneys (i.e. lawyers paid by the state) for appeals, these lawyers are among the worst paid. Most of the appellate attorneys work pro bono for large firms that wish to make sure that the accused has gotten a fair trial before allowing society to put a person to death! As for trial attorneys representing accused murderers, they are often unqualified (e.g. they have never handled a capital murder case before), incompetent (drunk) and even in the best of circumstances, underfunded. Nothing can match the investigatory powers of the state. They have unlimited funds, resources and manpower. Capital murder atttorneys, in some instances, may get less than $1000 to represent an accused murdered...out of which that attorney must conduct an investigation.

Before blaming the attorney or the court system, please keep in mind that putting a person to death is a BIG thing. For those of you that seek prison justice, please be aware justice is meeted out by our judicial system not by the barbaric pecking order that is in effect in many prisons.

Well then -- I guess I'm a barbarian! I resent the fact that he has been given four life sentences. I resent the fact that Americans have to pay for those like him to eat, watch TV, have a library and game room, exercise room, etc, etc., etc. I totally resent the fact that he has been given a chance to live, regardless of what horrific issues he will face while in prison.

I am a believer in a life for a life. For those who are given life sentences with no hope of parole they should be used for medical science and testing and save the beagles, monkeys, rabbits, etc., from further torture in laboratories. A televised public hanging could also work for others who might be thinking of committing a fatal crime, OR . . . what about the old guillotine beheading technique being held on a raised platform so everyone could see???

Yeah. I thought you would agree!

[hypart]

About 10% of all death row inmates have been exonerated, and yet I'm sure the justice system has put innocent people to death. So we ought to be careful taking away a person's right to appeal, no matter how long it takes.

There should be a threshold above 'beyond a reasonable doubt' for the death penalty, such as extraordinary evidence where there's video evidence or DNA that assures us the accused is guilty. At that point, I'm in favor of taking a person's appeal rights away and move to quick executions.

Note: Timothy McVeigh did not appeal and thus was put to death pretty quickly.

[Fastskiguy]

Did he every say why he did it?

Joe