Originally Posted by jswirs (Post 2003164)

This is a huge WOW. As I have been saying, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. And...The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior!

Originally Posted by coffeebean (Post 2003464)

The head of the CDC in 1976 was squirming for sure. He was not being transparent at all about the Swine Flu vaccine side effects. Having said that, Guillian Barre Syndrome is a very well known potential side effect of vaccines and has been for years.

The CDC has been very transparent with the possible side effects of these current vaccines for Covid. Guillian Barre Syndrome is also a possible side effect of the Covid vaccines. This is not news to me and this information has been very well publicized.

Wiley Online Library

Originally Posted by Velvet (Post 2002405)

Vaccine passports could indicate date of expiration and date of renewal when boosters show full vaccination status as now in Israel. But that’s not really what you are asking?

And …

‘The vaccines were 87 percent effective overall at preventing hospitalization, protection that remained relatively consistent before and after Delta became the country’s dominant variant, the study shows. But that figure masks notable differences between age groups. The shots were only 80 percent effective at keeping adults over 65 from being hospitalized with Covid, while they were 95 percent effective for people between ages 18 and 64.’

is probably explained by the fact that the older people got vaccinated first and therefore their vaccines are older and had more time to wane.

Originally Posted by Two Bills (Post 2003477)

Our cat has not been vaccinated, had Covid, worn a mask, and never once has socially distanced herself in public.
We now live on Meow Mix Original, the best protection out there!

Originally Posted by jimjamuser (Post 2003470)

UNvaccinated people are 11 times MORE likely to die from CV than vaccinated people!

Originally Posted by coffeebean (Post 2002509)

Asymptomatic breakthrough cases go uncounted all the time, just as asymptomatic cases of the un-vaccinated go uncounted. There is no need to get tested if you are not having symptoms unless you need to test for travel or employment or whatever other reason there may be.

So......why bother to count those breakthrough cases at all? The purpose of our vaccines was always to minimize the symptoms of Covid and prevent death. I do understand the reason for the CDC to stop counting breakthrough cases unless those cases result in hospitalization and death. Those are the cases the vaccine failed to do what it was supposed to do. Those are the cases that need to be counted.

All my opinion.

Originally Posted by glsatterlee (Post 2002519)

Report from the Cleveland Clinic:

People who have previously been infected with the virus that causes COVID-19 are protected against being infected again and thus don’t need to be vaccinated, according to a new study.

“Our conclusion is that if you were previously infected, you are protected because of the previous infection and you don’t need the vaccine,” Dr. Nabin Shrestha, of the Cleveland Clinic’s Department of Infectious Disease, told The Epoch Times.

Shrestha and colleagues at the clinic studied data on employees, separating them into four groups: previously infected and unvaccinated, previously infected and vaccinated, not previously infected and unvaccinated, and not previously infected and vaccinated.

They found the vaccines were strongly effective in preventing infection from the CCP (Chinese Communist Party) virus, which causes COVID-19, but that previous infection also bestowed a natural immunity.

“Among the people who were previously infected, whether they took the vaccine or not, there really were no COVID cases,” Shrestha said.

Of the 52,238 employees studied, 2,579 were previously infected. About half of those remained unvaccinated. Of the 49,659 employees who did not have a previous infection, 41 percent did not get a vaccine.

Originally Posted by Two Bills (Post 2003477)

Our cat has not been vaccinated, had Covid, worn a mask, and never once has socially distanced herself in public.
We now live on Meow Mix Original, the best protection out there!

Originally Posted by CFrance (Post 2003479)

Our dog has stuck his nose many places it shouldn't be, yet continues to be virus-resistant.:icon_wink:

Originally Posted by Bill14564 (Post 2002544)

Can you post a source for your claim that no one died from flu, heart disease, or cancer? This report seems to show otherwise.

If the Covid death numbers are just cooked, do you have an explanation for the approximately 550,000 additional deaths in 2020?

What prerequisite screening processes were skipped?

Originally Posted by lkagele (Post 2003488)

Little difference in the death rate over the last 5 or so years. No doubt countries are 'cooking the books' for whatever reason when it comes to death rates. Last I looked, China was declaring less the 5000 COVID deaths. Does anyone really think that's accurate.

United States - Historical Death Rate Data
Year Death Rate Growth Rate
2021 8.977 1.090%
2020 8.880 1.120%
2019 8.782 1.120%
2018 8.685 1.220%
2017 8.580 1.240%

Originally Posted by coffeebean (Post 2003458)

This is not news to me. I read about this as at least a couple of weeks ago right after the full FDA approval was given to the Pfizer vaccine. This is not being hidden from the American people and there is no bait and switch going on.

Originally Posted by SkBlogW (Post 2002957)

Health care professor?? LOL With no link we have no idea when he said it and what data he was analyzing. The CDC funded study I linked in OP shows 16% of hospitalizations were fully vaccinated from June 20 to July 17, at start of Delata surge.

Probably percentage is higher now due to delta surge peaking at very high levels, and more time for vaccine efficacy to go lower. Israel reported as high as 40% when they hit peak delta surge.

Follow the science dude!!

Originally Posted by coffeebean (Post 2003464)

The head of the CDC in 1976 was squirming for sure. He was not being transparent at all about the Swine Flu vaccine side effects. Having said that, Guillian Barre Syndrome is a very well known potential side effect of vaccines and has been for years.

The CDC has been very transparent with the possible side effects of these current vaccines for Covid. Guillian Barre Syndrome is also a possible side effect of the Covid vaccines. This is not news to me and this information has been very well publicized.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ccr3.4756

Originally Posted by Byte1 (Post 2003238)

Just a thought:
How many HEALTHY people are dying from Covid?
If healthy people are not dying from Covid, and a vaccination does NOT keep healthy people from being infected, then is it REALLY important that healthy folks get vaccinated?
Do healthy children really NEED to be vaccinated for Covid at this time? Perhaps more research and testing should be conducted?
Do healthy folks need a booster shot if it does not keep them from becoming infected and when infected they do not need to worry about dying from Covid?
Just some thoughts, that sets aside the hysteria and panic and just asks some basic questions.
Like I have said before, I have had my shots. Do I intend on getting a booster? I am healthy, no medications, and just vitamins. So, my debate with myself is the pros and cons of getting the booster. If it is not necessary, then why subject the body with a foreign substance that may or may not have long term effects? Since I am in my twilight years, does any long term effects even matter?
Do manipulated stats really mean anything to me? Does anyone else's safety mean anything to me, other than my family and close friends? Do I wish to take responsibility for other folks safety when there is no proof that I would have any effect regardless of what I do?
Mandated masks that have very little effect.
Mandated vaccinations that may not even protect you.
Shut down services
Destroy the economy
Delay children's education for years
Delay important surgeries

Evil is having a great time and celebrating the world's panic.

Originally Posted by SkBlogW (Post 2003451)

It appears our scientists disagree with you. But don't feel bad, there is a bombastic individual here that says Israel data doesn't matter because "geography" and "diversity" :shocked:

JERUSALEM, Sept 5 (Reuters) - Israel this month will present data from an extensive rollout of COVID-19 vaccine booster shots to the U.S. Food and Drug Administration, which is weighing White House plans to begin a booster drive in the United States.

Sharon Alroy-Preis, head of public health at Israel's Health Ministry, said the ministry had been asked by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) to brief its advisors at a Sept. 17 meeting.

Israel to present COVID-19 booster shot data to FDA experts | Reuters

Israeli data on Covid-19 vaccine boosters to publish in prominent medical journal ahead of key FDA committee meeting next week

Israeli data on Covid-19 vaccine boosters to publish in prominent medical journal ahead of key FDA committee meeting next week - CNN

NIH director says new Israeli Covid data is building case for booster shots in the U.S.

Covid vaccine booster shots: NIH director says new Israel data is building case in the U.S.

Fauci: ‘Dramatic Data’ From Israel Support COVID-19 Boosters

Fauci: 'Dramatic Data' From Israel Support COVID-19 Boosters - Chronicles Health

Originally Posted by coffeebean (Post 2003447)

Their data is honest for Britain but can not be used as a comparison for the US. As I already said......apples and oranges.

Originally Posted by CFrance (Post 2003479)

Our dog has stuck his nose many places it shouldn't be, yet continues to be virus-resistant.:icon_wink:

Originally Posted by CFrance (Post 2003479)

Our dog has stuck his nose many places it shouldn't be, yet continues to be virus-resistant.:icon_wink:

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby (Post 2003469)

This isn't true. It's not a "side effect" of the virus. The cause of Guillian-Barre syndrome is still not known. It is believed (but not confirmed) that it MIGHT be TRIGGERED by having COVID-19, and possibly by the J&J vaccine as well.

It is also believed that it MIGHT be triggered by eating uncooked or undercooked poultry that has the campylobactor bacteria in it, Zika, Hepatitis (A, B, C, and E), CMV, recent surgery, respiratory or digestive tract infection, and ventilation, and a list of other possible triggers.

In fact, the vaccine AND Covid-19 are both considered RARE possible triggers, compared with all of the other possible triggers. Eating undercooked poultry is the most common trigger.

Lastly, Guillian-Barre syndrome is, in and of itself, a rare disorder. It's not likely that anyone would ever have it in the first place. And for those rare few who do, it is USUALLY triggered by something OTHER than the J&J vaccine or being sick with COVID-19.

Here's my source for this information:

Guillain-Barre syndrome - Symptoms and causes - Mayo Clinic



You can check the Mayo Clinic website on Guillain-Barre syndrome,

Originally Posted by jimjamuser (Post 2003522)

Britain and Israel have Universal Health Care. They ARE real countries that CARE about their population - in contrast to the US, which is neanderthal-like and exists in the dark ages with respect to Public Healthcare.

Originally Posted by drducat (Post 2003505)

That is not correct...Pfizer is emergency use approved only...read the FDA paper and not msnbc or cnn...etc.

Originally Posted by Two Bills (Post 2003529)

You should see our waiting lists for treatments since the pandemic started!
I paid privately to have my knee replaced, as I could not wait for a year or more for surgery.
No system has the perfect answer.

Originally Posted by coffeebean (Post 2003533)

Pfizer has received full FDA approval for their formula which is the exact same as the Pfizer vaccine already in use but under a different brand name. This is being reported on MSM. There has been full transparency about the differences.

Originally Posted by graciegirl (Post 2002428)

I can find no evidence that people who are fully vaccinated account for 14 percent of hospitalization.

The Delta Variant is FAR more contagious and there have been many break through cases that I am aware of personally, but only one who was hospitalized: Dr. Boogie on this forum.

Originally Posted by Irishmen (Post 2003762)

Just last month it was misinformation to say you could be jabbed and still catch and transmit. Then, it was explained it was the un-jabbed causing the outbreak. So whats the excuse for Israel, one of the most jabbed nations in the world is now on thier 4th wave of infections and thousands are getting sick, being hospitalized and dying. Israel is the canary in the mine shaft. A preview of what we are likely to face in coming months. Israel is already on they 4th booster. The narrtive of safe and effective is starting to get away from the establishment. Bill Gates is real happy these days....

Originally Posted by drducat (Post 2003579)

Right and if you get really sick with a life long illness from the vaccine...you are on your own....unless you take the BioNTech label...then you can go after them but never Pfizer. they are protected.....so ask for the BioNTech label and watch the look on their face.

Originally Posted by Irishmen (Post 2003762)

Just last month it was misinformation to say you could be jabbed and still catch and transmit. Then, it was explained it was the un-jabbed causing the outbreak. So whats the excuse for Israel, one of the most jabbed nations in the world is now on thier 4th wave of infections and thousands are getting sick, being hospitalized and dying. Israel is the canary in the mine shaft. A preview of what we are likely to face in coming months. Israel is already on they 4th booster. The narrtive of safe and effective is starting to get away from the establishment. Bill Gates is real happy these days....

Originally Posted by Velvet (Post 2003329)

Well, Byte1, it is the unvaccinated by far, who catch Covid although that will likely change as the vaccine without a booster will be less and less protective to the vaccinated. And the ‘live free or die’ type tend not to get vaccinated in the first place. The virus looks for easy targets. Like them. Yum! It is resilient, it is a survivor. Are we?

Originally Posted by blueash (Post 2003837)

I finally found where he got those numbers that he is clinging tightly to prove Covid is a hoax...After all if US death rates did not go up, then Covid isn't killing people. From a google search see image below. What he did NOT do is click on the link where it says in a great big highlighted box

NOTE: All 2020 and later data are UN projections and DO NOT include any impacts of the COVID-19 virus.

Sometimes Google alone is not enough. But at least you provided another example of my sig line, that people will find something to support their opinion no matter how wrong their material may be.

Originally Posted by Velvet (Post 2003329)

Well, Byte1, it is the unvaccinated by far, who catch Covid although that will likely change as the vaccine without a booster will be less and less protective to the vaccinated. And the ‘live free or die’ type tend not to get vaccinated in the first place. The virus looks for easy targets. Like them. Yum! It is resilient, it is a survivor. Are we?

Originally Posted by Byte1 (Post 2003843)

The problem with your supposition is that you(and many others) are assuming that anyone without a vaccination and anyone without a mask are INFECTED and contagious.
What are the chances that you will encounter someone that is infected?
In such an encounter, what is the chance that you will become infected?
If infected, what is the chance that you will be hospitalized?
If hospitalized, what is the chance that you will DIE?
Taking all that into consideration , your best bet is to wear thick body armor and stay away from any area that has moving vehicles, do not use mobile transportation of any type, and drink only distilled water.
I have no problem with vaccinations. I also have no problem with those that do not get vaccinated. Looking at the law of probability regarding the chance of my getting infected with or without a vaccination and with or without a mask, I am not fooled by the media and the gov into thinking that I need a nanny to mandate every facet of my lifestyle. And patriotism is not an issue here, so lets drop that tactic.
I can support vaccinations but I do not believe in mandates of this sort.
But staying on subject, I am not sure whether or not I will obtain a booster. And as of this time, the booster is not really supported by the federal gov research. If and when they decide that it might be advantageous, I might consider it. But, since I am in great shape and better than many that have survived the virus, I may abstain from participation.

Originally Posted by Velvet (Post 2003480)

Yes, as of now, but it looks like the protection of the mRNA vaccine is dropping. And not proportionally to time lapsed since getting the vaccine, but logarithmically. Therefore the need for boosters.

Originally Posted by jimjamuser (Post 2003875)

Yes, it is dropping but NOT NECESSARILY DIRECTLY proportional to TIME-LAPSED. The time depends on the person's age - greater age means greater drop, in general. But, not for everyone. It also depends on the individual's inherent ability to RETAIN the anti-bodies that their own body produced against the CV - there are individual differences, based on some (?) yet to be studied internal human mechanisms for disease protection. Also, Co-morbidities, immuno-suppressant diseases, organ transplant recipients, and the medications taken for these and other diseases seem to negatively impact the effectiveness of the vaccine over time. AND there are probably MORE factors as yet to be studied.
Incidentally......it is interesting to note that 3 or 4 national radio hosts that WERE famously against vaccinations (so-called jabs) are now INFAMOUS for having DIED painfully of CV in a hospital. They stated that they WISHED that they had gotten VACCINATED. Personally, I would not be waiting for God to vaccinate me - I did and would again ask for an earthly vaccination against the deadly disease - CV.

Originally Posted by drducat (Post 2003579)

Right and if you get really sick with a life long illness from the vaccine...you are on your own....unless you take the BioNTech label...then you can go after them but never Pfizer. they are protected.....so ask for the BioNTech label and watch the look on their face.

Originally Posted by blueash (Post 2003819)

Quote:


Of course ducat was corrected. He is getting his opinion from far right wing blogs.



and instead of admitting the error, learning from it, maybe even thanking the poster for adding to his knowledge and apologizing for posting false information, we get this reply




Ducat is wrong again. I'm not sure whose face we are supposed to look at, but his (or her) understanding of vaccine liability in the US is wrong. When you get almost any vaccine in this country the manufacturer's liability is covered by a federal program. This is not unique to Covid shots. It is true of the MMR, the DTap etc. All the Covid vaccines, not just Pfizer's are covered by the Countermeasures Injury Compensation Program. Vaccines for children and pregnant women are covered under the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program which was signed into law by Reagan in 1986.

And there is no such thing as a stand alone "the BioNTech vaccine." The correct name and the name that was used in emergency approval is Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine. Once Pfizer -BioNTech got full authorization for use of this vaccine in people 16 and older they then rebranded with a commercial name, Comirnaty, while the identical vaccine being given under emergency authorization is still Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine for those 12 to 15. Further, the authorization allows the use of either of these vaccines in all circumstances where either is authorized, because they are identical. If all I have in my freezer is Comirnaty and I wish to vaccinate a 12 year old it can be used. If all I have is Pfizer-BioNTech and I wish to immunize a 60 year old I can use it. A Datsun is a Nissan, a Nissan is a Datsun. So simple to understand.

You can read the history of the association of Pfizer, a US company, and BioNTech, a German company in the development [all in Germany], manufacture, and sales of this vaccine.

Originally Posted by Irishmen (Post 2003762)

Just last month it was misinformation to say you could be jabbed and still catch and transmit. Then, it was explained it was the un-jabbed causing the outbreak. So whats the excuse for Israel, one of the most jabbed nations in the world is now on thier 4th wave of infections and thousands are getting sick, being hospitalized and dying. Israel is the canary in the mine shaft. A preview of what we are likely to face in coming months. Israel is already on they 4th booster. The narrtive of safe and effective is starting to get away from the establishment. Bill Gates is real happy these days....