[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by margaretmattson

I am certain this restaurant is classifying their employees correctly. It is not privately owned.With the many lawsuits that were won by waitstaff, corporations ensure that kitchen staff and waitstaff are separate entities.

So, you have not seen the W-2 forms, and you don't what they are doing. It would be highly unlikely that a restaurant would try to classify a dishwasher as a tipped employee on a W-2 form. The IRS would not allow it. A non-tipped employee can not share in a tip pool. If they are sharing tips, it is probably being done off the books and in cash.

[margaretmattson]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

So, you have not seen the W-2 forms, and you don't what they are doing. It would be highly unlikely that a restaurant would try to classify a dishwasher as a tipped employee on a W-2 form. The IRS would not allow it. A non-tipped employee can not share in a tip pool. If they are sharing tips, it is probably being done off the books and in cash.

I have been to the restaurant my nephew works many times. I have seen separate dishwashing stations that only the waitstaff or waitstaff support use. They are manned by one person who cleans and returns dirty blenders, glassware, etc that never leave the bar. It is clearly a waitstaff support job.

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by margaretmattson

I have been to the restaurant my nephew works many times. I have seen separate dishwashing stations that only the waitstaff or waitstaff support use. They are manned by one person who cleans and returns dirty blenders, glassware, etc that never leave the bar. It is clearly a waitstaff support job.

Here are the Florida tip pooling rules :

How Florida Minimum Wage Interacts with Tip Pooling

• Guaranteed Minimum Total Compensation: Regardless of how a tip pool is structured, the combined total of the direct cash wage paid by the employer plus the tips received by the employee must equal or exceed the full Florida minimum wage ($14.00/hour, or $15.00/hour starting September 30, 2026). If a tip pool leaves an employee short of the state minimum wage for the workweek, the employer must make up the difference.
• Using a Tip Credit vs. Full Minimum Wage:
• If taking a tip credit: Florida allows employers to take a maximum tip credit of $3.02 per hour, meaning tipped employees must be paid a direct cash wage of at least $10.98/hour (rising to $11.98/hour on September 30, 2026). Under this setup, tip pooling is strictly limited to customarily and regularly tipped front-of-house (FOH) staff (such as servers, bartenders, bussers, and food runners). Back-of-house staff (like cooks and dishwashers) cannot be included.
• If paying the full minimum wage (no tip credit): If an employer chooses to pay the full state minimum wage ($14.00/hour or $15.00/hour) without claiming a tip credit, they can establish a broader tip pool that includes back-of-house staff.
• Exclusion of Management: Managers, supervisors, and owners are strictly prohibited from participating in tip pools or keeping any portion of employee tips, regardless of whether a tip credit is taken.
• Notice Requirements: Employers must properly inform employees of tip pooling rules and any tip credit arrangements before implementing them.

As I said in Post No. 51, if you claim a tip credit, you can allow backstaff to participate in a tip pool, but most employers do not. Backstaff employees are not tipped employees. Personally, if I were a good server, I would not work in a restaurant where I had to share my tips with non-tipped employees, especially since tips are now tax free.

[margaretmattson]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

Here are the Florida tip pooling rules :

How Florida Minimum Wage Interacts with Tip Pooling

• Guaranteed Minimum Total Compensation: Regardless of how a tip pool is structured, the combined total of the direct cash wage paid by the employer plus the tips received by the employee must equal or exceed the full Florida minimum wage ($14.00/hour, or $15.00/hour starting September 30, 2026). If a tip pool leaves an employee short of the state minimum wage for the workweek, the employer must make up the difference.
• Using a Tip Credit vs. Full Minimum Wage:
• If taking a tip credit: Florida allows employers to take a maximum tip credit of $3.02 per hour, meaning tipped employees must be paid a direct cash wage of at least $10.98/hour (rising to $11.98/hour on September 30, 2026). Under this setup, tip pooling is strictly limited to customarily and regularly tipped front-of-house (FOH) staff (such as servers, bartenders, bussers, and food runners). Back-of-house staff (like cooks and dishwashers) cannot be included.
• If paying the full minimum wage (no tip credit): If an employer chooses to pay the full state minimum wage ($14.00/hour or $15.00/hour) without claiming a tip credit, they can establish a broader tip pool that includes back-of-house staff.
• Exclusion of Management: Managers, supervisors, and owners are strictly prohibited from participating in tip pools or keeping any portion of employee tips, regardless of whether a tip credit is taken.
• Notice Requirements: Employers must properly inform employees of tip pooling rules and any tip credit arrangements before implementing them.

As I said in Post No. 51, if you claim a tip credit, you can allow backstaff to participate in a tip pool, but most employers do not. Backstaff employees are not tipped employees. Personally, if I were a good server, I would not work in a restaurant where I had to share my tips with non-tipped employees, especially since tips are now tax free.

As I have stated several times, some dishwashers do not work in the back of the house. They are support for the waitstaff. They never enter the kitchen. They wash blenders or glassware for the bartenders, tidy up beverage or coffee stations, etc. Their job is to keep the FRONT of the house spotless. What customer wants to see coffee stains all over a beverage station, dirty blenders, or piles of dirty glassware? Who wants to see a server dirty their hands scrubbing then serve dishes of food? Cleanliness and avoiding cross contamination are also government requirements. Both in front and back of the restaurant.

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by margaretmattson

As I have stated several times, some dishwashers do not work in the back of the house. They are support for the waitstaff. They never enter the kitchen. They wash blenders or glassware for the bartenders, tidy up beverage or coffee stations, etc. Their job is to keep the FRONT of the house spotless. What customer wants to see coffee stains all over a beverage station, dirty blenders, or piles of dirty glassware? Who wants to see a server dirty their hands scrubbing then serve dishes of food? Cleanliness and avoiding cross contamination are also government requirements. Both in front and back of the restaurant.

So, if the dishwashers receive tips directly from customers, they could be considered tipped employees. But, if they only receive tip income as part of the tip pool, they are still considered back staff employees. When I eat at a restaurant, I only tip the server. Again, if I were a server working for tips, I wouldn't want to share my income with anyone. I would find another job.

[margaretmattson]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

So, if the dishwashers receive tips directly from customers, they could be considered tipped employees. But, if they only receive tip income as part of the tip pool, they are still considered back staff employees. When I eat at a restaurant, I only tip the server. Again, if I were a server working for tips, I wouldn't want to share my income with anyone. I would find another job.

I see. You have the belief that only those that are given a tip receive the full amount. In olden days, yes. Now, no! New regulations, as always, is the reason. If a waitress is caught using a rag to clean, then serves food, this is a health code violation. Waitstaff now includes more than a server.

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by MrLonzo

There's no abuse if the employee agrees to the wage. Some employees are willing to work for peanuts to get the training, experience, discipline, and the dignity of having a job. I was one of those people when I was younger.

As far as 'living wage', this society has it backwards. The government shouldn't be compelling a wage that fits the employee's lifestyle. It's up to the employee to adjust their lifestyle to their wage.

I have been in situations where I have “willingly” and “voluntarily” accepted conditions of employment because eating was more important than standing on principle. I am strongly in favor of the government mandating minimum requirements for the treatment of employees to include working conditions and minimum wage.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by jimbomaybe

Labor is one part of inflation . but what do you think $100. dollar per hr would do?

At $100/hour I could afford to dine at that restaurant. I could afford to buy more things. I could afford to pay a landscaper instead of doing the work myself. I could afford to donate more to causes I believe in. Just like Dolly Levi said:
"Money, pardon the expression, is like manure. It's not worth a thing unless it's spread around, encouraging young things to grow."

Pay me more, and I'll have more to spend. Everyone wins.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by margaretmattson

Federal law requires ALL employers to provide breaks. At least 30 minutes during an 8 hour shift or 15 minutes for a part time shift. Employers also provide benefits to their employees. No, a bartender does not automatically make more than waitstaff. My nephew works in a classy restaurant. The tips collected for the night are divided equally among the waitstaff, bar tenders, hostess, bus boys, and dish washers. Most are happy working part time. This allows them needed time to study if in college, an opportunity to create their own business via social media, or time to enjoy and travel. It is a different world than the one we grew up in. Young people make quite a good living especially if they are smart and use social media to increase their income. Quite a few earn significantly more than teachers, policemen, firemen, military, or nurses.

No, Federal law does not require breaks. It only has specific minimum standards IF an employer CHOOSES to provide breaks. IF an employee gets a 15 minute break, then that break must be paid. IF an employee is given an unpaid 30 minute meal break, but the employee has to eat at their work station, then that break must be paid.

That's the actual law. Please read the laws before you make statements about them. The very first sentence of the US Department of Labor's page about breaks and meal periods:

Federal law does not require lunch or coffee breaks.

US Dept. of Labor

[dewilson58]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

At $100/hour I could afford to dine at that restaurant. I could afford to buy more things. I could afford to pay a landscaper instead of doing the work myself. I could afford to donate more to causes I believe in. Just like Dolly Levi said:
"Money, pardon the expression, is like manure. It's not worth a thing unless it's spread around, encouraging young things to grow."

Pay me more, and I'll have more to spend. Everyone wins.

Oh OBB. Please say Sheldon.
Economically this is impossible.
(& you know this)

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by margaretmattson

I see. You have the belief that only those that are given a tip receive the full amount. In olden days, yes. Now, no! New regulations, as always, is the reason. If a waitress is caught using a rag to clean, then serves food, this is a health code violation. Waitstaff now includes more than a server.

Where are you getting this nonsense from? If I use a rag to clean a customer's table, I have to wash my hands again before touching food. That is the health requirement. There is no such health code requiring a dedicated rag-using-cleaning-person.

[margaretmattson]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

Where are you getting this nonsense from? If I use a rag to clean a customer's table, I have to wash my hands again before touching food. That is the health requirement. There is no such health code requiring a dedicated rag-using-cleaning-person.

Some restaurants, especially corporate run, find it much easier to employ a dedicated cleaner for the front of the house. They want to make certain there is no cross contamination which could cause lawsuits or a health code violation that could close the restaurant. I am getting my nonsense from younger individuals who actually work in restaurants NOW. Not only have i been told, I SEE IT IN RESTAURANTS. I am not relying on yesteryear or information I find on the internet. As my younger clan often jokingly says: " Welcome to the year 2026, old woman!"

[margaretmattson]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

No, Federal law does not require breaks. It only has specific minimum standards IF an employer CHOOSES to provide breaks. IF an employee gets a 15 minute break, then that break must be paid. IF an employee is given an unpaid 30 minute meal break, but the employee has to eat at their work station, then that break must be paid.

That's the actual law. Please read the laws before you make statements about them. The very first sentence of the US Department of Labor's page about breaks and meal periods:

US Dept. of Labor

Federal law does not require PAID breaks. I have never worked in any establishment that does not provide lunch breaks. If you have, I feel sorry for you. Your boss must have been a tyrant. Lawsuits against companies who force their employees to work during break time have been won.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by dewilson58

Oh OBB. Please say Sheldon.
Economically this is impossible.
(& you know this)

Of course it's not possible. However - someone suggested that we consider what WOULD happen if everyone got $100/hour. I'm suggesting the answer to the question, however impossible the situation might be.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by margaretmattson

Federal law does not require PAID breaks. I have never worked in any establishment that does not provide lunch breaks. If you have, I feel sorry for you. Your boss must have been a tyrant. Lawsuits against companies who force their employees to work during break time have been won.

Federal law does not require ANY breaks, paid or otherwise. Again - please read the law before making ridiculous statements.

When you make a statement about what the law requires or doesn't require, the topic becomes "what does/doesn't the law require?" You are just - flat out wrong. It's not a matter of opinion. It's not a matter of interpretation. It doesn't matter whether my employers gave me breaks or not. You state it's a matter of Federal law. I am telling you that you are wrong. I didn't merely tell you. I quoted the actual Federal website's first sentence on the subject, AND provided a link so that you can read the entire page for yourself.