[soonerforever]

Originally Posted by Bucco

I see....so firing an experienced person in that job 2 months ago, assigning the job who knows nothing about the job, allowing the firing of many or most experienced operations managers, beginning the dismantling of sorters, among other things (such as requiring delivery the same day as you take out the mail) while having the country worry about an election on which it appears we would depend greatly on the established system, was just the fix, and in two months brought it "up to current times" ?

Well, that certainly answers the question.....why now.

Sorry but the next day turnaround hasn't been in effect for the last 4 years and the dismantling of sorting equipment has been in response to the falling mail volume.
You stated also the firing of experienced operation managers-I say BRAVO...although I doubt the number you are insinuating-I worked in the second largest mail processing center in the country and It was run horribly- we routinely got retread postmasters from Chicago and other poorly ran cities to end up in worse shape than from the previous postmaster- these people were NEVER fired, just put somewhere else..this not only happened with postmasters , but also operation managers, maintenance managers, etc.
I don't know where you are getting your information from, but I would recheck it. I retired at the end of 2018, but follow what is happening from people that are still there and trust what they are saying.

[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by soonerforever

Sorry but the next day turnaround hasn't been in effect for the last 4 years and the dismantling of sorting equipment has been in response to the falling mail volume.
You stated also the firing of experienced operation managers-I say BRAVO...although I doubt the number you are insinuating-I worked in the second largest mail processing center in the country and It was run horribly- we routinely got retread postmasters from Chicago and other poorly ran cities to end up in worse shape than from the previous postmaster- these people were NEVER fired, just put somewhere else..this not only happened with postmasters , but also operation managers, maintenance managers, etc.
I don't know where you are getting your information from, but I would recheck it. I retired at the end of 2018, but follow what is happening from people that are still there and trust what they are saying.

Thanks for sharing. I do not understand people putting more trust in what the media and politicians are saying as compared to people who actually worked at the post office and can offer first hand experience.

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by soonerforever

Sorry but the next day turnaround hasn't been in effect for the last 4 years and the dismantling of sorting equipment has been in response to the falling mail volume.
You stated also the firing of experienced operation managers-I say BRAVO...although I doubt the number you are insinuating-I worked in the second largest mail processing center in the country and It was run horribly- we routinely got retread postmasters from Chicago and other poorly ran cities to end up in worse shape than from the previous postmaster- these people were NEVER fired, just put somewhere else..this not only happened with postmasters , but also operation managers, maintenance managers, etc.
I don't know where you are getting your information from, but I would recheck it. I retired at the end of 2018, but follow what is happening from people that are still there and trust what they are saying.

The question that began this was....WHY NOW

Why start turmoil just weeks before a large mail in ballot situation is to unfold. Was this not a problem before...you say it was....WHY NOW

Does not even make good business sense. Unless...

[Heyitsrick]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

The forum software doesn't need to provide it. You can do it yourself.

I'm not sure who - editorially, or otherwise - you're referring to about editing a quoted post. It's certainly not me, as I post snippets of people's posts when replying quite a bit, as witnessed by this reply.

Sometimes it may not be a matter of whether someone knows how to edit a quoted post. It could be that they just don't see the need for it, or, perhaps, that there's no salient one-liner in the quote that would constitute enough for other readers to know why they replied.

My point about the forum software is just about usability. There's plenty of software out there in the world (think of a CMS - content management system - like WordPress, for example) that can shift into "excerpt" mode when the content being posted exceeds a certain number of words or characters. At that point, you will see (if it's enabled) a "read more ..." notification. If you click/tap on that notification, the snipped content will then appear on screen. This would be especially useful for people reading in a mobile environment, such as a smartphone. It would entail much less scrolling.

Yes, everyone can edit larger posts when quoting them, but there's billions of things in the world that people can "do themselves". You can get up off the couch and manually change the channel on your TV's cable box by walking over to it, or turn the TV off/on and/or volume up/down on the TV, itself. See? You can do it yourself! But that's not usability in action.

If the person who's quoting a large post thinks there are many points made in the post that needed to be replied to as a whole, then it would be a bit tedious to quote/reply to each point. Could you do it? Sure. Does it work well to do a point-by-point quote/reply? Sometimes it does; no doubt.

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

That brings me to reiterate my previous points about this thread:

Some people are saying "get with the times, do this online" but they can't even manage to figure out how to edit a quoted post.

How about they learn how to use a simple community forum, before chastizing ANYONE who might not be as much of a genius as they are when it comes to online banking and bill paying. You (not necessarily you personally - this is the "editorial you") want everyone to get with the times? You first.

I would say this: that doesn't mean there aren't inefficiencies in the USPS system that can't be addressed. Servicing those who need USPS and keeping the organization efficient are not mutually exclusive. If there are areas (small towns / very rural environments / very poor neighborhoods, etc.) that can't be expected to access the online world at all - or as much - as many others do, then redirect USPS resources to them. But again, that hardly means that the system as a whole can't be examined for systemic inefficiencies, be them methodologies, staffing and/or logistics.

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by soonerforever

Reading is fundamental......don't know what more I can say

Right....actually, the question....WHY NOW....

Is rhetorical...I believe the answer is universally known.

[Heyitsrick]

Originally Posted by Bucco

The question that began this was....WHY NOW

Why start turmoil just weeks before a large mail in ballot situation is to unfold. Was this not a problem before...you say it was....WHY NOW

Does not even make good business sense. Unless...

My question is why are some peddling this ongoing ideological conspiracy?

Let's take a trip in the time machine back to the "WHY NOW" date of December 5, 2011. My memory's a little foggy on this, so perhaps you can remind me who was president at that time.

Here's an article from "The Atlantic", that publication that's not known for supporting our current president:

The Atlantic - Who Killed The Postal Service?

Salient quotes from that December day in 2011:

Originally Posted by The Atlantic 12/5/2011

Today, the Postal Service announced roughly $3 billion in service cuts that will slow down the delivery of first-class mail for the first time in 40 years. Starting in April, it plans to shutter more than half of its 461 mail processing centers, stretching out the time it will take to ship everything from Netflix DVDs to magazines. One-day delivery of stamped envelopes will all but certainly become a thing of the past.

Originally Posted by The Atlantic 12/5/2011

The announcement is just the latest sign of a sad and increasingly dire fact: the Postal Service is in shambles. This past fiscal year, it lost a mere $5.1 billion. In 2012, it's facing a record $14.1 billion shortfall and possible bankruptcy. In order to turn a profit, Postmaster General Patrick Donahoe says the agency needs to cut $20 billion from its annual budget by 2015. That's almost a third of its yearly costs.

How did it come to this? The culprits include the Internet, labor expenses, and, as with pretty much every problem our country faces now, Congress.

Originally Posted by The Atlantic 12/5/2011

THE INTERNET KILLED IT

In the days of yore, sending letters by mail was pretty much the most efficient way to communicate in writing. Then the Internet happened. Although total mail volume stayed relatively steady until 2006, it has dropped an astonishing 20 percent in the past five years. More important, first-class mail, the Postal Service's biggest moneymaker, has fallen 25 percent during the past decade. That's a huge problem for its bottom line. The agency now delivers far more "standard mail" -- what most of us call junk mail -- than first-class mail. According to Businessweek, it takes three pieces of junk to equal the earnings from a single stamped first-class envelope. J. Crew catalogs and pizza menus alone won't pay the bills.

Originally Posted by The Atlantic 12/5/2011

LABOR COSTS KILLED IT

Yet even as its profits have dwindled along with the mail it handles, the agency's labor costs have remained stubbornly high. Salaries and benefits make up 80 percent of the Post Office's budget. By comparison, FedEx spends 43 percent of its budget on labor, while UPS spends 63 percent, according to Businessweek. Why the disparity? As the magazine put it, "USPS has historically placed the interests of its unions first." For years, it has happily negotiated contracts with generous salary increases and no-layoff clauses.

That seems to finally be changing. As part of his budget-cutting campaign, Donahoe is looking to slash roughly 220,000 of the Postal Service's 653,000 employees. About 100,000 of those cuts would happen through attrition. Meanwhile, Donahoe has asked Congress for permission to break the no-layoff provision of the service's current contracts so it can let go the additional 120,000.

You get the picture. "WHY NOW" isn't really "now", is it? These have been ongoing issues with USPS for quite some time.

[Number 10 GI]

Originally Posted by Byte1

The USPS is just another example of a poorly managed Gov run business. The Gov. should keep it's nose out of business, since it has no clue how to manage any form of business efficiently.

The government can't even run itself efficiently and economically.

[Number 10 GI]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

That junk mail is why you only have to pay 55 cents to mail a 1-ounce standard envelope anywhere in this country.
Amazon deliveries are why the Postal Service is still up and running at all. Without their revenue they would have shut down a few years ago.

Millions of people still rely on the postal service to deliver and send actual mail. Not everyone has internet service, not everyone even lives in an area where internet service is available - even if they could afford to have a computer, laptop, tablet, or smartphone to receive and send mail and other communication.

Some segments of this country are "off the grid." The USPS is their lifeline to the outside world.

There are a number of satellite internet providers so there is no such thing as "off the grid". Most of these people who don't have a computer, laptop, tablet or smartphone have a television so if they can afford that, cheap tablets are available for less money than a TV.

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

That junk mail is why you only have to pay 55 cents to mail a 1-ounce standard envelope anywhere in this country.
Amazon deliveries are why the Postal Service is still up and running at all. Without their revenue they would have shut down a few years ago.

Millions of people still rely on the postal service to deliver and send actual mail. Not everyone has internet service, not everyone even lives in an area where internet service is available - even if they could afford to have a computer, laptop, tablet, or smartphone to receive and send mail and other communication.

Some segments of this country are "off the grid." The USPS is their lifeline to the outside world.

I don't agree that the Post Office would have "shut down" without revenue from junk mail and Amazon. Congress never shuts anything down.

[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

I don't agree that the Post Office would have "shut down" without revenue from junk mail and Amazon. Congress never shuts anything down.

Why would anyone be thinking the govt would allow the post office to shut down. At some point both parties would compromise and kick the can down the road doing what they do best, nothing.

[Number 10 GI]

Originally Posted by Malsua

So you're saying that running a business at a loss distorts the actual cost across the market for other players? Now we are getting somewhere. If people actually paid the actual costs for things, maybe the USPS wouldn't be in such a hole.

If rural delivery is such an issue, maybe people wouldn't live in a mud hut on the side of a hill in rural bumfoot and at least move closer to the hard road.

Where are you living, Africa? Mud huts, really? It is painfully obvious that you have no clue how farmers/ranchers live or in what. Those "people" living in a mud hut in rural bumfoot are the people who grow the food you put into your mouth. Some of these farms and ranches are miles from a town and from a hard road, so how are they supposed to move to a location on a hard road?

[nn0wheremann]

The post office has run on its own revenue, along with a line of credit from the Treasury Department, since 1970. Since the 1990s it has had to cover accrued pension costs 100% as well. The idea is that it should run like a business. Problem is, it is a constitutionally mandated government service, not a business. We do not expect our police or fire departments to run at a profit, like a business. Immigration and customs enforcement is not expected to run like a profitable business. We all benefit by having a post office. It’s competitors are not eager to replace it, at least not its unprofitable functions, like rural free delivery, or carrying mail and packages to those unfortunate enough to live in high crime neighborhoods. We need to get serious about government and necessary services, and throw out the clowns that are trying to destroy our government. The problem with carrying “less government” too far, is we might get stuck with just that.

[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by nn0wheremann

The post office has run on its own revenue, along with a line of credit from the Treasury Department, since 1970. Since the 1990s it has had to cover accrued pension costs 100% as well. The idea is that it should run like a business. Problem is, it is a constitutionally mandated government service, not a business. We do not expect our police or fire departments to run at a profit, like a business. Immigration and customs enforcement is not expected to run like a profitable business. We all benefit by having a post office. It’s competitors are not eager to replace it, at least not its unprofitable functions, like rural free delivery, or carrying mail and packages to those unfortunate enough to live in high crime neighborhoods. We need to get serious about government and necessary services, and throw out the clowns that are trying to destroy our government. The problem with carrying “less government” too far, is we might get stuck with just that.

I agree with most of what you said but dont you think the post office should be run more efficiently?

[Aloha1]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

I'm just glad that our bills are mailed with the USPS, and not sent via FedEx or UPS. The bill itself would increase in cost every month, because instead of 55 cents (or less for bulk mailing) the utility would be paying over $8 per household per month, JUST to send the bill.

And then if you want to send your payment by mail, instead of paying 55 cents, you'd have to pay over $8. For every single bill you choose to pay by mail.

And that's just bills. Imagine if you choose to subscribe to a paper magazine, without the USPS to deliver it to you. The cost to FedEx it to you is more than the cost of the magazine.

Without the USPS - our lives would be significantly and profoundly different from how they are now, and most people don't even think about how much we rely on the postal service, and that 55 cents per envelope.

So, let's move the base cost of postage to $1. Those that want to use the USPS to pay bills instead of free online payments can do so. The rest of us can continue to benefit from modern technology secure in the knowledge that our payment was received. Oh, and most magazines now come digitally. Problem solved.

[Aloha1]

Originally Posted by BarryD

Postmaster General (PMG) Actions (Making Mail Slower)
• Forbes reports that PMG dismantled and removed over 600 sorting machines, which each process 35,000 pieces of mail per hour. Forget any claim of innocence you may hear.
• PMG prohibited overtime and (replacement) hiring despite staffing shortages from COVID-19.
• Former Attorney General, Eric Holder said that anyone who “willfully obstructs or retards the passage of the mail” can face fines and imprisonment of up to six months. .

And herein is the rub to your argument. The USPS is facing a severe financial deficit because of all that you posted above. The Postmaster General has an OBLIGATION to do what needs to be done to reduce costs since Congress ( AKA the House) has failed for years to appropriate the necessary monies to keep USPS solvent. As to the sorting machines, they are ancient technology with multiple mechanical parts prone to breakdown. New digital sorters are being installed as funds allow. As to mailboxes, we all know now that many were simply being replaced with new boxes and others were being removed because their use was below the base standards set by USPS. Anyone who gets mail can also PUT mail there to be delivered elsewhere.

This whole Kabuki Theatre issue of some nefarious goings on is, as Shakespeare put it, "A tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing".