[rubicon]

This thread is beginning to get depressing

[jebartle]

You cut the palm about 2 inches below the ground....Hate those Palms!

[Ozzello]

Originally Posted by Laurie2

Ozzello, thank you for starting this thread.

As a recent owner of a pre-owned home, I have been learning as much as I can about our landscaping.

I have fertilized our pre-owned palms twice in the past year and they seem happy about it. (I buy the official palm fertilizer.)

I did not get the fall fertilization done yet and I was late on the last one. (early August)

I know they should not be fertilized so close to the winter months but if I rush around today in a fertilizing frenzy, is that OK?

It is time-release -- I think. Whatever it is was recommended by the extension agent. And September had lots of rain. My northern gardener instinct is telling me to go ahead but to hurry up.

All I know for sure is that they are green not yellow and seem glad to see me.

I wonder about the various types of palms that I see turning yellow in yards where they must have cost a lot to put in, and now just look sad. Is it that manganese thing?

Would you please post about specifics of palm fertilization? (I use the same fertiliizer for all of them. Two are queens.)

Thank you.

Hello Laurie, and you're welcome.

Hope I posted in time to say NOOOO. I like to error on the side of caution. That late fertilization could cause new growth that could damage easier during winter.

The yellow is possibly a lack of nutrients, but there are lots of other common causes (Newly planted and someone missed the water schedule a few weeks prior, air pocket UNDER the root ball, et al).
Palms use equal amounts of manganese and magnesium with a small amount of iron to grow and be green. I like using micro nutrients to supplement the palm fertilizer, or doubling up the recommended feeding but NEVER on a newly planted tree that was dug (If it came out of a pot is fine (wait about a year for TRANSPLANTS). Have yet to see an established palm get fertilizer burn, and I have tried really hard to do so.

Thank you for your questions, hope I was of help

[Ozzello]

Originally Posted by rubicon

This thread is beginning to get depressing

Give me some time Rubicon, there is light at the end of the tunnel.

[Ozzello]

Originally Posted by Bubble Gum

Sorry, but I must disagree with you on many of your defenses of palm trees versus real trees.

While palms do provide a little shade, in order for them to provide a real shade canopy, they would have to be massed. You never see anyone sitting under a plam tree because of the shade they provide.

Any tree, shade, flowering or otherwise, will always require significantly less maintenance and expense than that of a palm. Most trees do not have to be trimmed often, if at all over the course of many years. Most trees do not have invasive root system; the real key is that they be planted in the proper location where being invasive isn't a problem. Borers, gall, etc. are not found that often and lichens and moss which are epiphytic, hurt nothing.

Queen plams are probably the least expensive palm anyone could buy. The Villages is a borderline geographic area and they really shouldn't be planted here. In addition, they really are trash trees. The U of F does not recommend planting them anywhere. In addition, cockroaches love them and live in them along with other insects and rats. The same is true for many other palms, as well. Landscapers love Queen palms because they are cheap. They talk newcomers into them because to a new resident, they represent the tropical look they never had.

Birds can live without palm trees but would die off without real trees. Trees provide food for humans and other wildlife. Trees will shade your house and help keep electric costs down.


I could continue but won't. I just feel sorry for anyone who has 9 Queen palms. That's what got me started!

"Come into my parlor, said the spider to the fly"

Well Bubblegum, thank you for your post. Where do I start? Heck the beginning seems logical.

1a. I won't just defend queen palms, but anything/one I see falling victim to untruths and/or opinions stated as fact ( a narcissistic trait, I might add)
1b. This is "The Truth About Queen Palms" thread, not" Palms vs 'Real' trees". What is a REAL tree anyway, in your opinion, or heck Bubblegum, state some facts if you got em.

2. 2nd paragraph is not even worth my time.

3a. Any 'real tree' tree vs any palm is always less maintenance? Um. Sylvesters, pindos and most of the date (Phoenix)
varieties will grow for years without fronds turning brown. There are also self pruning palms.
I know people spending $1000s to rake leaves every year. Are the repairs to my home an oak limb fall through the roof considered maintenance?
3b. Palm roots stay about the same diameter for the life the tree. Other trees or "real" trees, have roots that grow outward and get larger in diameter gradually for the life of three. I am sure you have all seen the upheaval of roads, sidewalks and even home foundations. Unless planted too close to something, the palms don't do this.. I won't use a term as broad as "ALL" the other trees, but most all regular trees will.

OK, this is feeling like a good deed turning into work, going to hit some golf balls.
I will complete my rebuttal of Bubblegum's post in the near future, at my leisure

3c. Tree bores ARE common in FL. I see damage on more than half of the soft woods (maple, birch, dogwood, elm) over 3" in caliper.
3d Ball moss and lichens are epiphytic (meaning they live on the surface) but they are far from harmless. They bore into the cambium layer beneath the bark and like a leech, suck the nutrients out of the plant. Doubtful they would ever completely kill the tree (leaving themselves homeless and hungry), but once established, lichen and ball moss would render impossible the plant/tree ever being healthy.

4a. Yes, queens are less expensive per size than other palms.
4b TV is not borderline, it is the zone furthest north the Dept. of Agriculture recommends.
4c. A trash tree? Man you have some real hate issues going on here.
4d. Spent several hours reviewing Prof. Broschat, T. K of UF and what he has written on Queen Palms. He said the tree is fine in zone 9b. Zone 9b is where we are in The Villages.
4e. Cockroaches bugs and rats? Never have I found rats or mice in a queen palm, though I HAVE seen plenty in oak trees. And to continue this comparison..WAY more bugs in the oaks as well. Now the sable palmetto palm is another story. The frond boots hold a lot of thatch and debris, making them a great hgome for palmetto bugs..or cockroaches as you call them.

5a. Wow again. Lots of birds live in palm tree canopies and trunks. Just like 'other trees', palms make fruit and house insects, lizards etc. for the birds to feed on.
5b. Palms DO have shade, depending on what kind of palm as to the density. The good part about palm shade, is the canopy stops expanding at some point and only grows up, eliminating large limbs growing out over the home.

[billethkid]

Originally Posted by CFrance

If you bit the bullet and had them removed, would you save in the long run? Would you need to have stump grinding done?

Most likely will need to be ground out...depending how close to the ground they can get. The next time they come for trimming I will get a price to remove.
If reasonable, then the battle will be with my wife.....and I stand a good chance of losing this one!!

[Ozzello]

Originally Posted by Chi-Town

Have you noticed that the developer does not plant Queen palms? That speaks volumes.

What developer? The home builder, golf course or common areas?

The home builder is required by The State of FL building code to plant 1 or more (depending on lot size) native trees with a minimum trunk size. A native palm would be expensive compared to other trees
I have noticed many of these code trees are not native. The dwarf magnolias, oak leaf holly, and crepe myrtle are not native. The oaks and East Palatka holly are natives.

Golf Course developers plant a lot of Sable palms , Silver Saw Palmetto, Washingtonia . In the commercial venue, these palms cost less than Queen palms. You will see a few Queens, Phoenix varieties and other palms on the golf courses though on the upscale courses.

The common areas developer plants the palm trees according to the Landscape Architect and what is available in his area. Most of the licensed Landscape Architects near here are in Gainesville and Jacksonville, where it is too cold for queen palms.

[Ozzello]

Originally Posted by billethkid

Most likely will need to be ground out...depending how close to the ground they can get. The next time they come for trimming I will get a price to remove.
If reasonable, then the battle will be with my wife.....and I stand a good chance of losing this one!!

The best way to remove the tree, is to keep 8 to 10 feet of trunk, dig around the stump and remove stump, using the trunk for leverage.
The frugal way is to cut low and grind, leaving the root ball preventing you from planting anything large enough to balance a landscape design where a tree was needed.

[Chi-Town]

Originally Posted by Ozzello

What developer? The home builder, golf course or common areas?

Basically one and the same as far as say so.

[perrjojo]

I have lived in Texas with no trees, Georgia with too many trees, and Florida with palm trees. Each sitituation has it's plus and minus. Personally I love my palm trees....even the Queens.

[Ozzello]

Originally Posted by Chi-Town

Basically one and the same as far as say so.

Again Chi, everyone has an opinion. You for your home, the landscape arch for his design.... Really looking to talk facts here. 'The developer' of every home , golf course and common area in TV is NOT one and the same, not even close.
And, often.. they DO plant queen palms.

[tommy steam]

Originally Posted by Ozzello

I saw that, but the post is just a cheap shot at some free publicity.

Just curious, why are you giving all this information on queen palms? When I talked to the master gardeners here, they told me not to plant those palms in this area because of all the problems associated with them.

[Mikeod]

Originally Posted by Ozzello

I saw that, but the post is just a cheap shot at some free publicity.

Not at all. Sponsors like this one pay so the rest of us can enjoy the board without charge. Their post provided a source for the fertilizer recommended by Master gardeners and the UF extension. A lot of the Palm fertilizer sold doesn't have all the micronutrients to keep them healthy. Nice to know where I can get it, even delivered.

[Ozzello]

Originally Posted by mikeod

Not at all. Sponsors like this one pay so the rest of us can enjoy the board without charge. Their post provided a source for the fertilizer recommended by Master gardeners and the UF extension. A lot of the Palm fertilizer sold doesn't have all the micronutrients to keep them healthy. Nice to know where I can get it, even delivered.

Actually, all palm fertilizers have those same nutrients. I use the same stuff and buy it at Wal mart for less than half of the $48 bucks.

I know he pays to advertise on this site, but the threads and posts themselves are supposed to be free of people advertising, according to ToTV.

[Ozzello]

Originally Posted by tommy steam

Just curious, why are you giving all this information on queen palms? When I talked to the master gardeners here, they told me not to plant those palms in this area because of all the problems associated with them.

If you go back to the beginning post, I stated why. Because there is a lot of mis-information floating around lately about Queen Palms. I base my posts here on my education and 40 years of experience, not someone else's opinion, most likely from another geographical zone.

So, how many master gardener's did you speak to? Out of curiosity. Though I know the Master Gardner's course is put on by UF, in Gainseville, zone what..8 or 7? Last time a mature Queen palm froze in this area, was back in the 80s after TWO 100 year/cycle freezes back to back. We lost about 1-2%. I am aplant guy, not a math guy though, so not sure on the odds of another 2- 100 year freezes hitting this area , 2 years in a row.