[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725

Emily St. John Mandel's novel Station Eleven goes a lot into cult like thinking. It is set partially in the US after a flu wipes out most people in the world and leaves some towns to cults that develop because of the lack of law and order. There is a travelling group of actors and musicians who travel through some of these towns. They are a big part of the novel.

It might be a good read for this friend's granddaughter. It was a National Book Award finalist around 2014.


Also very well written and thoughtful about just about everything. Is one of the really deep books you find once in a great while.

Well-written post-apocalyptic dystopian novels are awesome, one of my favorite genres.

If she's a reader and this was suggested, it might very well plant that seed of doubt for her. From there, she could have the inspiration she needs to explore her "need" to affiliate with this cult.

[Midnight Cowgirl]

Originally Posted by GrumpyOldMan

Before we go too far down the road of "Baker Act" lets not forget that the person is a 27 year old, an adult, and has the right to her own beliefs.

Yes, Grumpy -- that is true. Everyone does have a right to believe in whatever they choose to believe in.

However, the Baker Act has nothing to do with age and possibly what someone believes in; it depends upon a bunch of things.
Regardless of how old a person is, if someone meets certain criteria, they can be Baker Acted.

[Taltarzac725]

Originally Posted by Midnight Cowgirl

Yes, Grumpy -- that is true. Everyone does have a right to believe in whatever they choose to believe in.

However, the Baker Act has nothing to do with age and possibly what someone believes in; it depends upon a bunch of things.
Regardless of how old a person is, if someone meets certain criteria, they can be Baker Acted.

It is usually whether the person is a danger to others and/or herself for the Baker Act to kick in. And then there is an adjudication if the patient needs further institutionalization made by an impartial judge.

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[krash]

Some say that The Villages is like living in a cult....

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[Taltarzac725]

The most infamous cults in history - INSIDER

This is an interesting read about dangerous cults in recent history. There have been a large number of cults throughout history. Many now established religions started as cults.

[MorTech]

By definition, religion is a cult as well as government worship.
Playing "follow the leader" and obeying external authorities are cultish.
Free-thinking individualism is, by definition, the anti-cult.

To deprogram a cultist/collectivist/tribalist you have to force them into "survival pressure" situations in order for them to use the authority of their own mind. Good luck with that...It is very diffi-cult.

[GrumpyOldMan]

Originally Posted by Midnight Cowgirl

Yes, Grumpy -- that is true. Everyone does have a right to believe in whatever they choose to believe in.

However, the Baker Act has nothing to do with age and possibly what someone believes in; it depends upon a bunch of things.
Regardless of how old a person is, if someone meets certain criteria, they can be Baker Acted.

Yes, I further down mentioned being a danger to ones self or others and if they are not, I have an issue with "deprogramming" someone against their will.

[ColdNoMore]

Originally Posted by GrumpyOldMan

Yes, I further down mentioned being a danger to ones self or others and if they are not, I have an issue with "deprogramming" someone against their will.

Therein lies the conundrum.

"Danger to oneself or others," is typically defined as imminent/immediate physical danger by most, yet when that 'danger' manifests itself into harm that isn't necessarily immediately physical and will affect a larger group at some point down the road...then that's when 20/20 hindsight comes into play.

From Jim Jones, to the Westboro Baptist Church, to fascists like Mussolini/Hitler, to various religious entities, the term 'cultist' (by the member) is usually, at first, eschewed...and even vociferously/angrily/irately denied.

I certainly don't have the definitive answer, but I'm finding through research and the plethora of viewpoints and opinions (both by layman and professionals) on the subject...to be quite fascinating.

[ColdNoMore]

On an additional note, I am finding more and more with my research, that the quote I had in my original post of commonalities among cults...is almost scarily dead on.

For those that missed it...here it is again.

How Cults Manipulate People

Many people now agree that cults frequently psychologically manipulate their membership to ensure conformity and control. Steve Hassan's excellent book "Combating Cult Mind-Control" is a great starting point. The following points come from numerous sources. Not all of these are found in every cult but enough of them are found in most cults to make them very frightening places that inflict deep psychological damage on their membership.

1. Submission to Leadership - Leaders tend to be absolute, prophets of God, God Himself, specially anointed apostle, or just a strong, controlling, manipulative person who demands submission even if changes or conflicts occur in ideology or behavior.

2. Polarized World View - The group is all that is good; everything outside is bad.

3. Feeling Over Thought - Emotions, intuitions, mystical insights are promoted as more important than rational conclusions.

4. Manipulation of Feelings - Techniques designed to stimulate emotions, usually employing group dynamics to influence responses.

5. Denigration of Critical Thinking - Can go so far as to characterize any independent thought as selfish, and rational use of intellect as evil.

6. Salvation or Fulfillment can only be realized in the group.

7. End Justifies the Means - Any action or behavior is justifiable as long as it furthers the group's goals. The group (leader) becomes absolute truth and is above all man-made laws.

8. Group Over Individual - The group's concerns supersede an individual's goals, needs, aspirations, and concerns. Conformity is the key.

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by ColdNoMore

On an additional note, I am finding more and more with my research, that the quote I had in my original post of commonalities among cults...is almost scarily dead on.

For those that missed it...here it is again.

I have read two books, and several items on Jim Jones and Jonestown. Two things stand out....

Cult behavior almost always begins with the very best of intentions. Even these folks who followed Jones did good work at the beginning. Then

Gaslighting seems to be a required ingredient for establishing total control.

Once established the cult members hear nothing at all except themselves and their leaders. And remember, cult members all begin thinking they are doing good. Gaslighting them then corrodes and corrupts.