[tomwed]

Originally Posted by Bonny

Michael Jackson definitely comes to mind. Sometimes it's really sad.

thanks, you're right
I forgot about him.
They say that men in Japan go a little bit crazy after they succeeded. They say they work so hard, right through adolescence and the teenage years they make up for lost time later.

I can't relate to that. My grades weren't so good.

[mickey100]

Originally Posted by Dr Winston O Boogie jr

Yea, that tiny little murder thing.

It's amazing that you can seriously equate someone who uses bad language with someone who stabbed two people to death.

The hate for Tiger is simply astounding. And this post demonstrates it.

I think we all know where the hate is coming from, and its not because he let's loose some swear words on the golf course (like many other players do).

[rustyp]

Just ask yourself - what would you tell your children ? Emulate Tiger or Jorden?

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Originally Posted by Polar Bear

So Doc, there is nobody in all of sport that you simply have a bit of an issue with?

I wish Tiger no ill fortune. But He doesn't have to be one of my favorites either. "Cheating on his wife" is a gross understatement. Few golfers or other athletes have his frequency of foul mouth and angry attitude if all doesn't go his way. He rarely admits that he was simply beaten...it's always if-only-this or if-only-that.

I truly hope Tiger does well...in life and in golf. But pardon me if I look elsewhere for athletes that I have a natural inclination to support.

Evidently, you've never been on a professional sports field. If you had, you would make such a silly statement as this. Foul language and anger in sports is very common. Less so in golf because the USGA and PGA clamp down on it.

As far as him making excuses, I don't know what interviews you're listening to. Every time I hear him, he talks about how he didn't do this or that he putted poorly or that he didn't get it done. He also often complements his opponents.

When Darren Clarke beat him in the match play event a number of years ago, many of the reporters were surprised. He stated that he was surprised at all because he knows how great a player Darren is.

I've never heard him complain that he somehow got some bad break or that the course was unfair or that he had a bad lie. He always puts the blame on himself. Maybe that's what you consider if only this or only that, but what he almost always says is that if he had putted better or drove it better or played better he could have won. I don't consider that as making excuses.

[pivo]

Dr. Boogie---You say I Hate Tiger-- No I dislike Tiger.
And my point is as you said he loves Vonn and his kids, please explain how you know this.
I said prior that's what they said about O.J. he loved his kids too much to kill his wife
I suspect you said the same thing about O.J.
All I can say watching Tiger for years lose his temper about every tournament he's in
I think he can get very nasty and physical , even though he loves his kids and mistress,

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Originally Posted by rustyp

Just ask yourself - what would you tell your children ? Emulate Tiger or Jorden?

Tiger has faults, no doubt about that. I don't condone or defend his bad language, but I do understand it. It's not uncommon in professional sports. Tiger is caught a lot more because he's on camera a lot more than most players. And lately, he's been hitting a lot more bad shots than he's used to.

Jordan Spieth is a fine player and a mature young man. He conducts himself very well. Most people said the same thing about Tiger before the incident with his wife.

I can tell you that I don't know of anyone that works harder at golf than Tiger. I can also tell you that I've seen him around groups of kids doing clinics and signing autographs and he's great with them.

He sought and received help for his sex problems. From what I understand, he is very sorry for what happened and has mended his ways. Lindsey Vonn would not be around for so long if she didn't think that he was sincere about that.

Maybe he should seek some help in controlling his emotions and not using foul language. But I don't think that even that would deter some people from hating him.

[Polar Bear]

Originally Posted by Dr Winston O Boogie jr

Evidently, you've never been on a professional sports field. If you had, you would make such a silly statement as this. Foul language and anger in sports is very common. Less so in golf because the USGA and PGA clamp down on it....

I would put my experience on pro sports fields up against yours any day. And speaking of making silly statements...your acceptance and enabling of Tiger's behavior takes the cake.

You bet athletes swear and display anger, but the vast majority know how to control it and avoid having their occasional failures displayed to the world. Tiger just doesn't care. He thinks he's above it all. You appear to agree. I don't.

I also agree with what others have said and I've avoided chiming in on...you give yourself far too much credit for knowing what Tiger thinks and what he does behind the scenes. He may be a saint for all we know, but his demeanor and actions in front of an interview camera are no indication.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Originally Posted by pivo

Dr. Boogie---You say I Hate Tiger-- No I dislike Tiger.
And my point is as you said he loves Vonn and his kids, please explain how you know this.
I said prior that's what they said about O.J. he loved his kids too much to kill his wife
I suspect you said the same thing about O.J.
All I can say watching Tiger for years lose his temper about every tournament he's in
I think he can get very nasty and physical , even though he loves his kids and mistress,

While I wouldn't say that I'm an acquaintance of Tiger. I have met him and I know people that are close to him. But, I only say this about Vonn because she has stuck by him for a long time. I doubt that she would put up with the traits that you imagine he has.

And you say that you have watched him lose his temper in just about every tournament he's in. Really? Every tournament he's in? I'd say those incidents are few and far between. It seems that once again, you and I watch two different broadcasts of the same events.

Yes, he gets angry at himself on the golf course ands wear his heart on his sleeve. Different players deal with the stress and disappointment of professional golf in different ways. Some find that it is in their best interest to not express themselves, to try to control their anger and pretend that they are not angry. Some like Tiger and many others before him vent. It helps them to calm down and prepare for the next shot.

His anger on the golf course is always directed at himself, never at another person or external conditions. He gets angry, frustrated might actually be a better word, because he has worked so hard to become a great player. Again, I don't think that most people understand what he goes through to accomplish what he has. It has to be very frustrating to spend all of those hours in the gym, at the range and everything else to then hit a horrible shot in an important competition. There is absolutely nothing to indicate that he has any kind of anger issues off the course. There is nothing to indicate that he's ever directed his anger toward anyone but himself.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Originally Posted by Polar Bear

I would put my experience on pro sports fields up against yours any day. And speaking of making silly statements...your acceptance and enabling of Tiger's behavior takes the cake.

You bet athletes swear and display anger, but the vast majority know how to control it and avoid having their occasional failures displayed to the world. Tiger just doesn't care. He thinks he's above it all. You appear to agree. I don't.

I also agree with what others have said and I've avoided chiming in on...you give yourself far too much credit for knowing what Tiger thinks and what he does behind the scenes. He may be a saint for all we know, but his demeanor and actions in front of an interview camera are no indication.

I would not be willing to put my experience on professional sports fields up against yours as I have no idea who you are. You could be Bo Jackson for all I know. Funny that you're willing to do it no knowing who I am or what my background is. But I do know that I have been on a lot professional sports fields and I have always heard a lot of foul language. Maybe your experience is different.

Again, we evidently watch two different series of interviews. I see him calmly answering questions and and taking responsibility for himself pretty much all the time.

And for the record, I don't enable Tiger's foul language. I'd have to be a lot closer to him in order to do that.

But you are right, he may be a saint off the field but you don't know that. But, you and many people here seem to assume that he's not because he occasionally gets caught using a bad word or displaying his anger on the course in very stressful situations.

[Polar Bear]

Originally Posted by Dr Winston O Boogie jr

...he may be a saint off the field but you don't know that. But, you and many people here seem to assume that he's not because he occasionally gets caught using a bad word or displaying his anger on the course in very stressful situations.

Your blind support for Tiger is showing. My problems with Tiger have either been extremely well documented, or on display for all to see. No assumptions have ever been necessary.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Originally Posted by rustyp

Just ask yourself - what would you tell your children ? Emulate Tiger or Jorden?

After I thought about this for a while, it occurred to me that if my kids ever got caught in some bad behavior, I would hope that they would emulate Tiger in that they would own up to it, apologize to everyone that they hurt, seek help and not repeat the behavior. I think that Tiger did all of this with a lot of class. He didn't blame anyone. Although it's very well known on the tour that one of the biggest problems a lot of these kids face is beautiful women throwing themselves at them he never brought that up. He took responsibility for his actions and changed his ways.

Kind of like " You are forgiven. Go forth and do not sin again".

[jblum315]

Well, it's over and Tiger didn't even come close to winning, but he didn't disgrace himself either.

[Dr Winston O Boogie jr]

Originally Posted by Polar Bear

Your blind support for Tiger is showing. My problems with Tiger have either been extremely well documented, or on display for all to see. No assumptions have ever been necessary.

I don't know how well documented any of it is, unless to call people posting their opinions on forums like this documentation. And as far as being on display for everyone to see, not everyone sees these things the same way. You can read whatever you want into things that are said or the way they are said or the way that you take them to be said. That doesn't mean that they are true.

Like I say, I know people who know Tiger. Some of them have been in his inner circle. None of them have the opinion of him that the Tiger haters have.

[Polar Bear]

Originally Posted by Dr Winston O Boogie jr

I don't know how well documented any of it is, unless to call people posting their opinions on forums like this documentation. And as far as being on display for everyone to see, not everyone sees these things the same way. You can read whatever you want into things that are said or the way they are said or the way that you take them to be said. That doesn't mean that they are true.

Like I say, I know people who know Tiger. Some of them have been in his inner circle. None of them have the opinion of him that the Tiger haters have.

First of all, if you're including me in the Tiger-hater crowd, I am not. Read my posts. I have wished him no ill and in fact have stated I wish him well. But I don't think you'll be satisfied until I lobby for his sainthood. Don't hold your breath.

Again, you appear to be blind to the facts. His actions have been extremely well documented and and first-hand visible to all.

[dolpterry]

For the people who think Tiger is so great because of his charitable organizations, I do give him credit for them. But you must realize they are all setup by his group of advisors and are a huge tax write off, he may get name credit for them but just how much doe's he really do himself. I must say this is the same with most high end athletes in all sports and not just Tiger. But not a reason to put him on a pedestal.