[Rainger99]

Should it have been a penalty?

And should it be two strokes?

One for causing it to move?
And one for not replacing it?

If you don’t see it move, how can you replace it?

And not every shot of every player is shown close up on camera. Players should be treated equally.


British Open: Shane Lowry penalized 2 shots in golf rules conundrum - Yahoo Sports

[retiredguy123]

The rule is the rule. Personally, I agree with the ruling. The video is very clear that the player caused the ball to move. It's a game with rules.

[BrianL99]

Originally Posted by Rainger99

Should it have been a penalty?

And should it be two strokes?

One for causing it to move?
And one for not replacing it?

If you don’t see it move, how can you replace it?

And not every shot of every player is shown close up on camera. Players should be treated equally.


British Open: Shane Lowry penalized 2 shots in golf rules conundrum - Yahoo Sports

The rule is perfectly clear.

See USGA (& adopted by the R&A) Decision 33-7/4.5 adopted April 2011 & Decision 18/4 adopted effective 1/1/14.

The ball moved.

Also see definition of "moved" USGA Rules [Definitions]

Moved

"When your ball at rest has left its original spot and come to rest on any other spot, and this can be seen by the naked eye (whether or not anyone actually sees it do so).

This applies whether your ball has gone up, down or horizontally in any direction away from its original spot.

If your ball only wobbles (sometimes referred to as oscillating) and stays on or returns to its original spot, your ball has not moved."

[Taltarzac725]

His practice swing was too close.

[Rainger99]

He said that he didn't see it move. If not for the camera, there would not have been a penalty. If every player has a camera focused on every shot and every practice swing, it would be a fair ruling. The vast majority of players do not have a camera focused on every shot or practice swing. He shouldn't be penalized if he is in a marquee group.

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by Rainger99

He said that he didn't see it move. If not for the camera, there would not have been a penalty. If every player has a camera focused on every shot and every practice swing, it would be a fair ruling. The vast majority of players do not have a camera focused on every shot or practice swing. He shouldn't be penalized if he is in a marquee group.

There shouldn't be marquee groups. Every player should be treated equally. You even said so in your original post.

[Rainger99]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

There shouldn't be marquee groups. Every player should be treated equally. You even said so in your original post.

But there are marquee groups. The issue is should they be treated differently and held to a higher standard than the rest of the field.

Does anyone know who reported it?

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by Rainger99

But there are marquee groups. The issue is should they be treated differently and held to a higher standard than the rest of the field.

Does anyone know who reported it?

The answer is to get rid of marquee groups. The pairings should be selected randomly. That is how you treat all players equally.

But the player caused the ball to move. What difference does it make how it was reported?

[Tvflguy]

I know - rules are rules. But if I was Golf King I'd allow a bit of flex in this one. A ball rotates 1degree and a closeup camera catches it. Or a bunker back swing hits a grain of sand.... then it takes 10+minutes for a rule official to judge. Yikes enough already. Was the touch intentional? Did it affect play or benefit the player in ANY way? I'm all for some flex on this.

Don't' hate me - just MO.

[BrianL99]

Originally Posted by Rainger99

He said that he didn't see it move. If not for the camera, there would not have been a penalty. If every player has a camera focused on every shot and every practice swing, it would be a fair ruling. The vast majority of players do not have a camera focused on every shot or practice swing. He shouldn't be penalized if he is in a marquee group.

Originally Posted by Rainger99

But there are marquee groups. The issue is should they be treated differently and held to a higher standard than the rest of the field.

Does anyone know who reported it?

Originally Posted by Tvflguy

I know - rules are rules. But if I was Golf King I'd allow a bit of flex in this one. A ball rotates 1degree and a closeup camera catches it. Or a bunker back swing hits a grain of sand.... then it takes 10+minutes for a rule official to judge. Yikes enough already. Was the touch intentional? Did it affect play or benefit the player in ANY way? I'm all for some flex on this.

Don't' hate me - just MO.

The Rules specifically address all of the above and have for many years.

Lowry made a mistake. He never should have made a practice swing, anywhere near that golf ball.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by BrianL99

The Rules specifically address all of the above and have for many years.

Lowry made a mistake. He never should have made a practice swing, anywhere near that golf ball.

Exactly. Sometimes the rules are harsh----Dustin Johnston in the "bunker" on 18 at whistling straights costing him a major, Lexi with the infamous 4 shot penalty. Other times the players use the rules to great advantage---Robert McIntyre's so called sprinkler head at last year's Scottish open, Tiger having 20 people move a boulder.

Golf sometimes is inherently unfair---think about who had significantly better weather this week---obviously the late-early group. Given the way Scotties ball was skidding after great shots, I think he would have been 2-3 shots better without the rain--but that's the random element.

So those that are looking for fairness in TV coverage, keep in mind that coverage is a show, and people do not want to see 18 holes of James Hong. They want to see Scottie and Rory, Xander and JT---hence "marquis groups". Yes, the cameras may catch something that they wouldn't on the first group out, but those players also make tens of millions.

[retiredguy123]

///

[dewilson58]

At the end of every round, I assess myself a two stroke penalty just in case I missed something.

[SHIBUMI]

A rule is a rule, once it is known to be broken, it is broken

Patrick Reed in bunker, if not seen would have never called on self

Once a crime is committed any evidence will create a penalty.

Golf Coverage and announcers are unimpressive, uninspiring, too bad, but thats a rule of life, things change, hate the marquee groups want to see shots not someone eating a banana or health food drink. Cover the good shots.

Originally Posted by Rainger99

Should it have been a penalty?

And should it be two strokes?

One for causing it to move?
And one for not replacing it?

If you don’t see it move, how can you replace it?

And not every shot of every player is shown close up on camera. Players should be treated equally.


British Open: Shane Lowry penalized 2 shots in golf rules conundrum - Yahoo Sports

[txfan]

Yes, I agree with the penalty. The only problem with it is he wasn't stopped from hitting the shot quickly enough to incur only a one-shot penalty.

These guys get a lot of benefits that we wouldn't get:
If they hit it into the grandstands, free drop with no penalty. Us? No grandstands. Play it down.
If they hit behind the grandstands, free drop with no penalty. Us? What grandstands? Play it down.
When they hit it off course in the deep weeds, etc., there are spotters who mark the location, so the player doesn't lose his/her ball. Us? Good luck finding any ball we hit into that stuff without knowing how far downrange it went, or how far off course it went.

Especially on a Links course, there are plenty of visual cues for the pros, like grandstands, camera towers, crowds, that help in sight lines. Us? An empty field with what may look like a sliver of mown area to hit toward.

They have caddies. Us? Maybe sometimes.

Golf is the one sport with a unique honor system to call penalties on oneself. The scrutiny of the camera angles is the only way to protect the integrity of the game. If he'd been granted immunity from that penalty, the rest of the field would've questioned the ruling relative to their own positions on the leaderboard.

Did the ball movement make a difference in his shot? No. Was the integrity of the game of Golf protected, yes.