[Rainger99]

I understand that a rule was broken. But golf continually changes and updates the rules.

What was the purpose of the rule? Was it intentional? Did Lowry gain any advantage from breaking the rule?

Rules are changed.

About five years ago golf changed the rule for replacing a ball that moves on the putting green.

If the committee finds that it wasn’t intentional and that there was no advantage, should this rule be changed?

And finally, are rulings like this good for the game and do they grow the game?

[BrianL99]

Originally Posted by Rainger99

I understand that a rule was broken. But golf continually changes and updates the rules.

What was the purpose of the rule? Was it intentional? Did Lowry gain any advantage from breaking the rule?

Rules are changed.

About five years ago golf changed the rule for replacing a ball that moves on the putting green.

If the committee finds that it wasn’t intentional and that there was no advantage, should this rule be changed?

And finally, are rulings like this good for the game and do they grow the game?

Here you go.

Rules for beginners & those who don't like the real rules.

[CoachKandSportsguy]

I have played/ fun and competed against professionals and they all know the rules, they all know the grey areas, and most play to the dark edge of the grey area, for the psychological perceived advantage. Some go over the dark edge, most don't.

But sports requires rules and officials because the game is played with humans. . .

The problem is that there are many ways to cheat, The problem i have with the golf rules is even when I am being honest, not trying to cheat, and I don't see something / i don't feel something, someone else tells me it happened and i get penalized, it appears to me to be just a different point of view. . . remember, its not cheating if you truly believe it didn't happen. . .

John Cook related when a course official came up to him and assessed him a penalty for double hit out of a bunker. Cookie just said, "I never felt it, but whatever you say" Sometimes it just comes down to a different viewing angle to interpret the infraction. again, humans interpreting the rules from a different point of view. sometimes one angle of view can see it and another can't see it.

Golf rules were created when there was no TV cameras, no officials, and just two to four golfers together. . . so the origin of rules makes sense. How they are held over today / with cameras etc, may mean adjusting a few . .

but either way, penalty or no penalty, the golfer still must make the shot. . .

[BrianL99]

Originally Posted by CoachKandSportsguy

Golf rules were created when there was no TV cameras, no officials, and just two to four golfers together. . . so the origin of rules makes sense. How they are held over today / with cameras etc, may mean adjusting a few . .

They are constantly adjusted and were twice adjusted specifically to address your points above. Once in 2011 and again in 2014.

[CoachKandSportsguy]

Originally Posted by BrianL99

They are constantly adjusted and were twice adjusted specifically to address your points above. Once in 2011 and again in 2014.

not disagreeing, just my opinion is that there will still be more changes, not that the prior two are the only two/last two

[BrianL99]

Originally Posted by CoachKandSportsguy

not disagreeing, just my opinion is that there will still be more changes, not that the prior two are the only two/last two

You're right. It keeps getting more and more complicated. The 18 Rules have Golf have now been modified to 1000's of pages of interpretations and decisions.

Here's an example of crazy rules.

Par 4 over a hill. Landing zone is over the hill and blind to the Tee Box. Water hazard over the hill, towards the right side.

Player A crushes it over the hill and says, "****, probably reached the water".

Player B hits it over the hill, closer to the center of the fairway.

Both players walk to their respective landing areas.

Player A announces that he's found his ball, safe. Player B is still looking for his.

Player A hits his approach shot onto the Green.

Player B can't find his ball. No evidence it went into the hazard, so he goes back to the Tee and hits Shot #3.

Player B hits his approach onto the Green, closer than Player A.

Player A goes to make his putt and announces he hit the wrong ball in the fairway and the ball he hit to the Green, is actually Player B's ball.

Sort it out for scoring purposes

[USN-Retired]

Originally Posted by dewilson58

At the end of every round, I assess myself a two stroke penalty just in case I missed something.

So you’re padding your handicap?🤔🤔

[SHIBUMI]

Match Play.... B wins the hole, Player A gone minute he hit b's ball even if found out later

Originally Posted by BrianL99

You're right. It keeps getting more and more complicated. The 18 Rules have Golf have now been modified to 1000's of pages of interpretations and decisions.

Here's an example of crazy rules.

Par 4 over a hill. Landing zone is over the hill and blind to the Tee Box. Water hazard over the hill, towards the right side.

Player A crushes it over the hill and says, "****, probably reached the water".

Player B hits it over the hill, closer to the center of the fairway.

Both players walk to their respective landing areas.

Player A announces that he's found his ball, safe. Player B is still looking for his.

Player A hits his approach shot onto the Green.

Player B can't find his ball. No evidence it went into the hazard, so he goes back to the Tee and hits Shot #3.

Player B hits his approach onto the Green, closer than Player A.

Player A goes to make his putt and announces he hit the wrong ball in the fairway and the ball he hit to the Green, is actually Player B's ball.

Sort it out for scoring purposes

[fgsJr]

"Golf is the closest game
to the game we call life. You get bad breaks from good shots; you get good breaks from bad shots— but you have to play
the ball where it lies."
…Bobby Jones

Interacting with Mother Nature is what makes golf such a rewarding experience, oftentimes disconcerting but always challenging… and entertaining!

[BrianL99]

Originally Posted by BrianL99

Sort it out for scoring purposes

Originally Posted by SHIBUMI

Match Play.... B wins the hole, Player A gone minute he hit b's ball even if found out later

There's no "scoring" in Match Play ... it's Win, Loss, Halve.

Besides, it's too easy of question if it was Match Play.

[SHIBUMI]

A scores 8. assumes hits green in 2 and two putts

B scores 4. assumes hit green in 2 and 2 putts

B plays from spot that A hit his ball, hits green in 2 and 2 putts

A goes back to tee, hitting 3 fourth shot on green and 2 putts equals 6 with 2 stroke penalty for 8

its called equity, A's ball is lost, can't assume its in the water not enough evidence..... B deserves to play where his original ball was

neither teed up from the next tee so can correct the situation...boom

Originally Posted by BrianL99

There's no "scoring" in Match Play ... it's Win, Loss, Halve.

Besides, it's too easy of question if it was Match Play.

[BrianL99]

Originally Posted by SHIBUMI

A scores 8. assumes hits green in 2 and two putts

B scores 4. assumes hit green in 2 and 2 putts

B plays from spot that A hit his ball, hits green in 2 and 2 putts

A goes back to tee, hitting 3 fourth shot on green and 2 putts equals 6 with 2 stroke penalty for 8

its called equity, A's ball is lost, can't assume its in the water not enough evidence..... B deserves to play where his original ball was

neither teed up from the next tee so can correct the situation...boom

I agree with your reasoning, but the Decision (which I can't find), came down differently.

Once you put a 2nd ball into play, there's no option to return to your original ball, regardless of circumstances. A player's obligation is to identify his ball. The fact that a fellow competitor hit his ball, doesn't relieve him of the responsibility.

The USGA hardly ever "rules in equity", as their position has always been, golf is an unfair game.

(To be fair, there may not even be an actual decision on this one. I read the scenario many years ago, on a Rules Forum. I was with your opinion for Player A and was laughed at. If I remember correctly, it was submitted to the USGA as a hypothetical)

[Dilligas]

Originally Posted by dewilson58

At the end of every round, I assess myself a two stroke penalty just in case I missed something.

Ohhh, a sandbagger?

[SHIBUMI]

A proceeded correctly once realized wrong ball, Back to the tee, with a 2 stroke penalty, plus stroke and distance, hits green in 4, 2 putts for 6, 2 stroke penalty is 8

B however, must take stroke and distance penalty for not finding ball in three minutes, regardless of circumstance, hits green in 4 with 2 putts gives him a 6.

If A doesn't make the correction before hitting his next tee ball he is disqualified.

If B makes the correction and hits a ball from the original spot, he has hit his 5th shot, as his procedure was correct because ball not found in 3 minutes, so he is on the green in
5 with 2putts for a 7 and a 2 stroke penalty for hitting a wrong ball makes him a 9

He can go to the next tee either way and not be disqualified

Now once this wrong ball has been found out, B, in a court of law could justify assault on A,
with any club he chooses, as he believes A did it on purpose, and has thusly lost his mind.

Ah the pressure of golf

Originally Posted by BrianL99

I agree with your reasoning, but the Decision (which I can't find), came down differently.

Once you put a 2nd ball into play, there's no option to return to your original ball, regardless of circumstances. A player's obligation is to identify his ball. The fact that a fellow competitor hit his ball, doesn't relieve him of the responsibility.

The USGA hardly ever "rules in equity", as their position has always been, golf is an unfair game.

(To be fair, there may not even be an actual decision on this one. I read the scenario many years ago, on a Rules Forum. I was with your opinion for Player A and was laughed at. If I remember correctly, it was submitted to the USGA as a hypothetical)

[CoachKandSportsguy]

Shane Lowry's ball movement was very much less egregious than Windham Clarke addressing his ball, and tamping down the grass next to the ball with his club.

After controversy, Wyndham Clark calls for simpler rules

Should have Clarke been assessed a penalty for improving his swing path? or does improving one's lie only include moving the ball or remarking a ball in any other location than the original? One cannot improve swing paths with branches or other natural impediments, except tamping down grasses??

These are the inconsistencies in the human judging which are blamed on the rules, and yet, it's the appearance of inconsistent application of rules by humans which is the cause of the confusion/blame?

definitely a first world problem for us, nonetheless. .