It is about RACE. It is about RACISM. It is about racism being so imbedded and accepted that when a man tells his friends he is going to start a race war they think that's just a good old boy joke.

It's not a mystery Nikki Haley.

"While we do not yet know all of the details, we do know that we’ll never understand what motivates anyone to enter one of our places of worship and take the life of another."

Some of us understand what motivated this act and it was not anything to do with a church.

Hey stupid Fox News person. This was not an anti-Christian act

"And some look at it as, well, it's because it was a white guy, apparently, and a black church. But you made a great point just a moment ago about the hostility toward Christians, and it was in a church, so maybe that's what it was about."

And you GOP candidate for President

"There are people out there looking for Christians to kill them. This is a mean time we live in"

Yes they were killed because they were Christians

And you different GOP candidate for President

"This is one of those situation where you have to take a step a back and say — you talk about the importance of prayer at this time, and we’re now seeing assaults on religious liberty we’ve never seen before"

Oh double Yes, they were killed because Religious Liberty

And you evil NRA member who can twist everything into if we just had a whole lot more guns

"he voted against concealed-carry. Eight of his church members who might be alive if he had expressly allowed members to carry handguns in church are dead. Innocent people died because of his position on a political issue"

Oh thank you, they were killed because GUNS aren't in everyone's hands

And you, another GOP candidate

“There’s something terribly wrong, but it isn’t going to be fixed by your government"

.
No I guess you're right. It is not going to be fixed by your government if your government actively endorses the message that might encourage your activity, by say flying a flag in memory of those who fought in the first race war in this country, on the side that believed in white superiority. Or sold you a state license plate with that flag on it and whose governor can't understand what motivated this man to act.

Well the killer had told all of you what motivated him and it is RACISM It is the hatred of black people. It has nothing to do with victimizing Christians. It has nothing to do with political votes on guns. Maybe just maybe we can get those on the right to say words to acknowledge that there are racists in this country, who strangely seem to love the good old stars and bars (nothing but a symbol of Southern pride, BS).

I can't say it as well as a comment I found online:

It's hard to imagine a more dismissive treatment of the victims of a mass murder than to studiously ignore their very identity, the very thing that they were explicitly targeted and killed for, because your own ideology would prefer the truth be something different. To go even farther, and claim that their murder was not even about them, it was about your group, and how their murders prove how your group has been victimized. At least have the withered decency to acknowledge that the openly racist murderer was a racist murderer—that the man who said he was there to kill black Americans was, indeed, there to kill his victims for being black Americans. Do not give bull**** statements about your sympathies for the community when you aren't willing to even name the "community" being targeted.

Originally Posted by Guest

It is about RACE. It is about RACISM. It is about racism being so imbedded and accepted that when a man tells his friends he is going to start a race war they think that's just a good old boy joke.

It's not a mystery Nikki Haley.

Some of us understand what motivated this act and it was not anything to do with a church.

Hey stupid Fox News person. This was not an anti-Christian act

And you GOP candidate for President

Yes they were killed because they were Christians

And you different GOP candidate for President

Oh double Yes, they were killed because Religious Liberty

And you evil NRA member who can twist everything into if we just had a whole lot more guns


Oh thank you, they were killed because GUNS aren't in everyone's hands

And you, another GOP candidate
.
No I guess you're right. It is not going to be fixed by your government if your government actively endorses the message that might encourage your activity, by say flying a flag in memory of those who fought in the first race war in this country, on the side that believed in white superiority. Or sold you a state license plate with that flag on it and whose governor can't understand what motivated this man to act.

Well the killer had told all of you what motivated him and it is RACISM It is the hatred of black people. It has nothing to do with victimizing Christians. It has nothing to do with political votes on guns. Maybe just maybe we can get those on the right to say words to acknowledge that there are racists in this country, who strangely seem to love the good old stars and bars (nothing but a symbol of Southern pride, BS).

I can't say it as well as a comment I found online:

It's hard to imagine a more dismissive treatment of the victims of a mass murder than to studiously ignore their very identity, the very thing that they were explicitly targeted and killed for, because your own ideology would prefer the truth be something different. To go even farther, and claim that their murder was not even about them, it was about your group, and how their murders prove how your group has been victimized. At least have the withered decency to acknowledge that the openly racist murderer was a racist murderer—that the man who said he was there to kill black Americans was, indeed, there to kill his victims for being black Americans. Do not give bull**** statements about your sympathies for the community when you aren't willing to even name the "community" being targeted.

This is pure hate, sans any logic.

The killings are horrible, and in this case determined by race.

Those, like this poster who supposedly can read hearts of those he quoted, and those with agendas of hate that prey on moments like this simply continue to divide us by race, religion, political division, and yes it appears by what network we choose to watch.

Political hate, racial hate, religious hate is simply hate that someone has put into a basket to "justify" hating.

I just cannot understand this kind of thing. I do know that hate, like this,so easily triggered and manifested is scary.

I support more gun control if some kind,but more than that I support a culture that will encourage understanding, allow people to listen and try.

To even attempt to place blame for the horrific acts in South Carolina on anything other than an evil heart is simply continuing the acrimony. To use these terrible actions to motivate politically or racially is just wrong.

If anyone believes truely in equality, justice, etc., then they know that race does not make you evil,a political party does not make you evil,a network does not make you evil, an organization does not make you evil.

These are all EXCUSES to be used. Evil is in your heart,and our society will not recognize that...we need some "political" excuse to hang our hat on.

This is pathetic, at best.

Originally Posted by Guest

It is about RACE. It is about RACISM. It is about racism being so imbedded and accepted that when a man tells his friends he is going to start a race war they think that's just a good old boy joke.

It's not a mystery Nikki Haley.

Some of us understand what motivated this act and it was not anything to do with a church.

Hey stupid Fox News person. This was not an anti-Christian act

And you GOP candidate for President

Yes they were killed because they were Christians

And you different GOP candidate for President

Oh double Yes, they were killed because Religious Liberty

And you evil NRA member who can twist everything into if we just had a whole lot more guns


Oh thank you, they were killed because GUNS aren't in everyone's hands

And you, another GOP candidate
.
No I guess you're right. It is not going to be fixed by your government if your government actively endorses the message that might encourage your activity, by say flying a flag in memory of those who fought in the first race war in this country, on the side that believed in white superiority. Or sold you a state license plate with that flag on it and whose governor can't understand what motivated this man to act.

Well the killer had told all of you what motivated him and it is RACISM It is the hatred of black people. It has nothing to do with victimizing Christians. It has nothing to do with political votes on guns. Maybe just maybe we can get those on the right to say words to acknowledge that there are racists in this country, who strangely seem to love the good old stars and bars (nothing but a symbol of Southern pride, BS).

I can't say it as well as a comment I found online:

It's hard to imagine a more dismissive treatment of the victims of a mass murder than to studiously ignore their very identity, the very thing that they were explicitly targeted and killed for, because your own ideology would prefer the truth be something different. To go even farther, and claim that their murder was not even about them, it was about your group, and how their murders prove how your group has been victimized. At least have the withered decency to acknowledge that the openly racist murderer was a racist murderer—that the man who said he was there to kill black Americans was, indeed, there to kill his victims for being black Americans. Do not give bull**** statements about your sympathies for the community when you aren't willing to even name the "community" being targeted.

Your post is a perfect example of liberal racism but mixed with an irrationality and deranged view of the world that actually perpetuates what you purport to be opposed to

Originally Posted by Guest

It is about RACE. It is about RACISM. It is about racism being so imbedded and accepted that when a man tells his friends he is going to start a race war they think that's just a good old boy joke.

It's not a mystery Nikki Haley.

Some of us understand what motivated this act and it was not anything to do with a church.

Hey stupid Fox News person. This was not an anti-Christian act

And you GOP candidate for President

Yes they were killed because they were Christians

And you different GOP candidate for President

Oh double Yes, they were killed because Religious Liberty

And you evil NRA member who can twist everything into if we just had a whole lot more guns


Oh thank you, they were killed because GUNS aren't in everyone's hands

And you, another GOP candidate
.
No I guess you're right. It is not going to be fixed by your government if your government actively endorses the message that might encourage your activity, by say flying a flag in memory of those who fought in the first race war in this country, on the side that believed in white superiority. Or sold you a state license plate with that flag on it and whose governor can't understand what motivated this man to act.

Well the killer had told all of you what motivated him and it is RACISM It is the hatred of black people. It has nothing to do with victimizing Christians. It has nothing to do with political votes on guns. Maybe just maybe we can get those on the right to say words to acknowledge that there are racists in this country, who strangely seem to love the good old stars and bars (nothing but a symbol of Southern pride, BS).

I can't say it as well as a comment I found online:

It's hard to imagine a more dismissive treatment of the victims of a mass murder than to studiously ignore their very identity, the very thing that they were explicitly targeted and killed for, because your own ideology would prefer the truth be something different. To go even farther, and claim that their murder was not even about them, it was about your group, and how their murders prove how your group has been victimized. At least have the withered decency to acknowledge that the openly racist murderer was a racist murderer—that the man who said he was there to kill black Americans was, indeed, there to kill his victims for being black Americans. Do not give bull**** statements about your sympathies for the community when you aren't willing to even name the "community" being targeted.

In your kindergarten level of thinking, it's just incredible to me that you can always find a way to make Fox News "the" bogeyman for everything you don't like. Your susceptibility to mass delusion makes you a perfect candidate for a Liberal Fuhrer to march into town one day and incite you to open up the gas ovens. I mean ... you truly have a sickness.

It's not about race nor guns. It's about "mental illness" and the parents who have no clue (like so many today) Get your kids away from violent video games, get involved and Pay attention to your kids of course these parents most likely had problems if this kid learned to hate. Also responsible are friends who heard him make any unusual comments or noticed any strange behavior and did not report it. And once again this President has no business politicising this for his anti-gun agenda

Originally Posted by Guest

It's not about race nor guns. It's about "mental illness" and the parents who have no clue (like so many today) Get your kids away from violent video games, get involved and Pay attention to your kids of course these parents most likely had problems if this kid learned to hate. Also responsible are friends who heard him make any unusual comments or noticed any strange behavior and did not report it. And once again this President has no business politicising this for his anti-gun agenda

I am going to continue to say that we continue to look for political, racial, gun control, etc to explain everything.

Did this young man not have a drug problem ? Was he not taking medication that had serious side affects ? Despite his overt racial actions over time, and despite his drug problem, did his father not reward him with a gun ?

Race was not primary...guns were not primary...politics and networks were not primary. Growing up in this society will allow more of this, yet we continue to make it easy on ourselves by going after race, politics or whatever makes us feel good

Folks, our problems cannot be made political. They are basic probems we just simply refuse to discuss...family, morals,etc. and while you cannot mandate morals, we can provide leadership to strengthen the family and those said morals.

When people speak of "anti religion" , I believe they speak of ignoring the basics, and not allowing a moral society to grow.

My guess is that society in America has changed from its all about US to it's all about ME. The virtue of selfishness has corrupted our humanity.
"If I am not for myself ,who will be for me? If I am only for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?" Hillel the Elder

There are few issues on which I agree with Ben Carson but on this point I do!!

Ben Carson warns of 'new hate' in aftermath of church massacre | MSNBC

Once you read, it my reasons for agreeing with him will be clear

Just check the previous posts.

I am going to reject this thread it is clearly apparent that their is no socially redeeming value to it nor is there an intelligent application

Personal Best Regards:

Originally Posted by Guest

In your kindergarten level of thinking, it's just incredible to me that you can always find a way to make Fox News "the" bogeyman for everything you don't like. Your susceptibility to mass delusion makes you a perfect candidate for a Liberal Fuhrer to march into town one day and incite you to open up the gas ovens. I mean ... you truly have a sickness.

You know , the OP laid out a decent format to state a case, maybe not to your liking as far as content, but still in the spirit of this forum, and what do you do? Hurl insults. Like Rocky said, "Is that all you got?"

Originally Posted by Chi-Town

You know , the OP laid out a decent format to state a case, maybe not to your liking as far as content, but still in the spirit of this forum, and what do you do? Hurl insults. Like Rocky said, "Is that all you got?"

Ok..I will take this, and start by saying that I disagree this was a "decent" format

The first part came directly fromHuffington Post, which valiantly attempted to make this political. I saw her press conference and she was in tears most of it, and to take a comment so far out of context strikes me as using a bad situation to make political points. What sane human being does not find it a mystery as to why anyone would do something like that.

The Huffington Post column continues laying aside any reason except for what made good politics.

The post you feel was layed out so well then continues to attack GOP candidates and Fox News. ALL of them think and agree it was an hateful act and it was anti religion and racial.

Making it political was/is the total motive for this post.

Racism certainly was the overt reason for a drug addicted, drug using man with crazy racial ideas who was given a gun by his father.

Why make it politics ? Why not discuss the real underlying causes ?

This chronic using every single disaster as a political tool and another excuse to cry racist has grown very old and tiresome.

I dismiss out of hand the inane comments about the confederate flag

The OP wants a conservative, or as he puts it "those on the right to admit there is racism". Think about it clearly....who, on the right left or middle, has denied racism. The split comes with the name calling of racist on any issue, not on racism itself.

Here, I must turn political myself. Over many years, the liberals in this country OVERTLY courted races, and OVERTLY made a conscious effort to paint anyone who opposed their beliefs as racists. I worked for the Democratic Party and attest to that. It was a quiet, yet overt movement, now brought to the forefront. As you KNOW FACTUALLY, a known race baiter is the face of that party. A man who has made up stories to create problems is in charge, and do not be fooled...he is in charge of this specific dynamic. Control of this voting block is vital, and I am sorry to say, it is working.

BUT, the core problem is US, OUR MORAL COMPASS. We are lost in a haze of name calling, and flat out refuse to recognize that this crime was done by a man who is on drugs, has shown his racial side, and was gited a gun by his father despite all of that

Yet, the conversation immediately turns to right versus left. Black versus white. And as I was in all the other fronts in this ongoing story..from Ferguson to Charleston,the name calling and labeling does not even allow time for facts...the Huffingtonpice was within hours.

No, I find this thread to be EXTREMELY offensive

Totally off the wall......oh I do miss the ignore button so will have to discipline myself to not engage this type rhetoric (I am being generous and polite).

Originally Posted by Guest

Ok..I will take this, and start by saying that I disagree this was a "decent" format

The first part came directly fromHuffington Post, which valiantly attempted to make this political. I saw her press conference and she was in tears most of it, and to take a comment so far out of context strikes me as using a bad situation to make political points. What sane human being does not find it a mystery as to why anyone would do something like that.

The Huffington Post column continues laying aside any reason except for what made good politics.

The post you feel was layed out so well then continues to attack GOP candidates and Fox News. ALL of them think and agree it was an hateful act and it was anti religion and racial.

Making it political was/is the total motive for this post.

Racism certainly was the overt reason for a drug addicted, drug using man with crazy racial ideas who was given a gun by his father.

Why make it politics ? Why not discuss the real underlying causes ?

This chronic using every single disaster as a political tool and another excuse to cry racist has grown very old and tiresome.

I dismiss out of hand the inane comments about the confederate flag

The OP wants a conservative, or as he puts it "those on the right to admit there is racism". Think about it clearly....who, on the right left or middle, has denied racism. The split comes with the name calling of racist on any issue, not on racism itself.

Here, I must turn political myself. Over many years, the liberals in this country OVERTLY courted races, and OVERTLY made a conscious effort to paint anyone who opposed their beliefs as racists. I worked for the Democratic Party and attest to that. It was a quiet, yet overt movement, now brought to the forefront. As you KNOW FACTUALLY, a known race baiter is the face of that party. A man who has made up stories to create problems is in charge, and do not be fooled...he is in charge of this specific dynamic. Control of this voting block is vital, and I am sorry to say, it is working.

BUT, the core problem is US, OUR MORAL COMPASS. We are lost in a haze of name calling, and flat out refuse to recognize that this crime was done by a man who is on drugs, has shown his racial side, and was gited a gun by his father despite all of that

Yet, the conversation immediately turns to right versus left. Black versus white. And as I was in all the other fronts in this ongoing story..from Ferguson to Charleston,the name calling and labeling does not even allow time for facts...the Huffingtonpice was within hours.

No, I find this thread to be EXTREMELY offensive

Let me clarify what I meant about "decent". I did not mean it in a moral way, but that the layout was cohesive, not necessarily the content.

Got to love this tread....

Liberals are mentally ill and race baiters while the Right believe the attack is more evidence of the WAR on Christians and then the IRA ways in with "If this CHURCH wasn't a gun free zone these people would still be alive. Of course, that last on is hard to understand given that SC has some very liberal gun laws yet none to the people, other than the gunman, were packing.

Originally Posted by Guest

Got to love this tread....

Liberals are mentally ill and race baiters while the Right believe the attack is more evidence of the WAR on Christians and then the IRA ways in with "If this CHURCH wasn't a gun free zone these people would still be alive. Of course, that last on is hard to understand given that SC has some very liberal gun laws yet none to the people, other than the gunman, were packing.

I am about to make an observation which is factual, but which I also know will cause some anti-gun liberals to potentially overreact. Nonetheless, believeing in free speech here goes ...

IF (i.e. as in hypothetically) had one of the victims in the Church shooting had a concealed carry weapon, and presumably trained in its use, the racist who shot nine people WOULD have been most likely killed before he shot all nine victims. The news reports said he reloaded several times ...!! One reason none of them were carrying is that is currently against the law in SC (ie carrying in a church) and the SC State Rep / Pastor who was shot supported the ban.

From what I can tell about mass shootings, not even the craziest shooter has targeted a place where he knows there are armed men (eg police station) so in general they go to places where they KNOW no one will be armed to resist ...ie schools, churches etc.

Now, I'm just looking for reasonable and coherent comments ... not ideological rants. Does anyone disagree with the content of what I just said? Is it not common sense?

For the record, I mean no disrespect to the nine dead victims. But, more of them would be alive today if one of them had been carrying is all I'm saying.