[pbeinetti]

I am concerned that there will be no more church services at the Church on the Square after renovation. I was at the service today, and the guest singers both said 'good bye'. The pastor also said good bye. I asked him on the way out if there will be no more church services, and he said yes, that's his understanding. Does anyone have information on this? The developer said in his recent state of the villages speech that "We can assure you that you will have some of the same things you have now.....". But, he did not say that church services will continue. He also said "There is sort of an artist's rendering of what the outside will look like....". This seems odd -- he said this only 3 months prior to the start of renovation. There is only an artist's rendering? I am wondering if we are getting the whole truth. Why can't the developer say that church services will continue? There are many, many people who go to church at the Church on the Square -- hundreds, probably thousands. The Church on the Square is an icon for The Villages. When we have guests come to visit, the Church on the Square gets more accolades than anything else in TV. People are typically overwhelmed. Will this be lost, and instead replaced by another entertainment venue -- one that does not even fit the needs of the growing Villages. Is anyone else disturbed, other than just me? If anyone has factual information on this, please respond. I have asked the head of the POA, and she does not know -- and says she has no way of finding out.
Thank you, Peter

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by pbeinetti

I am concerned that there will be no more church services at the Church on the Square after renovation. I was at the service today, and the guest singers both said 'good bye'. The pastor also said good bye. I asked him on the way out if there will be no more church services, and he said yes, that's his understanding. Does anyone have information on this? The developer said in his recent state of the villages speech that "We can assure you that you will have some of the same things you have now.....". But, he did not say that church services will continue. He also said "There is sort of an artist's rendering of what the outside will look like....". This seems odd -- he said this only 3 months prior to the start of renovation. There is only an artist's rendering? I am wondering if we are getting the whole truth. Why can't the developer say that church services will continue? There are many, many people who go to church at the Church on the Square -- hundreds, probably thousands. The Church on the Square is an icon for The Villages. When we have guests come to visit, the Church on the Square gets more accolades than anything else in TV. People are typically overwhelmed. Will this be lost, and instead replaced by another entertainment venue -- one that does not even fit the needs of the growing Villages. Is anyone else disturbed, other than just me? If anyone has factual information on this, please respond. I have asked the head of the POA, and she does not know -- and says she has no way of finding out.
Thank you, Peter

Peter.

I was of the understanding that there was one non denominational service a week on Sunday at Church on the Square and it did not function like a typical church with a bunch of activities and clubs and other things other than just that one service.

Not to take away from that...

But am I correct on this?

[pbeinetti]

Gracie: There has been one non-denominational service every Sunday for years. What I am concerned about is that this service may be eliminated -- and, that no one is telling us this. I would like to find out what the plans are. Someone has to know.

[senior citizen]

Originally Posted by pbeinetti

I am concerned that there will be no more church services at the Church on the Square after renovation. I was at the service today, and the guest singers both said 'good bye'. The pastor also said good bye. I asked him on the way out if there will be no more church services, and he said yes, that's his understanding. Does anyone have information on this? The developer said in his recent state of the villages speech that "We can assure you that you will have some of the same things you have now.....". But, he did not say that church services will continue. He also said "There is sort of an artist's rendering of what the outside will look like....". This seems odd -- he said this only 3 months prior to the start of renovation. There is only an artist's rendering? I am wondering if we are getting the whole truth. Why can't the developer say that church services will continue? There are many, many people who go to church at the Church on the Square -- hundreds, probably thousands. The Church on the Square is an icon for The Villages. When we have guests come to visit, the Church on the Square gets more accolades than anything else in TV. People are typically overwhelmed. Will this be lost, and instead replaced by another entertainment venue -- one that does not even fit the needs of the growing Villages. Is anyone else disturbed, other than just me? If anyone has factual information on this, please respond. I have asked the head of the POA, and she does not know -- and says she has no way of finding out.
Thank you, Peter

Strange. We haven't even moved there yet, and all of the things we had read about and seen during our visit are now "up in the air" or cancelled such as the parades, fireworks, etc..........plus many disparaging remarks on numerous restaurants which we didn't have time for the last time around but were looking forward to visiting. Would other folks say that services or amenities in general are being cut?? Perhaps due to the economy? It's a beautiful church that should remain open. Hopefully, someone is "in the know" and can answer your question.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by senior citizen

Strange. We haven't even moved there yet, and all of the things we had read about and seen during our visit are now "up in the air" or cancelled such as the parades, fireworks, etc..........plus many disparaging remarks on numerous restaurants which we didn't have time for the last time around but were looking forward to visiting. Would other folks say that services or amenities in general are being cut?? Perhaps due to the economy? It's a beautiful church that should remain open. Hopefully, someone is "in the know" and can answer your question.

The church's main purpose has always been as an entertainment venue. It was not built as a house of worship but as part of the scene of a Spanish town. It has always had just one non denominational service per week and no other church functions. It is being enlarged inside now and that is the reason for canceling the church service. I would be surprised if it didn't resume after the renovation. There has NEVER been fireworks here to my knowledge and the parades have been cancelled. There have always been disparaging remarks against almost all restaurants and many that I personally enjoy very much. I see nothing changing here. Same old, same old lovely place with lots to do.

[jojo]

I agree with everything Gracie said. She is spot on as usual.

[skip0358]

As for the church services stopping I'd give Janet Tutt a call in the District Office she'll get you an answer to that question. As for the Restaurant comments I've said this before with over 110K residents from all over moving here after living elsewhere for 50+ years it's not going to be like home was. You move here for a change and a new life. Part of that is finding new places you enjoy eating at. Granted some have their problems but most are VERY good. As for the Parades it's my understanding a new arrangement has been made and the local clubs and volunteers are now in charge of managing the parades on the off Holidays ex: St. Pats etc. The Christmas Parade is still a go at the Polo Fields last I read. As for Fireworks I'm sure Gracie is 100% correct and there are displays very close by. TV is a great place, with great people and a wonderful lifestyle.

[nitehawk]

let me ask you gracie ---- when you first move here was the conditions better or worse _____ did you get the internet tee time for nothing ??? was the chanpionship golf couses in better shape ??? (please do not tell me rain or hogs) - i will add the executive courses to that about being better or worse.. Maybe soon we could put the buffalo back on the couses. has the design of the couses gone down hill from the couses north of 466 to south of 466 and then south of 466a. Was Havana a good place to eat. Nice design of Bonify club house - looks like a - oh never mind -- you are right same old same old music lin squares. what happen to El Santiargo Rest. nice neighborhood place - PLease tell me what got getter --- are we getting set up for live after build out finish or IRS payback

[Bonny]

Originally Posted by senior citizen

Strange. We haven't even moved there yet, and all of the things we had read about and seen during our visit are now "up in the air" or cancelled such as the parades, fireworks, etc..........plus many disparaging remarks on numerous restaurants which we didn't have time for the last time around but were looking forward to visiting. Would other folks say that services or amenities in general are being cut?? Perhaps due to the economy? It's a beautiful church that should remain open. Hopefully, someone is "in the know" and can answer your question.

We bought here in 1999. That was the last year for fireworks. A lot of building going on & pets, buffalo & cows were being affected and the cost was definitely not cheap.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by nitehawk

let me ask you gracie ---- when you first move here was the conditions better or worse _____ did you get the internet tee time for nothing ??? was the chanpionship golf couses in better shape ??? (please do not tell me rain or hogs) - i will add the executive courses to that about being better or worse.. Maybe soon we could put the buffalo back on the couses. has the design of the couses gone down hill from the couses north of 466 to south of 466 and then south of 466a. Was Havana a good place to eat. Nice design of Bonify club house - looks like a - oh never mind -- you are right same old same old music lin squares. what happen to El Santiargo Rest. nice neighborhood place - PLease tell me what got getter --- are we getting set up for live after build out finish or IRS payback

Nitehawk,

Not sure of your point. Have had to pay for internet access to booking golf for all of the six years we have been here. The championship courses I don't play but Sweetie does and he plays them almost every day and I have asked him if they are in bad shape and he says no. The executive courses are beaten up probably due to the fact that we have so many not trained golfers in part. But they aren't horrible. And not a lot worse than six years ago.

Havana had troubles right out the chute with the big name chef disappearing within the first month of opening, correct me if I am wrong. I don't know what happened to the El Santiago restaurant or why it closed, perhaps the reason other restaurants close here? Priced too high?

I never felt all warm and cozy about the buffalo. Don't hate them, like to snuggle up with cats and dogs better, but I understand that a lot of people are still mourning them. I imagine they were there to keep the cost of the lands taxes at an agricultural fee. The Bonifay club house is NOT luxurious and drop dead gorgeous but it's um...cute.

What else ya got?

I feel real snarly this morning.

[Bonny]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

Nitehawk,

Not sure of your point. Have had to pay for internet access to booking golf for all of the six years we have been here. The championship courses I don't play but Sweetie does and he plays them almost every day and I have asked him if they are in bad shape and he says no. The executive courses are beaten up probably due to the fact that we have so many not trained golfers in part. But they aren't horrible. And not a lot worse than six years ago.

Havana had troubles right out the chute with the big name chef disappearing within the first month of opening, correct me if I am wrong. I don't know what happened to the El Santiago restaurant or why it closed, perhaps the reason other restaurants close here? Priced too high?

I never felt all warm and cozy about the buffalo. Don't hate them, like to snuggle up with cats and dogs better, but I understand that a lot of people are still mourning them. I imagine they were there to keep the cost of the lands taxes at an agricultural fee. The Bonifay club house is NOT luxurious and drop dead gorgeous but it's um...cute.

What else ya got?

I feel real snarly this morning.

Santiago needed a lot of repairs. It wasn't kept up like it should have been. The owners at the time wanted the Villages to do the repairs because they didn't want to pay to do it.

[pbeinetti]

I would like to move this thread back to what I originally wrote about -- the Church on the Square. Does anyone have any information about whether or not church services will be held in the future? Gracie says the 'church' was never built to be a church, but an entertainment venue. And, that no other church type activities are held there. Not exactly true. There are bible studies held at the Church on the Square, and many Christmas/holiday activities that are amplified by being held in a church. If Church on the Square isn't a church, but an entertainment venue, then it should not have been named a church from the beginning. My original post had to do with whether we are being told the straight scoop by the developer. His comment ...'you will have some of the same things you have now...' is very ambiguous, probably on purpose. One poster suggested I contact Janet Tutt, but Janet is no more than a mouthpiece for the developer. Does anyone have any information, or is this one of those things where we'll find out when it happens -- whether we like it or not? I hate to be cynical on this, but there are many, many people who are going to be very disappointed, and feeling hoodwinked, if the Church on the Square ends up not looking like a church, with no church services. Morse says they have an artist's rendition -- fine, share it with us now.

[graciegirl]

///

[blueash]

Wouldn't renovations require permits and architectural designs submitted and approved by the county? Searching on the Lake county property website reveals that the parcel of land is :

Parcel Type Land Base
Parcel Status Valid
Parcel Number 061824300100000500
Section 06
Township 18
Range 24
Subdivision 3001
Owner Name ABUNDANT LIFE MINISTRIES INC
Owner Address 1100 MAIN ST
Owner City LADY LAKE
Owner State FL
Owner Zip 32159
Owner Province
Owner Country
Property Address LADY LAKE FL 32159
Subdivision Name VILLAGE CENTER DOWNTOWN, LADY LAKE
Vacant No
Year Built 1997
ComResStatus C
Land Value 570330
Building Value 2157135
Misc Value Null
Assessed Value 2727465
Last Sale Price Null
Last Sale Date Null
Exemptions 10
Millage FVCD
Last Tax Amount 0
LandUse Code 7100
LandUse Description CHURCH
Property ClassCode 71
Property Class Description CHURCH
Acres 0.87

There are no listed permits. Perhaps the online information is incomplete or I am doing the search wrong. If you really are interested I would think a call to the county office would yield better results. Or perhaps the renovation is cosmetic only requiring no permitting, just fresh paint. I cannot find any information about the owners.

[pbeinetti]

Good information BLUEASH -- thanks. The building is listed on county records as a 'CHURCH', not an entertainment venue. Interesting!

Let me take one more stab at this -- perhaps I wasn't as clear in my writing as I am in my head. Gracie is right, why would I be concerned since the developer has a good track record of building nice town squares, etc. In the case of new building, such as town squares, I don't think there is any reason to be concerned. But, in the case of renovating, and perhaps significantly changing, something many, many of us have used and loved for years, it is concerning. ESPECIALLY because the developer has been very ambiguous about what he calls 'future programming' -- that is, how the new building will be used in the future. Like many of us who live in The Villages, I ran a large organization in my previous life. I believed in transparency -- no secrecy, no hiding, open kimona. The developer does not operate that way. Secrecy leads to suspicion. And in the case of the Church on the Square I think there is reason to be suspicious.