[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by talonip

We have had two houses and enclosed both. Single pane. Don’t get sucked into double pain unless you have a west facing lanai with unobstructed view. We put insulation in the first house with 280 sq ft lanai. In second home we did not with 500 sq ft. Hardly noticed a difference. We put two mini splits in second lanai. We love it. One thing that is nice the villages weather and temp from late Oct to middle of April is great. Mini splits use was minimal. We use our lanai all the time. It’s well worth the cost to enclose and pit mini splits in. Ask contractor to put in the flush ceiling mounted mini.

Don't get sucked into double pane??? If you have a room that is being heated and cooled, why would you use single pane glass windows? Double pane glass has been the minimum standard for all windows in housing construction for longer than 30 years. Nobody installs single pane windows in a house that is heated and cooled.

[jrref]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

Don't get sucked into double pane??? If you have a room that is being heated and cooled, why would you use single pane glass windows? Double pane glass has been the minimum standard for all windows in housing construction for longer than 30 years. Nobody installs single pane windows in a house that is heated and cooled.

Right, so, most people look for the lowest cost without really understanding. When the HVAC person comes to do the load calculation and inputs single pane windows, the load will be a lot higher than if they were double pane windows. So, the customer thinks they are saving money by getting single pane windows but is spending more for the larger capacity AC equipment and the cost to run it for the life of the system.

[Flyers999]

Originally Posted by Nana2Teddy

This is our situation. We chose single pane for east facing 400sf lanai because it was $15K vs $29K, and Custom Windows told us single pane was sufficient. We had ceiling insulated and two ceiling mounted minisplits installed by Kalos, and they work great except in the dead of summer when the morning sun heats up the room quickly forcing the minisplits to work extra hard all day trying to cool it back down to 75. So, we have 100% solar blocking interior motorized shades being installed next week to block morning sun until 11-12, then will raise them for rest of the day and night. The shades will block the sun from fading everything in our lanai too. This is a private fenced-in yard, no view, so we don’t mind shades being down in morning for 2-3 months annually. We do keep our sliders to the lanai open all day.

Mine is western facing and we put the motorized shade down after 2pm. The opposite of what you do. We did not enclose the lanai with glass like you have done.
Why didn't you just put up curtains or vertical blinds instead of the motorized shade? Motorized shades are not cheap and don't last forever.

[C. C. Rider]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

Don't get sucked into double pane??? If you have a room that is being heated and cooled, why would you use single pane glass windows? Double pane glass has been the minimum standard for all windows in housing construction for longer than 30 years. Nobody installs single pane windows in a house that is heated and cooled.

I disagree. The window insulation requirement is based on temperature difference between the outside temperature and the desired inside temperature. Up north, it may be 0 degrees outside and 70 degrees inside. That's a temperature difference of 70 degrees. You definitely need double-pane windows for a 70 degree temperature difference.

Down here in Florida, the "winter" is so mild as to make thermopane windows unnecessary. As for the summer cooling, it seldom gets hotter than about 95 degrees, and that's only for a few hours per day in the hottest part of the summer. Your temperature difference then is only about 17 degrees if you keep the inside at 78 degrees.

Many people would argue that thermopane windows are unnecessary for a mere 17 degrees temperature difference. My 2,400 square foot house has single pane windows, including my enclosed lanai, and my heating and cooling bills are very modest even during the hottest part of the summer.

In short, Leesburg is not Minneapolis.

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[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by C. C. Rider

I disagree. The window insulation requirement is based on temperature difference between the outside temperature and the desired inside temperature. Up north, it may be 0 degrees outside and 70 degrees inside. That's a temperature difference of 70 degrees. You definitely need double-pane windows for a 70 degree temperature difference.

Down here in Florida, the "winter" is so mild as to make thermopane windows unnecessary. As for the summer cooling, it seldom gets hotter than about 95 degrees, and that's only for a few hours per day in the hottest part of the summer. Your temperature difference then is only about 17 degrees if you keep the inside at 78 degrees.

Many people would argue that thermopane windows are unnecessary for a mere 17 degrees temperature difference. My 2,400 square foot house has single pane windows, including my enclosed lanai, and my heating and cooling bills are very modest even during the hottest part of the summer.

In short, Leesburg is not Minneapolis.

.

Single pane glass windows in houses do not comply with the Florida building code. This has been a code requirement for more than 10 years.

[jrref]

Originally Posted by C. C. Rider

I disagree. The window insulation requirement is based on temperature difference between the outside temperature and the desired inside temperature. Up north, it may be 0 degrees outside and 70 degrees inside. That's a temperature difference of 70 degrees. You definitely need double-pane windows for a 70 degree temperature difference.

Down here in Florida, the "winter" is so mild as to make thermopane windows unnecessary. As for the summer cooling, it seldom gets hotter than about 95 degrees, and that's only for a few hours per day in the hottest part of the summer. Your temperature difference then is only about 17 degrees if you keep the inside at 78 degrees.

Many people would argue that thermopane windows are unnecessary for a mere 17 degrees temperature difference. My 2,400 square foot house has single pane windows, including my enclosed lanai, and my heating and cooling bills are very modest even during the hottest part of the summer.

In short, Leesburg is not Minneapolis.

.

I'm not disputing what you have said but regardless, single pane windows will increase the heat load on the system and as a result you may need to purchase a larger system or if not, it will definetly be working harder to cool. Then end result is you will be paying more running it for the service life of the system.

[C. C. Rider]

Originally Posted by jrref

I'm not disputing what you have said but regardless, single pane windows will increase the heat load on the system and as a result you may need to purchase a larger system or if not, it will definetly be working harder to cool. Then end result is you will be paying more running it for the service life of the system.

I'm not saying that single pane windows are as energy efficient as double pane windows. I'm simply saying that the slight extra cost for heating and cooling a house with single pane windows to reasonable temperatures here in central Florida doesn't justify the significantly additional cost of the double-pane windows all over the house.

My all-electric house with my wife and I living here year-round averages using 35 KwH per day or about 1,050 KwH per month. My average monthly bill with SECO is about $150 and I have NO gas bill. I can't complain at all about those costs.

EDIT TO ADD: According to this link Florida Building Code • Requirements • Windows | FHIA Remodeling Blog, it doesn't appear that double pane windows are required in this area.

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[jrref]

Originally Posted by C. C. Rider

I'm not saying that single pane windows are as energy efficient as double pane windows. I'm simply saying that the slight extra cost for heating and cooling a house with single pane windows to reasonable temperatures here in central Florida doesn't justify the significantly additional cost of the double-pane windows all over the house.

My all-electric house with my wife and I living here year-round averages using 35 KwH per day or about 1,050 KwH per month. My average monthly bill with SECO is about $150 and I have NO gas bill. I can't complain at all about those costs.

EDIT TO ADD: According to this link Florida Building Code • Requirements • Windows | FHIA Remodeling Blog, it doesn't appear that double pane windows are required in this area.

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I'm not so sure. I would have to do the calculations but my guess is with single pane windows you will probably be paying way more in energy costs "over the life" of the system than the initial cost of the double pane windows.

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by C. C. Rider

I'm not saying that single pane windows are as energy efficient as double pane windows. I'm simply saying that the slight extra cost for heating and cooling a house with single pane windows to reasonable temperatures here in central Florida doesn't justify the significantly additional cost of the double-pane windows all over the house.

My all-electric house with my wife and I living here year-round averages using 35 KwH per day or about 1,050 KwH per month. My average monthly bill with SECO is about $150 and I have NO gas bill. I can't complain at all about those costs.

EDIT TO ADD: According to this link Florida Building Code • Requirements • Windows | FHIA Remodeling Blog, it doesn't appear that double pane windows are required in this area.

.

I didn't fully understand the link you provided, but it looks like it goes back to 2002. Apparently, the code was updated in 2015. Please read the attached references:

Are single pane windows legal in Florida?
Thousands of Florida homes have been constructed with aluminum single-pane windows, which under the updated Florida Building Code released in July, are not permissible in most cases in new construction and window replacement projects.Dec 12, 2015
Your browser is not supported | dailycommercial.com
Understanding replacement window regulations - Leesburg Daily Commercial

From AI:
Single-Pane Windows:
Many older homes in Florida have single-pane windows, which are not considered compliant with current code regulations.

[C. C. Rider]

None of the referenced links that I read compared the cost difference in a warm climate such as Florida. So, using my all electric home as an example, let's do some "back of the envelope" figuring.

Let's say that a house with ALL double-pane windows costs an extra $6,000 here in Florida. Now, again using my heating/cooling costs as an example, let's say that my monthly electric bill in my ALL ELECTRIC home was reduced about $30 per month if I had all double-pane windows.

OK, so $30 per month equals $360 per year. At that rate, it would take 16.7 years just to break even. I don't know about you, but if someone offered me $6,000 CASH TODAY or $30 per month for the next 16.7 years, I'm going to take the $6,000 CASH TODAY!

Further, if you studied economics and the "time value of money", you'll know that dollars "saved" at some point in the future aren't worth nearly as much as dollars saved TODAY. So, if we factored that into our "break even" point above, it would take MUCH longer to break even than 16.7 years.

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[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by C. C. Rider

None of the referenced links that I read compared the cost difference in a warm climate such as Florida. So, using my all electric home as an example, let's do some "back of the envelope" figuring.

Let's say that a house with ALL double-pane windows costs an extra $6,000 here in Florida. Now, again using my heating/cooling costs as an example, let's say that my monthly electric bill in my ALL ELECTRIC home was reduced about $30 per month if I had all double-pane windows.

OK, so $30 per month equals $360 per year. At that rate, it would take 16.7 years just to break even. I don't know about you, but if someone offered me $6,000 CASH TODAY or $30 per month for the next 16.7 years, I'm going to take the $6,000 CASH TODAY!

Further, if you studied economics and the "time value of money", you'll know that dollars "saved" at some point in the future aren't worth nearly as much as dollars saved TODAY. So, if we factored that into our "break even" point above, it would take MUCH longer to break even than 16.7 years.

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Your $6,000 estimate seems high to me, but I would just point out that the double pane windows will offer better noise control, less chance for condensation issues, more even heating and cooling, building code compliance, and most important, a higher resale value. I would not even consider buying a house that had single pane windows.

[thelegges]

Originally Posted by C. C. Rider

I'm not saying that single pane windows are as energy efficient as double pane windows. I'm simply saying that the slight extra cost for heating and cooling a house with single pane windows to reasonable temperatures here in central Florida doesn't justify the significantly additional cost of the double-pane windows all over the house.

My all-electric house with my wife and I living here year-round averages using 35 KwH per day or about 1,050 KwH per month. My average monthly bill with SECO is about $150 and I have NO gas bill. I can't complain at all about those costs.

EDIT TO ADD: According to this link Florida Building Code • Requirements • Windows | FHIA Remodeling Blog, it doesn't appear that double pane windows are required in this area.

.

Our 2,872sf house with a pool KwH daily usage in summer months is 28-31KwH. Windows are double pane house is navy blue, which does draw more heat than our yellow house

[C. C. Rider]

Originally Posted by thelegges

Our 2,872sf house with a pool KwH daily usage in summer months is 28-31KwH. Windows are double pane house is navy blue, which does draw more heat than our yellow house

Is that house "all electric" like mine? Also, are you heating the pool?

.

[mtdjed]

Originally Posted by JRcorvette

You definitely should insulate the ceiling and it may be required. Double pane glass does not help all that much. Better to spend the money on some sun screen shades to use when needed. I would suggest try leaving the doors open during the daytime and close when you go to bed (mostly for security). See how your energy bill changes. An extra 300sf is not that much. The cost of adding a mini split AC is between $6000 & $7500. Do the math that will cover many years of a slightly higher AC bill.

Disagree with your statement that double pane glass does not help that much. Agree that shades should be added. The shades can minimize the direct sun radiant heat. Single layer of glass windows will act like a heater during the summer and a cooler during colder weather.

Doing it cheap is a choice that you would likely regret. Our 300 sq ft addition was done with insulation, Double pane windows, shades, and Mini split. It is our main living area year-round. No restrictions. The room is efficient all year round with no need to think about lanai doors open or closed.

[RICH1]

install MITSUBISHI Split unit in your patio... It will make everyone happy.. You will be glad you did.. Best money I ever spent