[Goldwingnut]

Originally Posted by Topspinmo

‘fact, the golf courses and their maintenance is a small portion of the overall amenity fee.’

Do you have figures to back that fact up? Golf courses I bet are half of amenities fees cost?

Here are the FACTS from the proposed budgets for RAD and SLAD

Executive golf is about 3% of the total amenity budget

[Bogie Shooter]

End of BS statements on wild percentage guesses.
Case closed!

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Goldwingnut

Here are the FACTS from the proposed budgets for RAD and SLAD

Executive golf is about 3% of the total amenity budget

Thank you for the FACTS, I know you posted something similar last year, nice of you to repost it. So, 3% of $190 is $5.70/month for exec golf. I stand by my previous posts

[tophcfa]

Originally Posted by Goldwingnut

Here are the FACTS from the proposed budgets for RAD and SLAD

Executive golf is about 3% of the total amenity budget

Hey Don, just curious, what is SLAD and RAD? My understanding was that the amenities were controlled by the PWAC and the AAC? Are they subcommittees that report to PWAC and AAC?

I am surprised at how low a percentage Executive golf is of the total budgets, but then again, that might help explain the deteriorating conditions over the years? I can only imagine what it costs to maintain and heat (in the winter) the approximately 112 swimming pools.

[dewilson58]

Originally Posted by tophcfa

Hey Don, just curious, what is SLAD and RAD? My understanding was that the amenities were controlled by the PWAC and the AAC? Are they subcommittees that report to PWAC and AAC?

I am surprised at how low a percentage Executive golf is of the total budgets, but then again, that might help explain the deteriorating conditions over the years? I can only imagine what it costs to maintain and heat (in the winter) the approximately 112 swimming pools.

What I was surprised about is how "cheap" all the flowers are to replace.

[4$ALE]

Originally Posted by tophcfa

Hey Don, just curious, what is SLAD and RAD? My understanding was that the amenities were controlled by the PWAC and the AAC? Are they subcommittees that report to PWAC and AAC?

I am surprised at how low a percentage Executive golf is of the total budgets, but then again, that might help explain the deteriorating conditions over the years? I can only imagine what it costs to maintain and heat (in the winter) the approximately 112 swimming pools.

https://www.districtgov.org/images/A...pdf?v=20230721

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by Topspinmo

‘fact, the golf courses and their maintenance is a small portion of the overall amenity fee.’

Do you have figures to back that fact up? Golf courses I bet are half of amenities fees cost?

You'd lose that bet... The actual amount (from those who actually know how much money is spent $$$) has been posted, multiple times...

IIRC it's less than 10%... Closer to 5%...

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by Maker

EVERYBODY should pay the SAME amount of money for IDENTICAL amenities.

I do not care about the method they invented to calculate amenity fees. I do not care when the "anniversary date" is. I do not care when the house was sold. I do not care about any long winded reasoning to justify charging DIFFERENT AMOUNTS.

If you pay more than me, please explain exactly what you are getting for that extra money? What does your extra $25 a month get for you that I do not also get? Maybe preferred seating at cards? Better tee times? Pool temperatures controlled to the temperature you prefer?

And my property tax rate should be the same as the full timers who receive the "Sunshine Discount"...

But it's not... Should I get benefits because I pay more?

Is your mortgage rated the same for your neighbor, who has the exact same mortgage amount? No? Why not?

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by JMintzer

You'd lose that bet... The actual amount (from those who actually know how much money is spent $$$) has been posted, multiple times...

IIRC it's less than 10%... Closer to 5%...

It's 3% (per Don Wiley)... I stand corrected...

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by JMintzer

It's 3% (per Don Wiley)... I stand corrected...

More posters should respond in this manner!⭐️

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter

More posters should respond in this manner!⭐️

I don't mind doing it because it happens so rarely...

[LeRoySmith]

Originally Posted by JMintzer

I don't mind doing it because it happens so rarely...

Oh my

[Goldwingnut]

Originally Posted by tophcfa

Hey Don, just curious, what is SLAD and RAD? My understanding was that the amenities were controlled by the PWAC and the AAC? Are they subcommittees that report to PWAC and AAC?

I am surprised at how low a percentage Executive golf is of the total budgets, but then again, that might help explain the deteriorating conditions over the years? I can only imagine what it costs to maintain and heat (in the winter) the approximately 112 swimming pools.

SLAD is the Sumter Landing Amenities Division and RAD is the Recreation Amenities Division- these are divisions of the SLCDD and VCCDD that are the actual owners/controllers of the amenities north of 44 and north of 466 respectively.

PWAC and the AAC are resident advisory bodies that provide guidance to the SLAD/RAD. Neither has the actual authority to make a final decision or spend a dime of the amenity fees that are collected north of 44, any decision made has to be approved by the owners of the respective properties - SLAD & RAD

I’ll post the AAC and PWAC charter documents later this morning when I’m on my PC and not my iPad for all to read and understand that the AAC is only an advisory body for the amenities, regardless of they think the outcome of the lawsuit was.

Just a quick reality check here on the AAC and PWAC - the district office and the developer won’t like the following paragraphs too much, they’re much too blunt.

VCCDD and SLCDD are the owners of the amenities north of 466 and between 466 and 44, as such they have the sole authority and responsibility as a government body (a CDD under FS190) to manage, operate, and make all financial decisions related to the amenities they own. The AAC and PWAC are buffers between the VCCDD and SLCDD (the amenity owners) and the residents. Why? Because the VCCDD and SLCDD are land owner elected boards and the only significant landowner in these CDD is the developer, you can call it a “landowner election” but the reality is it is a developer appointed board. These boards as the owners do not need the input from the AAC and PWAC to make any decision, but they do want the input from the residents, they just don’t want to have to deal with the residents directly.

Acting as buffers, the AAC and PWAC get to sit through the sometimes hours of complaints, uninformed opinions, and whipped up hysteria (thank you POA ) that frequently accompanies difficult and controversial issues in the community. Having been a member of the PWAC for nearly 8 years, I make the previous statement form a first hand and informed position. The VCCDD and SLCDD boards are spared these joyous times. After receiving the residents inputs the AAC and PWAC make their recommendations to the parent boards for final actions.

It’s been said many times over by staff that the parent boards have never overridden or gone against the recommendation of the AAC and PWAC. This is a true statement. Why it is so is important more to the VCCDD and SLAD than to the residents. The first time they override the AAC or PWAC they effectively neuter these committees and invalidate their existence; this translates to that they get to deal with the residents directly, something they really don’t want to do. The other reason this is important is finger pointing - if the committees make a poor decision, the boards can point back to the committees and say they were doing what was requested by the residents. These committees are the board’s poop shield and scapegoat. The first time they override a PWAC or AAC decision, PWAC and the AAC need no longer exist.

Concerning decision making: when a CDD board, Committee, or even the BOCC convene a meeting most the the decisions to be made by the boards are already determined in the minds of the board members before they walk into the room. This isn’t because they are given direction by anyone on how to vote, it is because they have spent the time researching and understanding the issues beforehand. They have been doing their due diligence to understand the facts, the laws associated, ramifications, impacts, and community inputs of the issues. They are making the decisions based on an educated and informed position that many times does not agree with the passion of the resident that come to speak at the meetings. Be glad for this, because otherwise it becomes mob rule and decisions would be made based on who can gather the biggest crowds and can yell the loudest.

If you want to understand why board members make the decisions they do, ask them. Most all I know will take the time to help you understand why they have come to their decision. They are willing to have a calm and reasonable conversation with most any constituent. Does this mean that you can argue with them, get in their face, or threaten them? Not hardly, if you try these tactics the response you’ll likely get is they allow you to vent and then thank you for your input, they ignore you and walk away, or maybe even get law enforcement involved and have you removed. Your right to freedom of speech does not give you the right to disrupt a public meeting or verbally or physically abuse or accost another person or an elected official.

[tophcfa]

Originally Posted by Goldwingnut

SLAD is the Sumter Landing Amenities Division and RAD is the Recreation Amenities Division- these are divisions of the SLCDD and VCCDD that are the actual owners/controllers of the amenities north of 44 and north of 466 respectively.

PWAC and the AAC are resident advisory bodies that provide guidance to the SLAD/RAD. Neither has the actual authority to make a final decision or spend a dime of the amenity fees that are collected north of 44, any decision made has to be approved by the owners of the respective properties - SLAD & RAD

I’ll post the AAC and PWAC charter documents later this morning when I’m on my PC and not my iPad for all to read and understand that the AAC is only an advisory body for the amenities, regardless of they think the outcome of the lawsuit was.

Just a quick reality check here on the AAC and PWAC - the district office and the developer won’t like the following paragraphs too much, they’re much too blunt.

VCCDD and SLCDD are the owners of the amenities north of 466 and between 466 and 44, as such they have the sole authority and responsibility as a government body (a CDD under FS190) to manage, operate, and make all financial decisions related to the amenities they own. The AAC and PWAC are buffers between the VCCDD and SLCDD (the amenity owners) and the residents. Why? Because the VCCDD and SLCDD are land owner elected boards and the only significant landowner in these CDD is the developer, you can call it a “landowner election” but the reality is it is a developer appointed board. These boards as the owners do not need the input from the AAC and PWAC to make any decision, but they do want the input from the residents, they just don’t want to have to deal with the residents directly.

Acting as buffers, the AAC and PWAC get to sit through the sometimes hours of complaints, uninformed opinions, and whipped up hysteria (thank you POA ) that frequently accompanies difficult and controversial issues in the community. Having been a member of the PWAC for nearly 8 years, I make the previous statement form a first hand and informed position. The VCCDD and SLCDD boards are spared these joyous times. After receiving the residents inputs the AAC and PWAC make their recommendations to the parent boards for final actions.

It’s been said many times over by staff that the parent boards have never overridden or gone against the recommendation of the AAC and PWAC. This is a true statement. Why it is so is important more to the VCCDD and SLAD than to the residents. The first time they override the AAC or PWAC they effectively neuter these committees and invalidate their existence; this translates to that they get to deal with the residents directly, something they really don’t want to do. The other reason this is important is finger pointing - if the committees make a poor decision, the boards can point back to the committees and say they were doing what was requested by the residents. These committees are the board’s poop shield and scapegoat. The first time they override a PWAC or AAC decision, PWAC and the AAC need no longer exist.

Concerning decision making: when a CDD board, Committee, or even the BOCC convene a meeting most the the decisions to be made by the boards are already determined in the minds of the board members before they walk into the room. This isn’t because they are given direction by anyone on how to vote, it is because they have spent the time researching and understanding the issues beforehand. They have been doing their due diligence to understand the facts, the laws associated, ramifications, impacts, and community inputs of the issues. They are making the decisions based on an educated and informed position that many times does not agree with the passion of the resident that come to speak at the meetings. Be glad for this, because otherwise it becomes mob rule and decisions would be made based on who can gather the biggest crowds and can yell the loudest.

If you want to understand why board members make the decisions they do, ask them. Most all I know will take the time to help you understand why they have come to their decision. They are willing to have a calm and reasonable conversation with most any constituent. Does this mean that you can argue with them, get in their face, or threaten them? Not hardly, if you try these tactics the response you’ll likely get is they allow you to vent and then thank you for your input, they ignore you and walk away, or maybe even get law enforcement involved and have you removed. Your right to freedom of speech does not give you the right to disrupt a public meeting or verbally or physically abuse or accost another person or an elected official.

Thanks Don, very informative and sheds a lot of light on the reasoning behind that branch of the alphabet soup tree. To the casual observer, all the different boards and acronyms cloud transparency and make it very difficult to understand the inner workings of the whole CDD structure. It must be very difficult being a PWAC/AAC board member. Kind of like being the meat in a sandwich, where one slice of bread is the developer and the other is the Ammenity fee paying residents. Not an enviable position when controversial issues arise.

[Shipping up to Boston]

Originally Posted by Goldwingnut

SLAD is the Sumter Landing Amenities Division and RAD is the Recreation Amenities Division- these are divisions of the SLCDD and VCCDD that are the actual owners/controllers of the amenities north of 44 and north of 466 respectively.

PWAC and the AAC are resident advisory bodies that provide guidance to the SLAD/RAD. Neither has the actual authority to make a final decision or spend a dime of the amenity fees that are collected north of 44, any decision made has to be approved by the owners of the respective properties - SLAD & RAD

I’ll post the AAC and PWAC charter documents later this morning when I’m on my PC and not my iPad for all to read and understand that the AAC is only an advisory body for the amenities, regardless of they think the outcome of the lawsuit was.

Just a quick reality check here on the AAC and PWAC - the district office and the developer won’t like the following paragraphs too much, they’re much too blunt.

VCCDD and SLCDD are the owners of the amenities north of 466 and between 466 and 44, as such they have the sole authority and responsibility as a government body (a CDD under FS190) to manage, operate, and make all financial decisions related to the amenities they own. The AAC and PWAC are buffers between the VCCDD and SLCDD (the amenity owners) and the residents. Why? Because the VCCDD and SLCDD are land owner elected boards and the only significant landowner in these CDD is the developer, you can call it a “landowner election” but the reality is it is a developer appointed board. These boards as the owners do not need the input from the AAC and PWAC to make any decision, but they do want the input from the residents, they just don’t want to have to deal with the residents directly.

Acting as buffers, the AAC and PWAC get to sit through the sometimes hours of complaints, uninformed opinions, and whipped up hysteria (thank you POA ) that frequently accompanies difficult and controversial issues in the community. Having been a member of the PWAC for nearly 8 years, I make the previous statement form a first hand and informed position. The VCCDD and SLCDD boards are spared these joyous times. After receiving the residents inputs the AAC and PWAC make their recommendations to the parent boards for final actions.

It’s been said many times over by staff that the parent boards have never overridden or gone against the recommendation of the AAC and PWAC. This is a true statement. Why it is so is important more to the VCCDD and SLAD than to the residents. The first time they override the AAC or PWAC they effectively neuter these committees and invalidate their existence; this translates to that they get to deal with the residents directly, something they really don’t want to do. The other reason this is important is finger pointing - if the committees make a poor decision, the boards can point back to the committees and say they were doing what was requested by the residents. These committees are the board’s poop shield and scapegoat. The first time they override a PWAC or AAC decision, PWAC and the AAC need no longer exist.

Concerning decision making: when a CDD board, Committee, or even the BOCC convene a meeting most the the decisions to be made by the boards are already determined in the minds of the board members before they walk into the room. This isn’t because they are given direction by anyone on how to vote, it is because they have spent the time researching and understanding the issues beforehand. They have been doing their due diligence to understand the facts, the laws associated, ramifications, impacts, and community inputs of the issues. They are making the decisions based on an educated and informed position that many times does not agree with the passion of the resident that come to speak at the meetings. Be glad for this, because otherwise it becomes mob rule and decisions would be made based on who can gather the biggest crowds and can yell the loudest.

If you want to understand why board members make the decisions they do, ask them. Most all I know will take the time to help you understand why they have come to their decision. They are willing to have a calm and reasonable conversation with most any constituent. Does this mean that you can argue with them, get in their face, or threaten them? Not hardly, if you try these tactics the response you’ll likely get is they allow you to vent and then thank you for your input, they ignore you and walk away, or maybe even get law enforcement involved and have you removed. Your right to freedom of speech does not give you the right to disrupt a public meeting or verbally or physically abuse or accost another person or an elected official.

The POA (I am not a member) has been in existence since 1975. They represent hundreds if not (arguably) thousands of Villagers in their membership....and for that alone....should be respected. What I like about the organization is it is autonomous and independent. Most politicians don’t like this because.....ding ding ding, they can’t control it nor stifle their opinions and content. Although I did notice the ones that complain about them....still showed up at their Candidates Night on 7/18. It’s kind of like if someone has a YouTube channel and controls the narrative/content on there as well. I’m sure most understand the correlation.

The second to last paragraph......don’t look now but those words appear to be an endorsement of the BOCC as currently constituted. No argument there!