[Geodyssey]

Originally Posted by fcgiii

Has anyone dealt with ARS and bought their hybrid annuities?. The say they are fiduciaries and claim they can get you annuities that go up with the market and never lose money.

Why do business with liars when there are plenty of honest companies out there?

[Packer Fan]

So we are on page 3 of a typical annuity stream on the internet. First the haters who have never actually researched anything, then those who
Parrot “not a good investment” when it isn’t an investment at all, finally those who own one type of annuity but don’t understand the other types. And of course those who whine about the commissions (same people who paid $300k for a view of a marsh and never batted an eye about the huge real estate commission, I guess insurance agents are not supposed to eat), when they have zero to do with the question. At this point the poor original poster has no answer to his question.
So there are several type of annuities- MYGA, SPIA, DIA, VA, FIA, and now Hybrids. They are insurance contracts, not investments, but some act like investments. I own a VA and an FIA both with income riders (that’s why I bought them for guaranteed income)
NO way I am going to explain Hybrid annuities here but I will tell you it is like a fixed index annuity without the good part of your money never goes down. I would stay away. That said, you have to figure out what you want the annuity to do THEN look at the product.
I highly recommend you educate yourself by buying and reading Everything Wade Pfau ever wrote but start with safety first investing. He also has a bunch of stuff where he has been interviewed on YouTube-do a search. Also, you can watch “Stan the annuity man” on YouTube even though I don’t agree with everything he says he gives a good education.
The last thing you should do is listen to the people on here

[Blackbird45]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

Buying an existing policy and buying a new policy are two different things. People can sell an existing policy when they need cash, but the company that buys the policy gets a huge discount and makes a profit. But, if you expect to make money by buying a new policy, then you are trying to outsmart the insurance company. I don't think that would be a very predictable or successful way to make money. But, it's great for the broker who gets a commission for selling the policy. That may be the whole point.

He never told me if they were new policies or old, I just saw the returned he had already made on his money and the prospects to make more in the future. He wasn't trying to sell me anything he was more or less bragging. As I see it if your young and healthy, this could be a better investment than the stock market.

[valuemkt]

Don;t get mislead by the term fiduciary. It has become meaningless. Everyone in the business is a fiduciary. RUN

[Ski Bum]

To be clear, I am not defending annuities. They are typically a bad investment compared to other options. It's always the "compared to other options" that makes the difference. Here are a few best case scenarios where you could consider an annuity.

We are in a bear market, and you want to protect some principle for a needed expense in a future date. Since the original investment is guaranteed, the commission may seen like a reasonable insurance policy. Of course, cash acts much the same way, but you sacrifice any chance for the upside.

As a small part of your overall retirement. During a downturn, you could draw off of the guaranteed principle instead of taking losses on your growth/income portfolio.

Here's my last example from personal experience. Upon my grandfather's death, my grandmother gifted each grandchild a $25,000 annuity. We were all relatively young, and understood there was a severe penalty for withdrawal before 59 1/2. Well, I just did the calculation on that annuity now, 30 years later. The rate of return is 6.6%. That's below the market average, but it was safe when gifted, had a mechanism to discourage cashing out, and taught us all a lot about investing (I think that was my grandmother's entire point).

[Babubhat]

Avoid them. Period. You have better choices. Plenty of websites with reviews of products. Salesmen are Not your friend. free investment advice from a board is hazardous to your wealth.

[Geodyssey]

Originally Posted by Ski Bum

To be clear, I am not defending annuities. They are typically a bad investment compared to other options. It's always the "compared to other options" that makes the difference. Here are a few best case scenarios where you could consider an annuity.

We are in a bear market, and you want to protect some principle for a needed expense in a future date. Since the original investment is guaranteed, the commission may seen like a reasonable insurance policy. Of course, cash acts much the same way, but you sacrifice any chance for the upside.

As a small part of your overall retirement. During a downturn, you could draw off of the guaranteed principle instead of taking losses on your growth/income portfolio.

Here's my last example from personal experience. Upon my grandfather's death, my grandmother gifted each grandchild a $25,000 annuity. We were all relatively young, and understood there was a severe penalty for withdrawal before 59 1/2. Well, I just did the calculation on that annuity now, 30 years later. The rate of return is 6.6%. That's below the market average, but it was safe when gifted, had a mechanism to discourage cashing out, and taught us all a lot about investing (I think that was my grandmother's entire point).

You are obviously defending annuities. Why not be honest?

[Babubhat]

Any product that complicated is not worth investing in.

[Geodyssey]

Originally Posted by Babubhat

Any product that complicated is not worth investing in.

Like any shell game.

[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by Babubhat

Any product that complicated is not worth investing in.

Very true they make it so the average person cannot make head or tails over it and is taken in by the salesman.

[Packer Fan]

Originally Posted by Babubhat

Avoid them. Period. You have better choices. Plenty of websites with reviews of products. Salesmen are Not your friend. free investment advice from a board is hazardous to your wealth.

Please lead me to another option that can provide a guaranteed lifetime income no matter what that you can buy? Annuities might not
Be right for you, but the correct one is right for a lot of people to assure they don’t run out of money.

[Packer Fan]

Originally Posted by Babubhat

Any product that complicated is not worth investing in.

So you don’t invest in ETFs? Car insurance? Homeowners insurance? They are all just as complicated as a SPIA for sure if not most annuities. Just because YOU don’t understand them does not mean they are not appropriate for everyone. Maybe you shouldn’t use a computer since you probably don’t understand how silicon chips work.

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by Packer Fan

So you don’t invest in ETFs? Car insurance? Homeowners insurance? They are all just as complicated as a SPIA for sure if not most annuities. Just because YOU don’t understand them does not mean they are not appropriate for everyone. Maybe you shouldn’t use a computer since you probably don’t understand how silicon chips work.

Why won't they let you read the contract before you sign it?

[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

Why won't they let you read the contract before you sign it?

If people brought it to a competent professional in most cases would not sign contract.

[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by Packer Fan

So you don’t invest in ETFs? Car insurance? Homeowners insurance? They are all just as complicated as a SPIA for sure if not most annuities. Just because YOU don’t understand them does not mean they are not appropriate for everyone. Maybe you shouldn’t use a computer since you probably don’t understand how silicon chips work.

Not nearly as complicated and with those purchases you can cancel at any time.

Tell the people you are trying to convince annuities are good about that one. How much are surrender fees?