[cybrgeezer]

Originally Posted by dillywho

They do not pay the big bonds in addition to the ammenity fees, either. The ammenities, etc. are constructed with those bonds. We have to pay our share of the bonds to live here.

So, the folks who live in the Lake County portion of The Villages (no bond) shouldn't have full rights, either, even if they are paying the amenity fee?

And, if you want to say the bonds in Lake (were there ever any?) are all paid off, it would still be a "no bond" situation for any new buyer.

[chacam]

Where is this stated ? Or did you just hear of from someone?

Originally Posted by OutsiderWithInterest

Not correct. The neighborhood is restricted to people who work for the villages in some manner. Some may work for the district, recreation, etc. Some may work for a contractor who works for the villages.

[Pturner]

Originally Posted by cybrgeezer

The issue of who uses the facilities seems to be one of who pays the amenity fees. You all seem to feel – and rightly so – that if you have to pay, you should have exclusive rights to the facilities. No problem; in fact, it seems only fair.

But I have a question. Some time back, I posed this in an e-mail to the sales office as to whether it COULD be done. I received no answer. Now, I wonder how you feel about whether it SHOULD be possible:

How do you feel about people who live near The Villages paying the amenity fee for the right to use facilities and participate in activities? They would pay a fair fee (since on another thread about the fee it seems not to be standard throughout The Villages) in return for all the rights and privileges.

It seems that would alleviate everyone's objections to “outsiders” using pools, cart paths, etc., while allowing people who live nearby to not be excluded from the larger community, one that includes their 70,000 or so neighbors in TV.

I haven't seen anyone suggest this so far, so what do you all think?

Hi cybrgeezer,
Have you already purchased a home in TV? If not, do you think this would this still be your recommendation if you lived in TV?

I mean, who wouldn't love to buy near The Villages, and then for an amenity fee that is less than the cost of most country club memberships, be able to use all of the TV neighborhood facilities? Hmm, I'm just thinking, if we had done this, we could live in a nice subdivision without worrying about all non-neighborhood traffic. Indeed we could still have a neighborhood, while the poor suckers who lived in TV no longer would. They would be living in a heavily trafficked central Florida amusement park. Never mind that TV is a neighborhood planned community designed to have just enough facilities to profitably serve its residents. In this way, it is able to remain a neighborhood for those who choose to pay more for their homes to live here.

So I'm just wondering, if everyone, regardless of where they lived, could pay an amenity fee to use TV amenities, would you buy a house in TV, or would you buy one nearby?

I can understand you wanting to buying the golden eggs (amenities), absolutely. My question is whether you would actually buy the goose that laid the golden egg-- and then kill the goose?

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by skip0358

We visited some years back. We liked what we saw and that's what kep't us coming back. There were rules and restrictions, that's what we wanted. I had my share of don't tell me what I can do and the results were a very messy, depressed neighborhood. Anybody who bought elsewhere did so because the house prices were cheaper, the fees were cheaper, there were no bonds and very little rules.We bought a lifestyle and pay for this lifestyle, therefore we HAVE to protect this lifestyle. The pools, rec centers, golf courses etc. belong to us and our invited guests.I understand that the properties on 101 have a TV connection and I know they're not completed
( no rec. center & pool yet .) I believe when we visited there to look for my daughter the sales person said those residents had access to TV now what does that mean. As for the residents who life here with friends in the other communities close by you should not be getting guest passes for those people to have free access to our facilities. I know the guest pass rules were recently changed but I think they need to be tightened up a little more. Right now with the winter residents here it's pretty darn crowded at the pools and resteraunts. What's going to happen at build out or when more people are permanent. If you want to use here then move here. Just my opinion.

The restaurants have nothing to do with your argument. If the "outsiders" didn't use them we probably would not have the restaurants around very long.

[skip0358]

Wasn't refering to the resteraunts for restrictions of use just stating a fact of crowds. Gee!

[Lou Card]

BUT:::::::: without all the residents, the squares would not be there to enjoy by anyone. Lets try to keep the orig concept in tact. This place was built for retired folks to have a safe and fun environment to live in. You want a fun experience for young adults and kids, try the little theme park down the road called Disney. It in the Orlando area. Lots of young action there, so please leave the peace and quite of retired living in The Villages to The Villages residents.

Lou

[rabonkmontage@msn.com]

Originally Posted by Lou Card

We first came to The Villages 5 years ago with friends that live in here. We fell in love right away. Now, we have our home in Atlanta listed for sale and are planing on moving as soon as it sells. That said, articles like this make we want to take a closer look. At my age, I know that unfortunatly, rules are required for us unperfect humans. Without rules you have caos. Rules that are not enforced are worthless.

Show me a bunch of young men on the town square with their pants hanging down and underwear showing with or without a guest pass and I become unhappy.

Remember, you pay more for the house just because it is in the Villages:

You pay ammenities just because you live in the villages:

If you allow the rules to slide to much or issue to many Outside Visitor Passes, and you will have just another large Florida city.

Compare the crime rate of outside communities with that of The Villages.

For those that work on the villages, I have no problems with them having worker permits for the family pools and even the golf cart trails, but I would say no to anyone living within 100 miles of the villages but not in The Villages haveing a year long pass. Why would they have a pass??? So they can use the Facilities without any obligation whatsoever. To make one Resident happy that is a relative. If you took a vote, I feel confident that 1000's of passes would not be given out. Keep in mind that when the villages is built out, rules will have to take a strong stance toward enforcement or you will have total breakdown of the concept of this wonderful place.

Lou

I agree 100% with Lou and Army Guy

[dillywho]

Originally Posted by cybrgeezer

So, the folks who live in the Lake County portion of The Villages (no bond) shouldn't have full rights, either, even if they are paying the amenity fee?

And, if you want to say the bonds in Lake (were there ever any?) are all paid off, it would still be a "no bond" situation for any new buyer.

Once my bond is paid off and if I sell, there would be no bond attached to it to be paid by the buyer. It is a one time thing. Everyone does pay the ammenities fees and an annual assessment....everyone, every year.

Like I said earlier, would you build everything you wanted and then open it up to everyone just because they like what you have? Me neither. WE pay for this, you don't.

[dillywho]

Originally Posted by rabonkmontage@msn.com

I agree 100% with Lou and Army Guy

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by OutsiderWithInterest

I just have to rant here.

Gosh, I was considering moving into Bison Valley myself given the historic low prices right now, but I believe I will rethink that.

I love Villagers, but my gosh, there's a measely 96 homes in there. These are owned by the folks that keep the Villages running; and some of your are miffed that these people might use your cart paths & pools?!

Give me !#$ break. If you want to live in a submarine where "only the residents" get in and close the hatch, that's fine, but if you're going to own the submarine, then be prepared to run the submarine. Let all the recreation, golf facilities, waste water facilities, landscaping---EVERYTHING be run by residents only. The rest of us interlopers will move on.

How would you all like that?

Go ahead and buy and move into Bison Valley. You will know the rules before you do that. Of all the posts here I have yet to read the "official" rules for Bison Valley residents. If the rule is you have full ammenity access.....than that is the rule. The objection we Villagers would have is not with you but the entity that sold you the home.If the rule is you do not have full ammenity access....than that is the rule. The objection we Villagers would have is now with you and we should demand from our entity that you not use the ammenities.
As a resident of Bison Valley and what you do for a living has nothing to do with this issue. Be ye a butcher, baker or candle stick maker....you still have to follow the rules (whatever they may be).
Rules are rules. If you bend the rules a little bit, then others want to bend them a lot.

[OutsiderWithInterest]

Thanks Bogie. I am still considering it and have been for over a year. I don't have the specific rules in front of me either, but I have been told that Bison Valley owners can do some things but not others.

By reading these boards though, one senses an undercurrent of unhappiness in some Villagers. Yes, I realize that no community is perfect, and it's a very small percentage, but it will probably be enough to keep me away in the end. I am used to living in A-1 surroundings where the "rules" fit on a single page. Before that I lived in a neighborhood with pretty loose restrictions, and it was nice. The more I learn about the Villages though, the more uncomfortable I become. It's not the restrictions that bother me so much as it is the volume of the self-appointed "cops" that trouble me. The last thing I want to do is keep an attorney on retainer to explain to me what I can and cannot do with my life.

Back to the specific issue of pools and rec centers, it is my understanding that, by law, it is impossible to keep the general public out of these facilities, that is, non-amenity paying people. I forgot the specifics, but I do remember it having to do with public access, highways, or some such thing.

I will say this to everyone though: If I could do it all over again, I would have become a lawyer. A person could make a killing in the Villages. Where there's a perpetual stack of rules and money flowing, there is ripe opportunity to skim a percentage off the top.

[dillywho]

Originally Posted by OutsiderWithInterest

Thanks Bogie. I am still considering it and have been for over a year. I don't have the specific rules in front of me either, but I have been told that Bison Valley owners can do some things but not others.

By reading these boards though, one senses an undercurrent of unhappiness in some Villagers. Yes, I realize that no community is perfect, and it's a very small percentage, but it will probably be enough to keep me away in the end. I am used to living in A-1 surroundings where the "rules" fit on a single page. Before that I lived in a neighborhood with pretty loose restrictions, and it was nice. The more I learn about the Villages though, the more uncomfortable I become. It's not the restrictions that bother me so much as it is the volume of the self-appointed "cops" that trouble me. The last thing I want to do is keep an attorney on retainer to explain to me what I can and cannot do with my life.

Back to the specific issue of pools and rec centers, it is my understanding that, by law, it is impossible to keep the general public out of these facilities, that is, non-amenity paying people. I forgot the specifics, but I do remember it having to do with public access, highways, or some such thing.

I will say this to everyone though: If I could do it all over again, I would have become a lawyer. A person could make a killing in the Villages. Where there's a perpetual stack of rules and money flowing, there is ripe opportunity to skim a percentage off the top.

I find it hard to believe that your information is on track. Would you have us believe that with all the lawyers in the area, practicing and former, that none of them would have already taken this to court?

You say you live where there are "rules". Is it ok for those not living there to come in and do as they please while you are bound by the rules?

We are not self-appointed cops, as you put it. I just don't like the idea of paying for something and then becoming unable to use what I pay for because others want something for free or very little cost to themselves. I am not unhappy; quite the contrary. I would just like to be able to stay that way and always have access to that for which I pay and am quite willing to do.

[downeaster]

Originally Posted by OutsiderWithInterest

Thanks Bogie. I am still considering it and have been for over a year. I don't have the specific rules in front of me either, but I have been told that Bison Valley owners can do some things but not others.

By reading these boards though, one senses an undercurrent of unhappiness in some Villagers. Yes, I realize that no community is perfect, and it's a very small percentage, but it will probably be enough to keep me away in the end. I am used to living in A-1 surroundings where the "rules" fit on a single page. Before that I lived in a neighborhood with pretty loose restrictions, and it was nice. The more I learn about the Villages though, the more uncomfortable I become. It's not the restrictions that bother me so much as it is the volume of the self-appointed "cops" that trouble me. The last thing I want to do is keep an attorney on retainer to explain to me what I can and cannot do with my life.

Back to the specific issue of pools and rec centers, it is my understanding that, by law, it is impossible to keep the general public out of these facilities, that is, non-amenity paying people. I forgot the specifics, but I do remember it having to do with public access, highways, or some such thing.

I will say this to everyone though: If I could do it all over again, I would have become a lawyer. A person could make a killing in the Villages. Where there's a perpetual stack of rules and money flowing, there is ripe opportunity to skim a percentage off the top.

Don't be put off by what you read here. There is a fund of misinformation here.

The restrictions here are no more onerous than the last two sub-divisions where I lived. ( Both had their share of self appointed "cops". ) I was in real estate prior to moving here and I can attest rules are better than no rules.

Amenities supported by residents are NOT open to the public. They are the property of the CDD (that's us).

Bison Valley is a very small village. Somewhere in this thread the number is mentioned but I believe it is less than 200 homes. The population here is pushing 80,000 so Bison Valley is a drop in the bucket. Evidently, for whatever reason, the developer gave those residence some or all of the priviledges of the rest of us. Some are not happy with this. I am not happy with it on principle but it is his/her prerogative. If I were buying here now knowing what I know I would not consider it a deal breaker. In fact, I wouldn't even consider it.

I am going to borrow from Ella Fitzgerald who is supposed to have said " I have been rich and I have been poor, rich is better". My version is " I have lived all over the US and I have live here eight years, here is better".

[sandybill2]

Outsiderwithinterest==you are right that you can arrive at these rec centers and pools via public roads but you should be denied access without a Village Card--either guest pass or Resident Pass. I am sure you have heard of Private Clubs, Country Clubs, etc., where you have to pay a fee to "belong." You would be denied access to them--regardless of what public road you used to get there. It is the same with our amenity fees---we pay them to have access to pools, rec center activities, etc. for ourselves and our guests. I really don't have a problem with the Bison residents using our golf cart trails--- I don't think there are many that do but I do appreciate all the people that work for The Villages. They are the ones that help make this a wonderful place to live but I also realize that jobs are scarce and that we should take care of each other.

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by OutsiderWithInterest

..........
Back to the specific issue of pools and rec centers, it is my understanding that, by law, it is impossible to keep the general public out of these facilities, that is, non-amenity paying people. I forgot the specifics, but I do remember it having to do with public access, highways, or some such thing......

your understanding based on who or what? Sorry but this how rumors get started. I believe what you are saying is hearsay, I doubt there ever were specifics.