[SteveZ]

Originally Posted by djl8412

Steve Z:

It's surprising to see you your skin so thin when the reporter called TV a playground for retirees. With all the advertising TV does nationwide for all the activities and amenities here, it doesn't seem insulting when one uses that summary. I kind of think it's a playground even though I'm not retired yet and I like it here. It sure ain't no nursing home.

Of all of my many faults, "thin skin" isn't one of them.

I love it here, too. And I agree that it's no nursing home. But it isn't an amusement park, either.

In Post #62 there was notice that when the Sentinel columnist wrote on the bond topic, it was done with "fact with an opinionated slant." And at the end of the post was the notice that a "reporter" instead of a columnist also wrote an article on the topic, as if the fact that the "reporter's" writing was devoid of opinion.

"Playground" is hardly an objective description of The Villages, anymore than "Orlando Makes Me Smile" (the official slogan of Orlando Tourism) describes the true City of Orlando - which ranked #6 in Forbes' Top 15 most dangerous cities in the USA (April 2009). Which is true (both, either or neither?) Marketing slogans are subjective hype. To insinuate they represent and claim them as an "objective description" of the place is poor reporting and worse editing, unless there is indeed "columnist" intent versus journalistic objectivity.

[SteveZ]

Originally Posted by Advogado

We seem to have strayed here. The subject is not whether or not StevieZ is a pontificator, whether or not The Villages is a playground or merely a great place to live, or whether Lauren Ritchie is a columnist or a reporter or neither. The subject is the very serious question of the impact of an IRS victory on the future of The Villages.

Pontificator that I may be.....

Until the matter is settled between the Government (IRS) and TVCCD, it's all conjecture. "Impact" won't be known until quantification has been settled, and that seems very much a matter of negotiation.

It's rare that any party puts their "best and final" position as their first and public position. It's usually the starting point, and then the negotiators work from each's starting point, rarely meeting in the middle. So, until the negotiations are complete, or, if stale-mated, the matter is litigated through all the appropriate judicial levels, it's a guessing game for the rest of us.

Would I like to see conclusion of the matter? Yep! However, trying to guess the outcome based on the public record is trying to claim that some algorithm can be applied to everything (including unspoken negotiation positions and other factors which can come into play during private talks) which can spit out an answer. That algorithm doesn't exist.

So much for this pontification....

[Muncle]

Originally Posted by surfangel

Yes ignorance is bliss. Hear no evil see no evil
Quote from Ms. Ritchie article<<Morse becomes almost unfathomably rich from the bond proceeds. And residents are saddled with 30 years of payments on $709 million worth of loans.....Without bonds, that $16 million annually could be going into building and operating even more fun stuff for Villages residents instead of paying off the loans that made Morse rich.>>

But apparently the little village people are quite happy playing with their golf balls. I for one worked very hard for my money, and don't like the idea of paying more than I should. Mr. Morse could do more for the Villages like include lawn service and bigger swimming pools with covers but he sleeps well at night knowing that nobody cares how rich he gets using our money.
As much as I hate the IRS, the are not going put a dent in Mr. Morse bank account he will simply take out the difference in amenity fees.
Solivata is looking very good right now. It maybe smaller than the Villages but it has better toys.

Don't let the door hit ya!



`

[Bogie Shooter]

What is a Solivata?
One pool, one golf course, one rec center.
Hope you enjoy!

[Quixote]

Originally Posted by Stantheman

Lauren,

My guess says Mr. Morse settles the issue, pays the penalty, reimburses the VCDD for the difference in interest rates between tax-free and taxable bonds for the 2003 facilities sales , and establishes a more defendable yet profitable evaluation process going forward for a considerable amount of future facilities sales.

Me again. This is what I said yesterday. Todays taxed bond rates may be less then the tax-free bond rates from 03. Maybe because of the tanked economy it may be a wash if this is part of the outcome.

But why are people trying to figure an outcome when theres no way to have a clue what the outcome can be. Its almost like there are people like the Orlando paper who are deliberately stirring up things pretending to be reporting, and for some villagers they are suceeding. Maybe they are looking to sell more papers or maybe there own policies are showing in this negative so-called reporting.

I think there are people who resent Mr. Morse's great personal financial success even though he is building a quality product and from what I read there are people, even inside the Villages who enjoy living there, who will knock him down no matter what he does. If hes wrong on this IRS thing, thats between him and the IRS. Why are people getting so upset when theres no facts or outcome yet to be upset about.

Someone said something about a "IRS victory." This is a strange way to put it. This isnt a war, this is a matter of law. And the law will sort it all out, Im sure.

[chuckinca]

Originally Posted by Muncle

Don't let the door hit ya!



`

Not too Friendly Muncle - you'll be in the stocks again!

.

[Muncle]

Originally Posted by Quixote

Me again. This is what I said yesterday. Todays taxed bond rates may be less then the tax-free bond rates from 03. Maybe because of the tanked economy it may be a wash if this is part of the outcome.

But why are people trying to figure an outcome when theres no way to have a clue what the outcome can be. Its almost like there are people like the Orlando paper who are deliberately stirring up things pretending to be reporting, and for some villagers they are succeeding. Maybe they are looking to sell more papers or maybe there own policies are showing in this negative so-called reporting.

I think there are people who resent Mr. Morse's great personal financial success even though he is building a quality product and from what I read there are people, even inside the Villages who enjoy living there, who will knock him down no matter what he does. If hes wrong on this IRS thing, thats between him and the IRS. Why are people getting so upset when theres no facts or outcome yet to be upset about.

Someone said something about a "IRS victory." This is a strange way to put it. This isnt a war, this is a matter of law. And the law will sort it all out, Im sure.

Thank you, Don. You've reiterated a point a couple of us have tried to make earlier in this thread and in previous threads. From the views of several folks, we evidently failed. I hope your logic fares better.

You said it pretty straightforwardly: "why are people trying to figure an outcome when theres no way to have a clue what the outcome can be" There are no facts yet, only opinion.



`

[Lauren Ritchie]

EdVinMass

i understand why you call the district the developer's.

legally, however, it's just not so. i guess you can persist in that line of thought if you like. but you will find that the rest of the legal world, including the IRS, is proceeding as though it is a separate entity, one that theoretically is supposed to act in the best interest of the residents.

advogado,
bingo. perfect. you nailed it.

lauren

[EdV]

Lauren,

Once again you misunderstand me and continue to harp on the distinction between Gary Morse the person, and the legal enterprises that he controls. But I was taking issue with you on the fact that you implied that because of that distinction, it somehow meant that The District (the VCCDD and SLCDD) had somehow become "Your" government as you called it. Here are your statements:

Statement: “Realize that Morse did not issue these tax-exempt bonds. The board of supervisors of your district government did.”

Statement: “….he is not liable for any taxes on the bonds because he didn't issue the bonds -- your district did.”

Would you kindly respond to that issue and explain to the other members of TOTV exactly who you are referring to when you use the word “Your”. Being a Poli-Sci major, I’m sure you’re aware that under Florida Law, Chapter 190, the Board of Supervisors of a CDD are elected by the Landowners in the CDD and not by Landowners in other CDDs.

[ricthemic]

Originally Posted by EdVinMass

Lauren,

Once again you misunderstand me and continue to harp on the distinction between Gary Morse the person, and the legal enterprises that he controls. But I was taking issue with you on the fact that you implied that because of that distinction, it somehow meant that The District (the VCCDD and SLCDD) had somehow become "Your" government as you called it. Here are your statements:

Statement: “Realize that Morse did not issue these tax-exempt bonds. The board of supervisors of your district government did.”

Statement: “….he is not liable for any taxes on the bonds because he didn't issue the bonds -- your district did.”

Would you kindly respond to that issue and explain to the other members of TOTV exactly who you are referring to when you use the word “Your”. Being a Poli-Sci major, I’m sure you’re aware that under Florida Law, Chapter 190, the Board of Supervisors of a CDD are elected by the Landowners in the CDD and not by Landowners in other CDDs.

EDVIN,
As someone else (like Lauren) who does not live in TV I think it is absolutely normal to refer to any local goverment, school sports team, library where you live as YOURS whether they are elected or appointed.
Or would you like to explain it further, again

[cabo35]

Originally Posted by Lauren Ritchie

EdVinMass

i understand why you call the district the developer's.

legally, however, it's just not so. i guess you can persist in that line of thought if you like. but you will find that the rest of the legal world, including the IRS, is proceeding as though it is a separate entity, one that theoretically is supposed to act in the best interest of the residents.

advogado,
bingo. perfect. you nailed it.

lauren

Lauren,

I have some sincere questions for you. No sarcasm intended or implied.

Have you ever written a positive column on the developer or The Villages?

For example, have you ever written about the positive and negative aspects connected to the development of The Villages? ie; the impact on the economy, jobs, increased tax revenues, medical facilities, schools, etc. in Sumter, Marion and Lake Counties.

Have you contrasted the area before the development and after? Are county residents better off now or before Mr. Schwartz and Mr. Morse created The Villages?

Have you ever toured the charter school campus built by the developer that educates non-Village residents? What a story there.

If not, wouldn't it give balance to what appears to be to many, a negative campaign against the developer and the Villages

There is certainly room for objective, conflicting and interesting perspectives on the above subject matter.

I am not connected in anyway with the developer and on occasion have been critical of some decision making. It has not diminished our happiness with living the dream in TV.




.

[GMONEY]

Originally Posted by cabo35

Lauren,

I have domr a sincere questions for you. No sarcasm intended or implied.

Have you ever written a positive column on the developer or The Villages?

For example, have you ever written about the positive and negative aspects connected to the development of The Villages? ie; the impact on the economy, jobs, increased tax revenues, medical facilities, schools, etc. in Sumter, Marion and Lake Counties.

Have you contrasted the area before the development and after? Are county residents better off now or before Mr. Schwartz and Mr. Morse created The Villages?

Have you ever toured the charter school campus built by the developer that educates non-Village residents? What a story there.

If not, wouldn't it give balance to what appears to be to many, a negative campaign against the developer and the Villages

There is certainly room for objective, conflicting and interesting perspectives on the above subject matter.

I am not connected in anyway with the developer and on occasion have been critical of some decision making. It has not diminished our happiness with living the dream in TV.




.

You might be asking to much there !!! Not many people would step away from the negative news making info to let people know what good comes from The Villages. That School is really good. That is thanks to fine people of The Villages and the developers. You will only get the dirty smack. Just look at the news on at 5 from any channel. It is all bad for about the first 17 minutes, then the weather comes on. The back to negative or about the Magic and how the players live in 7 million dollar mansions.

Not to often a "reporter" will focus on the great stuff. Dirt is what attracts the big money.....

Just a Thought

[Quixote]

Originally Posted by GMONEY

You might be asking to much there !!! Not many people would step away from the negative news making info to let people know what good comes from The Villages. That School is really good. That is thanks to fine people of The Villages and the developers. You will only get the dirty smack. Just look at the news on at 5 from any channel. It is all bad for about the first 17 minutes, then the weather comes on. The back to negative or about the Magic and how the players live in 7 million dollar mansions.

Not to often a "reporter" will focus on the great stuff. Dirt is what attracts the big money.....

Just a Thought

I couldnt agree more. Remember this story like other stories in other newspapers this reporter or columnist or what she calls herself may just be doing her job with a viewpoint she is told to use by her employer the Orlando newspaper.

[DickY]

Read this weeks Recreation News that is an insert in today's Sun that gives the VCCDD viewpoint on this subject. http://www.districtgov.org/images/wh...news200906.pdf

[Advogado]

For objective updates on the situation, I would suggest attending the monthly POA meetings. Website: http://www.poa4us.org/