[golfing eagles]

Here's an interesting subject for debate. This morning's news was "happy" to report that Orange County has spent over $10 million to install a more advanced wrong way driver warning system. Nationwide there is an average of 528 fatalities /year due to wrong way driving, so on the surface, maybe worth it.

Now let's drill down a bit. From 2019-2023 there were 402 wrong way fatal accidents in Florida, of which 159 were attributed to DUI. That leaves 243 or 48/year due to confusion/poor eyesight/age or less than minimal driving skills, in ALL OF FLORIDA. Orange county population is 1.53 M out of 23.6 M in all of Florida, or 6%. So the predicted fatal wrong way accident number is 3/year. That's the mathematical prediction

CFX reports so far this year there has been exactly one, YES ONE, such fatality'

So the philosophical question remains---is it worth the cost? How much do we spend to protect drivers from themselves (yes, there are a few that also cost the lives of the innocent victims, but the question remains). And is this the kind of spending that is addressed in amendment 3?

[CoachKandSportsguy]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Here's an interesting subject for debate. This morning's news was "happy" to report that Orange County has spent over $10 million to install a more advanced wrong way driver warning system. Nationwide there is an average of 528 fatalities /year due to wrong way driving, so on the surface, maybe worth it.

Now let's drill down a bit. From 2019-2023 there were 402 wrong way fatal accidents in Florida, of which 159 were attributed to DUI. That leaves 243 or 48/year due to confusion/poor eyesight/age or less than minimal driving skills, in ALL OF FLORIDA. Orange county population is 1.53 M out of 23.6 M in all of Florida, or 6%. So the predicted fatal wrong way accident number is 3/year. That's the mathematical prediction

CFX reports so far this year there has been exactly one, YES ONE, such fatality'

So the philosophical question remains---is it worth the cost? How much do we spend to protect drivers from themselves (yes, there are a few that also cost the lives of the innocent victims, but the question remains). And is this the kind of spending that is addressed in amendment 3?

First, additional safety is always costly, can't escape that. That is an immutable law of economics, and I don't make the laws, just report them!

However, your cost benefit question is always a good one. However, in MA this year, there were like 3/4 wrong way driver collisions in the month of July alone, with innocent people / police officers getting killed, and the drunks were not. Its a populist sensationalized issue for
sure, so its expected that politicians looking to do something proactive would spend the money.

I think the better answer is more enforcement, but that requires more money and personnel as well. . more holding facilities, more courts, faster decisions, which ultimately would cost much more money and time. .

so pick your poison for how to increase safety. .

[Bill14564]

How many deaths would it take for you to feel good about spending money to reduce the number? Isn't just one death too many?

I would look at it from another direction. Is the problem something that can be fixed with an improved warning system? Will the poor driver or inattentive driver be affected by the improved warnings? Will the driver intentionally driving the wrong way be deterred by the improved warnings?

If it cannot be shown that the improved system will absolutely reduce wrong-way incidents then it is just money being spent for the sake of "just do something".

[CoachKandSportsguy]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

How many deaths would it take for you to feel good about spending money to reduce the number? Isn't just one death too many?

I would look at it from another direction. Is the problem something that can be fixed with an improved warning system? Will the poor driver or inattentive driver be affected by the improved warnings? Will the driver intentionally driving the wrong way be deterred by the improved warnings?

If it cannot be shown that the improved system will absolutely reduce wrong-way incidents then it is just money being spent for the sake of "just do something".

True if the decisions are reactive, and once proactive is done, its very hard to tell the deaths which have been avoided. . the curse of safety at the individual level.

[MrFlorida]

How many of these wrong way drivers were impaired? So more signage would probably a waste of money.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by MrFlorida

How many of these wrong way drivers were impaired? So more signage would probably a waste of money.

As stated in the OP, 159/402 were DUI.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

How many deaths would it take for you to feel good about spending money to reduce the number? Isn't just one death too many?.......
.

In that case, I'd like the tax payers to spend $100 TRILLION to protect me from any imaginable harm.

The better question is how many dollars would it take before the cost/life is ridiculous. The world is not a safe place, money is not infinite, so where is the dividing line?

[tophcfa]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Here's an interesting subject for debate. This morning's news was "happy" to report that Orange County has spent over $10 million to install a more advanced wrong way driver warning system. Nationwide there is an average of 528 fatalities /year due to wrong way driving, so on the surface, maybe worth it.

Now let's drill down a bit. From 2019-2023 there were 402 wrong way fatal accidents in Florida, of which 159 were attributed to DUI. That leaves 243 or 48/year due to confusion/poor eyesight/age or less than minimal driving skills, in ALL OF FLORIDA. Orange county population is 1.53 M out of 23.6 M in all of Florida, or 6%. So the predicted fatal wrong way accident number is 3/year. That's the mathematical prediction

CFX reports so far this year there has been exactly one, YES ONE, such fatality'

So the philosophical question remains---is it worth the cost? How much do we spend to protect drivers from themselves (yes, there are a few that also cost the lives of the innocent victims, but the question remains). And is this the kind of spending that is addressed in amendment 3?

The same question keeps coming up regarding spending $$$$ to make Morse Blvd between 466 and El Camino safer.

[golfing eagles]

Originally Posted by tophcfa

The same question keeps coming up regarding spending $$$$ to make Morse Blvd between 466 and El Camino safer.

Exactly. And since the overwhelming majority of those fatalities were caused by a cart turning directly in front of a car, we're stuck with Judge Judy's quote---"you can't fix stupid"

[JoMar]

So what percentage of the total budget is 10M? Might be an insignificant investment.

[jimhoward]

$10M is not a lot of money. I think Orlando roads can be pretty confusing, and you have quite a few tourists traveling them for the first time. So many crossing highways. Plus you have those diverging diamond interchanges. Its probably not a bad way to spend a few bucks.

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by JoMar

So what percentage of the total budget is 10M? Might be an insignificant investment.

According to a Florida County Property Tax Report, in 2024 Orange County collected $1,377M in ad valorem taxes.

[tophcfa]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Exactly. And since the overwhelming majority of those fatalities were caused by a cart turning directly in front of a car, we're stuck with Judge Judy's quote---"you can't fix stupid"

Having driven on that particular stretch of road thousands of times over the years, I can say I’ve witnessed and or encountered lots of stupid from both golf cart and automobile drivers. The key to survival is to assume every other form of transportation, be it car, truck, golf cart, or bicycle, is about to do something incredibly stupid.

[JoMar]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

According to a Florida County Property Tax Report, in 2024 Orange County collected $1,377M in ad valorem taxes.

So closer to a rounding issue

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Here's an interesting subject for debate. This morning's news was "happy" to report that Orange County has spent over $10 million to install a more advanced wrong way driver warning system. Nationwide there is an average of 528 fatalities /year due to wrong way driving, so on the surface, maybe worth it.

Now let's drill down a bit. From 2019-2023 there were 402 wrong way fatal accidents in Florida, of which 159 were attributed to DUI. That leaves 243 or 48/year due to confusion/poor eyesight/age or less than minimal driving skills, in ALL OF FLORIDA. Orange county population is 1.53 M out of 23.6 M in all of Florida, or 6%. So the predicted fatal wrong way accident number is 3/year. That's the mathematical prediction

CFX reports so far this year there has been exactly one, YES ONE, such fatality'

So the philosophical question remains---is it worth the cost? How much do we spend to protect drivers from themselves (yes, there are a few that also cost the lives of the innocent victims, but the question remains). And is this the kind of spending that is addressed in amendment 3?

Are fatalities the only criteria? This is the same thing that people use to justify anti-vax propaganda. That "most people don't die" if they get the measles. But how many of them get sick? How many end up with a hospital visit? How many people have to take time out from work, or school, or families taking time out for both, when one person in the household has the measles?

How many fender-benders with no injuries, but time out from work, time without your vehicle, the frustration of having to deal with any of it, and in some cases - the mental trauma - caused by people going down the road in the wrong direction? How many people hospitalized - but not killed? How many injured, but not hospitalized? How many injured badly enough that they are disabled - but not dead? Or that they need a month in rehab, or with 24/7 home care - but they're not dead? Or who have heart attacks as a result of being in a wrong-way accident - and die from the heart attack and not directly from the accident?

I'll take a guess that there are MANY more than 3 in Orange County, if you include ALL of the medical, emotional, vehicle repair, and inconvenience rather than just fatalities.