[gomoho]

I don't understand why the residents of Fruitland Park wouldn't want to reap the benefits this project would bring to their city. It is a small portion of land that will be developed that will have a huge financial impact for them.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by gomoho

I don't understand why the residents of Fruitland Park wouldn't want to reap the benefits this project would bring to their city. It is a small portion of land that will be developed that will have a huge financial impact for them.

They are jealous of us and aggravated at some of our very uppity behavior and they are sick of us coming in to what was their space. Some of us are good ambassadors and some of us are not.

I can't blame them.

[janmcn]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

That sounds ugly. "in their pocket". I am so tired of this disdain toward the Morse family for no good reason.

What other explanation is there for having a big project in one county, Lake County, but wanting another county, Sumter County, to do all the approvals and permiting? Has this ever been done before in the whole state of Florida?

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by OldManTime

I attended, and my thoughts are the same as "RUBICON" and think "ANGIEFOX10" must be connected with the Villages somehow. There were residents sitting all around me, and what i heard from them were snickers and boos when Mr Moyer, gave his speech at the residents. There were many standing, who came in late that were applauding when each of the Villages officials spoke, I doubt they were Fruitland Park residents.
Then a public meeting was 1 on 1 with individual commissioners, so not all attendees were able to hear there conversations, how strange.


My gut tells me the Fruitland Park will turn down the Villages offer of big bucks

Glad to hear that some villagers made aXXes of themselves at the meeting.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by janmcn

What other explanation is there for having a big project in one county, Lake County, but wanting another county, Sumter County, to do all the approvals and permiting? Has this ever been done before in the whole state of Florida?

I don't know but it may be because their operation is based in Sumter county and We are the reason for most of Sumter county's commerce. I say if Lake county doesn't want The Villages than too bad.

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by janmcn

What other explanation is there for having a big project in one county, Lake County, but wanting another county, Sumter County, to do all the approvals and permiting? Has this ever been done before in the whole state of Florida?

What if it has?

[janmcn]

Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter

What if it has?

And what if it has not? Why would The Villages expect and receive this special treatment?

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by janmcn

And what if it has not? Why would The Villages expect and receive this special treatment?

Why do you think it is special treatment?

[Villages Kahuna]

1. Fruitland Park would be crazy not to negotiate with The Villages with the intention of having the development of 2,000 homes with 4,000 new residents added to their tax roles. It will take decades, if ever, for "normal" development to achieve these numbers. The incremental tax revenues would fix any funding uncertainties Fruitland Park has forever!

2. The Villages reps speaking at the meeting were absolutely correct in noting that this developer is a known quantity. How they build, maintain and manage their development is clearly evident by just driving from the historic section south to CR 44. There's a reason why more than 95% of residents vote in the annual survey that they would recommend The Villages to anyone. Does it make sense to anyone that developing the dairy property piecemeal with dozens of different builders, probably over decades, would be beneficial to Fruitland Park?

3. As far as having Sumter County handle all the permitting and inspections for the property located in Lake County, what would you demand were you the developer? There is simply no way that The Lake County building department and other staffs are adequately staffed to handle the requirements of a development that will move at the pace required by the Developer. Think about it--if you were the developer, how might you react if you wanted to build 19 homes a week (the actual a pace to sell out the new property in two years), then have the Lake County building department say, "...oh, we're sorry, we're only staffed to handle 5-6 new home construction permits a week." Having the properly staffed and scaled Sumter County building department handle permitting and inspections would be a deal-killer issue were I the Developer. All Lake County has to do is authorize Sumter to do the job for these 1,972 homes only. Easy fix, but a deal killer if it doesn't get done.

[njbchbum]

Originally Posted by Villages Kahuna

1. Fruitland Park would be crazy not to negotiate with The Villages with the intention of having the development of 2,000 homes with 4,000 new residents added to their tax roles. It will take decades, if ever, for "normal" development to achieve these numbers. The incremental tax revenues would fix any funding uncertainties Fruitland Park has forever!

2. The Villages reps speaking at the meeting were absolutely correct in noting that this developer is a known quantity. How they build, maintain and manage their development is clearly evident by just driving from the historic section south to CR 44. There's a reason why more than 95% of residents vote in the annual survey that they would recommend The Villages to anyone. Does it make sense to anyone that developing the dairy property piecemeal with dozens of different builders, probably over decades, would be beneficial to Fruitland Park?

3. As far as having Sumter County handle all the permitting and inspections for the property located in Lake County, what would you demand were you the developer? There is simply no way that The Lake County building department and other staffs are adequately staffed to handle the requirements of a development that will move at the pace required by the Developer. Think about it--if you were the developer, how might you react if you wanted to build 19 homes a week (the actual a pace to sell out the new property in two years), then have the Lake County building department say, "...oh, we're sorry, we're only staffed to handle 5-6 new home construction permits a week." Having the properly staffed and scaled Sumter County building department handle permitting and inspections would be a deal-killer issue were I the Developer. All Lake County has to do is authorize Sumter to do the job for these 1,972 homes only. Easy fix, but a deal killer if it doesn't get done.

bk - i agree with points 1 & 2 but hafta take exception to #3 since lake county is the county that needs the $$ received from all of those permits and inspections. and sumter county is likely not familiar with the lake county policies/procedures for permitting and inspecting [i don't know if there is a uniform way to do things between counties - but here in nj every town does something different].

perhaps the developer could convince sumter county to help train new staff for lake county if there is a uniform way of doing things among counties; or loan lake county several employees [an excellent way to get an inside look at what goes on in that office!]; or just process the work and give the fees to lake county!

[Villages Kahuna]

Originally Posted by njbchbum

bk - i agree with points 1 & 2 but hafta take exception to #3 since lake county is the county that needs the $$ received from all of those permits and inspections. and sumter county is likely not familiar with the lake county policies/procedures for permitting and inspecting [i don't know if there is a uniform way to do things between counties - but here in nj every town does something different].

perhaps the developer could convince sumter county to help train new staff for lake county if there is a uniform way of doing things among counties; or loan lake county several employees [an excellent way to get an inside look at what goes on in that office!]; or just process the work and give the fees to Lake county!

Typically, the fees charged by governmental building departments basically cover their costs of operation, They're not "profit makers".

With the exception of only one large city in the U.S., no other counties or municipalities create their own building codes. There are national codes that are widely accepted for governing residential building. In the USA the main codes are the International Commercial or Residential Code [ICC/IRC], including electrical, plumbing and mechanical codes. There are a few local or state-wide amendments to codes, such as some minor requirements for hurricane protection here in Florida. But those minor amendments are widely accepted and reflected in local building codes across the state. I think the differences you cite in New Jersey are differences in staffing and the way various sized municipalities administer the building codes, not the codes themselves.

Due to ever increasing complexity and cost of developing building regulations, virtually all municipalities in the United States have chosen to adopt model codes instead. The City of Chicago remains the only municipality in America that continues to use a building code the city developed on its own as part of the Municipal Code of Chicago. My educated guess is that the Lake and Sumter county building codes read word-for-word like the national model residential building code.

So the key issue seems to be which building department is prepared to keep pace with the demands of a very large and fast-moving project? As has been noted here, if the Villages of Fruitland Park proceeds, Fruitland Park will be the fastest growing municipality in the U.S for about two years.

Look at it from the viewpoint of the Developer. They will be placing millions of dollars at risk in building this development. Their formula is pretty simple. Prior to actually starting construction, the roads and utilities are paid for from the proceeds of bond issuances. Then they build houses so fast that they don't even need construction financing. They build, sell and close so quickly that they can finance construction within the normal payment terms offered by their suppliers of the building materials they use. By the time the bill for foundations, lumber, electrical and the like is due, the house is sold and closed and the suppliers are paid from the proceeds of the new homeowner's mortgage loans.

Basically, the development can proceed without the Developer even borrowing money, so long as it proceeds at the planned pace needed to build, sell and close in their normal window of about 45 days. If anything interferes with this program, the whole development model falls apart...and could become very costly for the Developer.

Maybe the question that should be asked is, if you were the developer would you agree to proceed with this development under the aegis of the Lake County authorities, knowing that the number of building permits and inspections required will about three times the normal volume per year administered by the county building departments?

Not only isn't Lake County staffed to oversee such a project, but unless they build a temporary building department office right here in The Villages (like Sumter has done down near the Sumter County annex on CR 466), the developer and contractors would have to run all the way down to Tavares for permits and other construction-related documents. In case you're unfamiliar, that's 23 miles on US 441 during daylight hours, "in season" more than an hour each way in heavy traffic.

The way I see it, this project will only proceed if the two counties get their heads together and permit Sumter County to continue with the permitting, inspections and oversight of this expansion of The Villages. That would be pretty easy to accomplish. All that would be needed would be...

• An inter-governmental agreement that Sumter County would administer the permitting and construction of The Villages of Fruitland Park development.
• That Sumter County would perform such administration using the building codes used by Lake County, presumably the national model building codes.
• That Sumter County would enter into a "hold harmless" agreement shifting any risk of litigation involving this specific development from Lake to Sumter County.

I know that if I were the developer, there is no way I would proceed otherwise. There would be way too much risk of inadequate governmental staffing and support, regardless of what they may promise prior to starting the development. I guess we've seen how good government promises in Washington are worth haven't we?

[bike42]

Villages Kahuna -- thank you for your thorough and thoughtful explanation.

[Big O]

I am new here and apparently do not know what is going on here. Can someone explain to me why this is a matter that current Village residents would care about?

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

That sounds ugly. "in their pocket". I am so tired of this disdain toward the Morse family for no good reason.

There are some on here, for whatever reason, lose all sense of logic and reason if The Villages management or the developer's name is mentioned. This is truly a character flaw with these folks who cannot even discuss issues without the ...well, I would describe it as character assassination...just simply ignoring the facts.

TOTV is NOT the place to be for any unbiased discussion of The Villages. If you are on the outside reading, you cannot possibily have a positive picture of our town. Hope this does not get me deleted, but not political...just joining Gracie in saying it is getting very old, and while what I know of is not big numbers, it loses posters.

Village Kahuana, as always has put things in perspective and those who simply use this forum as a hatchet for the developer should really work on reading skills to learn about what they post before looking so foolish.

Sorry Grace but I share your frustrations.

Discussion on issues is great and all sides should express themselves, but the tone 100 % of the time from some becomes so tiresome

[DianeM]

[QUi OTE=Big O;749722]I am new here and apparently do not know what is going on here. Can someone explain to me why this is a matter that current Village residents would care about?[/QUOTE]

I don't understand what the big deal is either.