Different Responses to the Sumter County 25% Tax Hike

Different Responses to the Sumter County 25% Tax Hike

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  #16  
Old 10-13-2019, 04:41 PM
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At the very least the county commissioners should reveal any current or past business or personal relationships with the developer.

Aren't there any investigative reporters who could examine their histories and present situations?
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  #17  
Old 10-13-2019, 04:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CFrance View Post
For future reference, she's a dudess.
Or maybe a dudette?
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  #18  
Old 10-13-2019, 04:44 PM
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I doubt the Developer was actually saved any money. The costs of the new roads was either going to be paid by the new home owners or the existing Sumter County residents (via increased County Taxes). If it was through increased impact fees, the increased impact fees would have been reflected in the prices of the new homes as the Developer would have passed the costs along to the new home owners.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Advogado View Post
It appears by enacting the tax increase in lieu of an increased impact fee, the Commissioners saved the Developer well over $100,000,000 and cost the taxpayers the same amount.
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Old 10-13-2019, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CFrance View Post
For future reference, she's a dudess.
foreign interference in the affairs of TV?
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  #20  
Old 10-13-2019, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by CFrance View Post
That probably will not happen due to all the politics involved. I fear we are in modern-day bubba country.
It isn't just here in "bubba country". This goes on in all states and cities in the US and in foreign countries also.
  #21  
Old 10-13-2019, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by biker1 View Post
I doubt the Developer was actually saved any money. The costs of the new roads was either going to be paid by the new home owners or the existing Sumter County residents (via increased County Taxes). If it was through increased impact fees, the increased impact fees would have been reflected in the prices of the new homes as the Developer would have passed the costs along to the new home owners.
Exactly. The people who benefit should be the one to pay.
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  #22  
Old 10-13-2019, 05:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Velvet View Post
Exactly. The people who benefit should be the one to pay.
Yes, as these costly extensive 'improvements' are solely necessitated by the developer's wanting to develop huge tracts of raw land. Only the developer benefits.

New development by a single entity is essentially what is driving the 25% tax increase for all in Sumter County. It is certainly not needed to maintain what is in place.
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Impact-fee math
  #23  
Old 10-13-2019, 05:24 PM
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Default Impact-fee math

Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 View Post
Appears the $100mil is over stated.


What is the support for this claim??
A fair question.

I was trying to keep the original post relatively short. If anything, the $100,000,000 figure that I cited is understated, but I used it because it is easily verifiable. As reported in several sources, including the October POA Bulletin (see page 2) and in the on-line news website, the road improvements necessitated by the Developer's massive expansion of The Villages will cost $100,000,000. Those roads should be paid for by an increase in the Developer's $901 impact fee, but they are not, thanks to the County Commissioners. Instead, those roads are being paid for with our 25% tax hike.

Note, also that Sumter County only collects impact fees from the Developer for roads. Collier County, where the Commissioners were not handpicked by the Developer, also requires the builder of a house in a retirement community to pay impact fees with respect to the need for expansion of the following infrastructure, in addition to roads: Community Parks, Regional Parks, EMS, Schools, Government Buildings, Libraries, Law Enforcement, Jail, Sewer, and Fire-- all totaling about $20,000. All this data is available on the Collier County website. Why doesn't Sumter County collect impact fees from the Developer for any of these other items? I don't know and could only guess.

Now some simple math with really big numbers: The Developer reportedly is going to build 60,000 new houses. The Developer pays an impact fee that is $1,699 less than the builder of a single-family house outside The Villages in Sumter County. If the County Commissioners had just increased the Developer's impact fee to the non-Villages rate, it would generate the following extra revenue: 60,000 x $1,699 = $101,940,000. Eureka, the new roads are paid for without a property-tax increase.

Alternatively, if the Sumter County Commission calculated impact fees like Collier County does, that would generate the following extra revenue: 60,000 x ($20,000-$901) = $1,145,940,000. Eureka, nobody would have to pay any property-tax at all for the next few years.
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  #24  
Old 10-13-2019, 05:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manaboutown View Post
At the very least the county commissioners should reveal any current or past business or personal relationships with the developer.

Aren't there any investigative reporters who could examine their histories and present situations?
I am sure that The Villages Daily Sun will look into it.
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  #25  
Old 10-13-2019, 05:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Advogado View Post
A fair question.

I was trying to keep the original post relatively short. If anything, the $100,000,000 figure that I cited is understated, but I used it because it is easily verifiable. As reported in several sources, including the October POA Bulletin (see page 2) and in the on-line news website, the road improvements necessitated by the Developer's massive expansion of The Villages will cost $100,000,000. Those roads should be paid for by an increase in the Developer's $901 impact fee, but they are not, thanks to the County Commissioners. Instead, those roads are being paid for with our 25% tax hike.

Note, also that Sumter County only collects impact fees from the Developer for roads. Collier County, where the Commissioners were not handpicked by the Developer, also requires the builder of a house in a retirement community to pay impact fees with respect to the need for expansion of the following infrastructure, in addition to roads: Community Parks, Regional Parks, EMS, Schools, Government Buildings, Libraries, Law Enforcement, Jail, Sewer, and Fire-- all totaling about $20,000. All this data is available on the Collier County website. Why doesn't Sumter County collect impact fees from the Developer for any of these other items? I don't know and could only guess.

Now some simple math with really big numbers: The Developer reportedly is going to build 60,000 new houses. The Developer pays an impact fee that is $1,699 less than the builder of a single-family house outside The Villages in Sumter County. If the County Commissioners had just increased the Developer's impact fee to the non-Villages rate, it would generate the following extra revenue: 60,000 x $1,699 = $101,940,000. Eureka, the new roads are paid for without a property-tax increase.

Alternatively, if the Sumter County Commission calculated impact fees like Collier County does, that would generate the following extra revenue: 60,000 x ($20,000-$901) = $1,145,940,000. Eureka, nobody would have to pay any property-tax at all for the next few years.



There is not $100mil in the county's budget for improvements.



Silly to compare to Collier...............Why would the county collect $1BILLION dollars.
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  #26  
Old 10-13-2019, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biker1 View Post
I doubt the Developer was actually saved any money. The costs of the new roads was either going to be paid by the new home owners or the existing Sumter County residents (via increased County Taxes). If it was through increased impact fees, the increased impact fees would have been reflected in the prices of the new homes as the Developer would have passed the costs along to the new home owners.
I can tell you from from my days as an economics major and my decades of experience as a corporate attorney, sellers cannot simply pass on their additional costs to buyers. Competition prevents it. If sellers could simply pass on their added costs, the present GM strike would have been settled long ago.

But let's assume that the Developer could pass along some or all of the additional impact fee to buyers-- fine. The existing taxpayers would not be paying for the cost of the expansion the way we are now.
  #27  
Old 10-13-2019, 05:43 PM
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Thank you, Advogado, for bringing all the information to our attention at this forum. When I first heard of the proposed tax increase I thought, “something is rotten in the state of Denmark” but now I know what that “something” is.
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  #28  
Old 10-13-2019, 05:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dewilson58 View Post
There is not $100mil in the county's budget for improvements.



Silly to compare to Collier...............Why would the county collect $1BILLION dollars.
The budget is an annual budget. All the infrastructure won't be built this year. The $100,000,000 figure is generally accepted. Do you have an alternative one?

I cite Collier for comparison purposes and to point out how low the $901 paid for by the Developer is by comparison.

The amount that should be collected here is obviously the total cost of infrastructure expansion (of all kinds, not just roads) necessitated by the Developer's massive expansion of The Villages divided by the number of houses to be built.

Now, I will ask you a question, Why when they learned of the Developer's plan to massively expand The Villages, didn't the County Commissioners recompute the Developer's impact fee instead of increasing everybody's property taxes?

I will ask you another question, would you identify yourself so readers can determine if you are affiliated with the Developer or Commissioners?
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  #29  
Old 10-13-2019, 05:47 PM
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I suspect The Villages, like the companies I worked for, has a gross margin target for their product. Any impact fee is just another cost and will be paid by the customer. You mentioned competition. The Villages essentially has no competition. I doubt a price increase, of say $10K for an increased impact fee, would affect sales as they sell everything they can build, and they have been doing it for some time now. Trying to compare The Villages to GM is not useful. GM has lots of competition.

As I indicated in my post, someone was going to pay for the roads and it turned out to be the existing residents, so, yes, I agree with your last statement. I wonder if bonds could have been floated?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Advogado View Post
I can tell you from from my days as an economics major and my decades of experience as a corporate attorney, sellers cannot simply pass on their additional costs to buyers. Competition prevents it. If sellers could simply pass on their added costs, the present GM strike would have been settled long ago.

But let's assume that the Developer could pass along some or all of the additional impact fee to buyers-- fine. The existing taxpayers would not be paying for the cost of the expansion the way we are now.

Last edited by biker1; 10-13-2019 at 06:11 PM.
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  #30  
Old 10-13-2019, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Velvet View Post
Thank you, Advogado, for bringing all the information to our attention at this forum. When I first heard of the proposed tax increase I thought, “something is rotten in the state of Denmark” but now I know what that “something” is.
You are right, the stench is overwhelming.

People not outraged by what has transpired are either affiliated with the Developer, affiliated with the County Commission, don't understand what has happened, or don't mind what amounts to their and other Sumter County residents' having their pockets picked to benefit the Developer.
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