[Chazz]

I cycle a lot on MUPs (multi use paths) outside TV, such as the Withlacoochee Stat Trail. The order of precedence for MUPs is horseback riders have right of way first, followed by pedestrians, then cyclists. It seems that the most vulnerable get the highest deference.

[SouthOfTheBorder]

Originally Posted by OldManTime

Joggers have the Right-of-Way?

Should one driving a golf cart on a specifically designated Golf Cart and Bicycle path on a main artery, like Morse Blvd., be expected to go into automobile traffic and risk being hit by a car?

Hello OMT,

I would like to preface my response by mentioning that I run 30-35 miles a week here in TV.

IMO, the answer to your question is self evident, a GC driver should not be expected to go into automobile traffic and risk being hit. Whether it is to avoid a runner, walker, pet or wild life.

However a piece of advice given to me by my father as he was teaching me to drive "Remember, as a driver, no one can take right-of-way, they can only give it", has remained with me to this day.

I suppose, if while driving, you felt you have the right-of-way then you will need to make you decisions accordingly.

Folks on foot are better prepared to avoid a potentially serious accident if they are walking/running facing traffic.

With that in mind, when I encounter a GC approaching me and I am in a diamond lane I will get out of their way if a motor vehicle is even reasonably close to the back of them. It has been my experience GC drivers are not bothered by my approaching them in a diamond lane as long as I acknowledge their approaching and they know I am yielding to them. Most GC drivers, even when I have vacated the diamond lane, will move toward the middle of the road and give a smile and wave and I do the same in return.

As a GC driver, if a runner was approaching me in the diamond lane and did not indicate any intention to "share" the space, I would stop before I put either of us in danger. In my mind the question of "who has right-of-way" is not a consideration. With that said, I would also make an attempt to share my feelings about the situation with the runner, in as positive manner as possible..

Anticipating the question of why am I running in the diamond lane when there are sidewalks? For me it comes down to the surface.... concrete is much harder on joints than blacktop. There are only two choices, concrete or blacktop in surfaces here in TV for more dedicated, long distance runners. Been running seriously for 35+ years, and now approaching 76 years old, I find I need to do what I can to extend my favorite pastime.

Finally, you mentioned specifically Morse Blvd. My own personal experience from running roads like MB, BV, 466 and 466A carries many more risks than rewards and I try to avoid those roads as much as possible. The speed difference between runners and GC/motor vehicles on those roads is just too great! The slow one will always loose when they touch!

As runner I understand where you are coming from and I think handling the situation you describe requires mature, "big-picture" actions by both parties.

Regards,
Don

PS, If I don't get out of your way fast enough, please don't run me down. I have promised our daughter we will run a 10k race together for my 100th birthday and I don't want to disappoint her..

[DougB]

GF?

[DAWN MARIE]

Originally Posted by SouthOfTheBorder

Hello OMT,

I would like to preface my response by mentioning that I run 30-35 miles a week here in TV.

Anticipating the question of why am I running in the diamond lane when there are sidewalks? For me it comes down to the surface.... concrete is much harder on joints than blacktop. There are only two choices, concrete or blacktop in surfaces here in TV for more dedicated, long distance runners. Been running seriously for 35+ years, and now approaching 76 years old, I find I need to do what I can to extend my favorite pastime.

I'm also a runner who has been running for over 30 years and run about 20 miles a week now. I also do my best to NOT run on the sidewalks for the same reason you mentioned. On occasion I get drivers in the golf carts yelling at me to "get on the sidewalk" but they have no idea what they're demanding. What's interesting is usually these golf carts are going by me at a very high rate of speed that I'm estimating is well over the 19 mph limit.

I also run against traffic unless there is a blind corner ahead of me and then I'll switch to run WITH traffic until I get past it usually around the tunnels. People have no idea how hard, hot, and difficult it may be running but yet sometimes they'll demand you move out of their way while they sit comfortably in their golf cart going by you. I really sometimes just want to say....Seriously?

I do my utmost best to be a considerate runner as an approaching cart comes my way. If there is a car falling fairly close behind them, I jump on the sidewalk so they don't have to worry about me and the car behind them. Then I jump back down. That can be hard on the knees so I try only to do it for these times. Outside of that I run close to the curb as possible to give them as much room as possible as they go by. When I do this, I'm actually not even on the blacktop but on the cement lip below the sidewalk. Sometimes that's not enough and I get choice words sent my way as they pass me. Most of the time I have to chuckle because there's nobody on the road but me and this person.

[mac9]

Originally Posted by BettyCrocked

I have had to just come to a complete stop in the diamond lane because a walker wouldn't take one step onto the grass and there were cars coming in the traffic lane. Once I stopped, they had to move over to get by.

What do you mean by "a diamond lane?"

[DonH57]

Originally Posted by mac9

What do you mean by "a diamond lane?"

On Morse blvd and a few other streets in TV there is a smaller lane on the right hand side going both directions. They are the golf cart lanes. they may also be used by pedestrians, bicycles, and other modes of transport. Golf carts are to stay right of the line unless they signal to safely come into the left lane to turn left just as a car would switch to the left lane to turn left. Hope I helped.

[rubicon]

The diamond lanes are not designated for runners but for golf carts and bikes and as such runners should move to safer ground.

I cannot tell you the number of times a runner coming toward me has challenged who will blink first.

I am very concerned about having to pull left into traffic. You can bet if a car strikes me that runner won't be lurking around.

My accident may in fact have a direct affect on his/her breaking a new running record.

I really don't care how hard a surface is on their legs that is not my problem its theirs to deal with and to find a sensible solution. I am concerned with my safety and that of other drivers.

IF THE LOCAL POLICE MONITOR TOTV THEN PLEASE CONSIDER ISSUING CITATION TO RUNNERS WHO PLACE PEOPLE IN DANGER BY ILLEGALLY UTLIZING THE DIAMOND LANE. IT IS TANTAMOUNT TO JAY WALKING AND SHOULD BE SUBJECT TO A FINE.

[DAWN MARIE]

Rubicon...Did you ever think about just stopping until the lone runner goes by? Two seconds. All that is necessary is to lift your foot off the pedal. That's it. Wave while you're at it. It will make our day.

There is actually enough room for both cart and runner on those lanes without the cart actually going into the car traffic. The few times I've run on Morse Blvd I've gone into the grassy area when an upcoming cart approaches but there might be a spot or two where that might be a problem. Also when a runner is putting in a lot of mileage sometimes they find themselves on the roadways because there's isn't enough golf cart paths to run on. We do our best to stay on the paths but sometimes a mile or two is needed to get ourselves onto the next path and out of major traffic. We would rather run with as little traffic as possible as that is the ideal but for various reasons that's not always doable. There isn't that many runners out there for this to be an issue.

[DAWN MARIE]

I have yet to hear of one accident caused by a runner. But I've heard of many accidents caused by golf carts GOING TOO FAST.

[Russ_Boston]

First: One poster used the term a few times Right-Away. I can only assume they meant Right-of-way? It was a good post but I was curious as to the expression used. Maybe I've been wrong all these years?

Second: Most of the streets south of 466 that have diamond lanes also have sidewalks. So when I run/walk I use the sidewalks even though I may jump into an empty diamond lane (facing traffic of course) if it is empty since the asphalt is more forgiving than concrete.

Third: On streets with no diamond lane (all my small neighborhood streets) there is very seldom enough traffic to worry about. There is plenty of room for the car/cart to move toward the center a little and give me the edge of the road. Haven't had a problem yet in 2 years.

[Chazz]

FYI, I will quote a section of Florida law, as it pertains to pedestrians:

316.130(3) states: "Where sidewalks are provided, no pedestrian shall, unless required by other circumstances, walk along and upon the portion of a roadway paved for vehicular traffic."

This suggests that it is OK to walk in the diamond lanes on Morse north of 466, but not on the south side.

[Chazz]

Originally Posted by rubicon

The diamond lanes are not designated for runners but for golf carts and bikes and as such runners should move to safer ground.

I cannot tell you the number of times a runner coming toward me has challenged who will blink first.

I am very concerned about having to pull left into traffic. You can bet if a car strikes me that runner won't be lurking around.

My accident may in fact have a direct affect on his/her breaking a new running record.

I really don't care how hard a surface is on their legs that is not my problem its theirs to deal with and to find a sensible solution. I am concerned with my safety and that of other drivers.

IF THE LOCAL POLICE MONITOR TOTV THEN PLEASE CONSIDER ISSUING CITATION TO RUNNERS WHO PLACE PEOPLE IN DANGER BY ILLEGALLY UTLIZING THE DIAMOND LANE. IT IS TANTAMOUNT TO JAY WALKING AND SHOULD BE SUBJECT TO A FINE.

The applicable Florida statute is 316.130(3), as I indicated in the message above this one, if there is no available sidewalk, the pedestrian may walk on the roadway. Therefore, dependent on the circumstances, it may be legal.

[DAWN MARIE]

The golf cart lanes are not part of the roadway for vehicular traffic per the law. Law enforcement go by and wave to me all the time when I'm running. They don't stop me and quote this law. I'm not in the street. I'm on the golf cart lane running alongside the sidewalk. This is unique to The Villages. I've run all over the country and never ever have had so much trouble running along the side of the road as here and we have the best lanes of all for running on. Sure we have to share with Golf Carts. That's the problem. Golf cart drivers are in a hurry and do not wish to share their portion of the road with us runners. And like I said there are NOT that many out there for this to be such an issue.

The sidewalks are for walkers. When I'm running quite often I pass by people walking on the sidewalks. Sometimes they're walking their grandkids or their dogs. For me to run on the sidewalks means to constantly go up and down to get around them not to mention it's the worse possible surface to run on. It's much easier for a golf cart to just pass me by. There's plenty of room and most of the time there are no other cars behind them for them to worry about.

[SouthOfTheBorder]

Originally Posted by DougB

GF?

Fixed it, supposed to have been GC.....my iPhone has a mind of it's own sometimes..

[sueandskip]

Originally Posted by George Bieniaszek

As in boating, a general rule of thumb is anything larger than you has the right of way!!!

Remember that the next time you pass a semi truck and hit the brakes ...