[EdFNJ]

RELAX! I am not filing a complaint (actually it was more convenient) but just wondering if this is "legal" S.O.P. by postal service employees.

I was sitting home all day (mostly because it was raining) waiting for an important and expensive "signature required" package via USPS. About 4PM I was notified that it was delivered and signed for and I immediately got very nervous since I didn't have it. Got a proof of delivery from USPS online and while I could barely read the scribble it turned out to be the mail employee at the mail center here and it was sitting in my mailbox with a key without any notice of it being there (usually tracking says "left in mailbox" or something like that this just said DELIVERED and SIGNED FOR).

While it actually was more convenient for me since I didn't have to go all the way down to the Lady Lake post office (18 mile RT) which is a pain in the azz to retrieve it I am wondering if that is supposed to happen. First time in 3 years it did. USUALLY a signature required package is physically delivered to my house by someone from our local postal station and if I am not home a slip is left to retrieve it in Lady Lake the following day.

On one hand I like the convenience but on the other it could create a problem under some circumstances. I can understand if I had left a signed signature release as with Fedex or UPS but I hadn't.


EDIT 11/10 9:30PM

This is what concerns me (from the USPS website). If someone from the PO local mail house accepts and signs for my package and puts the key for it in the wrong mailbox I'm SOL.

Recipient Responsibilities
When you sign for a piece of mail, you acknowledge delivery. The Postal Service’s liability ends when you sign for the mail. You may ask the letter carrier for the sender’s name and address before you accept the mail. You may not open the mail, but you may look at it as long as the letter carrier is holding it before you choose to sign for it.

[Bogie Shooter]

Originally Posted by EdFNJ

RELAX! I am not filing a complaint (actually it was more convenient) but just wondering if this is "legal" S.O.P. by postal service employees.

I was sitting home all day (mostly because it was raining) waiting for an important and expensive "signature required" package via USPS. About 4PM I was notified that it was delivered and signed for and I immediately got very nervous since I didn't have it. Got a proof of delivery from USPS online and while I could barely read the scribble it turned out to be the mail employee at the mail center here and it was sitting in my mailbox with a key without any notice of it being there (usually tracking says "left in mailbox" or something like that this just said DELIVERED and SIGNED FOR).

While it actually was more convenient for me since I didn't have to go all the way down to the Lady Lake post office (18 mile RT) which is a pain in the azz to retrieve it I am wondering if that is supposed to happen. First time in 3 years it did. USUALLY a signature required package is physically delivered to my house by someone from our local postal station and if I am not home a slip is left to retrieve it in Lady Lake the following day.

On one hand I like the convenience but on the other it could create a problem under some circumstances. I can understand if I had left a signed signature release as with Fedex or UPS but I hadn't.

I bet the Postmaster in Lady Lake could answer that question.

[Two Bills]

Since the Covid outbreak, all parcels in UK are signed for by the delivery agent.
Only delivery person allowed to touch the electronic signature machine.
Ring/knock on door, leave parcel on door step, or in safe place if notified before delivery.
Probably same in your case.

[retiredguy123]

In my experience, USPS, UPS, and FEDEX routinely ignore the signature requirement for almost all packages. I waited all day one time for a $1,200 computer to be delivered to my house by FEDEX because the tracking information said it required a signature. The guy left the computer on my front porch and didn't even ring the doorbell. USPS and UPS do the same thing. But, if it is in a locked mailbox, I don't see an issue with legality. It is still under the control of the Post Office.

[EdFNJ]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

In my experience, USPS, UPS, and FEDEX routinely ignore the signature requirement for almost all packages. I waited all day one time for a $1,200 computer to be delivered to my house by FEDEX because the tracking information said it required a signature. The guy left the computer on my front porch and didn't even ring the doorbell. USPS and UPS do the same thing. But, if it is in a locked mailbox, I don't see an issue with legality. It is still under the control of the Post Office.

Thanks ... that makes sense but ... it wasn't a computer but very similar. I have a RELEASE on file with FEDEX so in that case it would be my problem. UPS has never left a "sig required" package for me. I do agree it was safer and actually more convenient for me but just wondered about someone "signing" my name under their name. My FEAR was what if the package box key was put in the wrong box? Has happened before, it was NOT a sig required pkg but that time it was my neighbor who got it and gave it to me. The PO person had no clue as to what happened to it when I showed him/her the tracking. On THIS pkg I would have been responsible because it said signed and delivered. I would have been out over $1000 because there was no way to prove I did NOT get it.

[EdFNJ]

Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter

I bet the Postmaster in Lady Lake could answer that question.

Then I might have had to tell the PM exactly where this happened which might have got the person in big trouble IF it was not permitted which is why I put (IN BOLD) in my OP that I did NOT want to report it. But thanks for the helpful suggestion.

[blueash]

Originally Posted by EdFNJ

Then I might have had to tell the PM exactly where this happened which might have got the person in big trouble IF it was not permitted which is why I put (IN BOLD) in my OP that I did NOT want to report it. But thanks for the helpful suggestion.

You won't have to disclose anything. You can say you read a thread of TOTV and want to know the regulation. It does seem that a mailing requiring a signature should require yours.

From the USPS website Sending and Receiving Mail | Postal Explorer

Signing for Mail
Some pieces of mail require a signature from the recipient at the time of delivery. This includes items sent with Priority Mail Express (if requested), Certified Mail, Collect on Delivery, Insured Mail (over $500), Registered Mail, Return Receipt, Signature Confirmation, and Adult Signature.

[Dgizzi]

Originally Posted by EdFNJ

RELAX! I am not filing a complaint (actually it was more convenient) but just wondering if this is "legal" S.O.P. by postal service employees.

I was sitting home all day (mostly because it was raining) waiting for an important and expensive "signature required" package via USPS. About 4PM I was notified that it was delivered and signed for and I immediately got very nervous since I didn't have it. Got a proof of delivery from USPS online and while I could barely read the scribble it turned out to be the mail employee at the mail center here and it was sitting in my mailbox with a key without any notice of it being there (usually tracking says "left in mailbox" or something like that this just said DELIVERED and SIGNED FOR).

While it actually was more convenient for me since I didn't have to go all the way down to the Lady Lake post office (18 mile RT) which is a pain in the azz to retrieve it I am wondering if that is supposed to happen. First time in 3 years it did. USUALLY a signature required package is physically delivered to my house by someone from our local postal station and if I am not home a slip is left to retrieve it in Lady Lake the following day.

On one hand I like the convenience but on the other it could create a problem under some circumstances. I can understand if I had left a signed signature release as with Fedex or UPS but I hadn't.

That is no good. They should not be allowed to sign for your package. These people are worthless. Unreal. I can’t stand ordering online. Never had to do it so much until moving to Florida. I hate it and I try real hard not to order online. Now hearing this I will not order online. Makes me mad.

[Dgizzi]

Originally Posted by EdFNJ

Thanks ... that makes sense but ... it wasn't a computer but very similar. I have a RELEASE on file with FEDEX so in that case it would be my problem. UPS has never left a "sig required" package for me. I do agree it was safer and actually more convenient for me but just wondered about someone "signing" my name under their name. My FEAR was what if the package box key was put in the wrong box? Has happened before, it was NOT a sig required pkg but that time it was my neighbor who got it and gave it to me. The PO person had no clue as to what happened to it when I showed him/her the tracking. On THIS pkg I would have been responsible because it said signed and delivered. I would have been out over $1000 because there was no way to prove I did NOT get it.

Exactly. It was signed for and said received. If this mail person stoled it you have no way to prove you didn’t receive the package and can’t get a refund. That’s the problem people. These mail people can sign for anything. Surprise they don’t steal medicine that comes through the mail just to see what it is!!

[EdFNJ]

Originally Posted by blueash

You won't have to disclose anything. You can say you read a thread of TOTV and want to know the regulation. It does seem that a mailing requiring a signature should require yours.

From the USPS website Sending and Receiving Mail | Postal Explorer

Next time I am at the Lady Lake P.O. (which I hope is 2 days after never) I will ask. They have never answered their phone in the past, as the call would roll over to a central call center somewhere in the world last time I called. I did email the USPS from their website to ask. LOGICALLY I would agree with your conclusion but who knows these days.

The highlighted part was my concern:

Recipient Responsibilities

When you sign for a piece of mail, you acknowledge delivery. The Postal Service’s liability ends when you sign for the mail. You may ask the letter carrier for the sender’s name and address before you accept the mail. You may not open the mail, but you may look at it as long as the letter carrier is holding it before you choose to sign for it.

[retiredguy123]

I'm not sure I understand the issue here. If the package was delivered to the postal station in The Villages and placed in a locked mailbox where the only person with access to the key is the recipient, the only thing missing was that the local postal contractor did not actually require the recipient to sign for the package. But, technically, the employee who signed for the package at the Lady Lake office was only signing as an "in transit" signature. There may have been other employees who also signed for it along the delivery route. The people who work at the local postal station are employed by the Government, and they represent the Federal Government Post Office. So, the package was still in possession by the Government until the final recipient took it out of the locked box. Note that, if the package was too large to fit in the locked box, the postal employee may have delivered it to the recipient's house and required a signature there. But, I think the USPS feels that a signature is not required when it is removed from a locked box where the only person with a key is the final recipient.

[Two Bills]

Originally Posted by Dgizzi

Exactly. It was signed for and said received. If this mail person stoled it you have no way to prove you didn’t receive the package and can’t get a refund. That’s the problem people. These mail people can sign for anything. Surprise they don’t steal medicine that comes through the mail just to see what it is!!

Originally Posted by Dgizzi

That is no good. They should not be allowed to sign for your package. These people are worthless. Unreal. I can’t stand ordering online. Never had to do it so much until moving to Florida. I hate it and I try real hard not to order online. Now hearing this I will not order online. Makes me mad.

Your comments about hard working service people says more about you than them!

[oneclickplus]

Originally Posted by Dgizzi

That is no good. They should not be allowed to sign for your package. These people are worthless. Unreal. I can’t stand ordering online. Never had to do it so much until moving to Florida. I hate it and I try real hard not to order online. Now hearing this I will not order online. Makes me mad.

And, let me add that this could result in legal problems if the parcel is actually certified mail involving legal documents. The recipient has the RIGHT to refuse certified mail. Someone else signing for it creates a legal mess.

[oneclickplus]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

I'm not sure I understand the issue here. If the package was delivered to the postal station in The Villages and placed in a locked mailbox where the only person with access to the key is the recipient, the only thing missing was that the local postal contractor did not actually require the recipient to sign for the package. But, technically, the employee who signed for the package at the Lady Lake office was only signing as an "in transit" signature. There may have been other employees who also signed for it along the delivery route. The people who work at the local postal station are employed by the Government, and they represent the Federal Government Post Office. So, the package was still in possession by the Government until the final recipient took it out of the locked box. Note that, if the package was too large to fit in the locked box, the postal employee may have delivered it to the recipient's house and required a signature there. But, I think the USPS feels that a signature is not required when it is removed from a locked box where the only person with a key is the final recipient.

The USPS has no right to "feel" a signature is not required by the recipient. The recipient's signature is being required by the sender who paid an additional fee for that service. What if this is a certified package containing legal documents. A person can be legally "served" in a lawsuit by the use of certified mail signature required. No one other than the recipient has the right to sign for that legal document. Putting it in a locked box and providing the key does not address this. The boxes can be opened by anyone in a family for example. This does not prove the recipient received the legal documents.

[Girlcopper]

Originally Posted by EdFNJ

RELAX! I am not filing a complaint (actually it was more convenient) but just wondering if this is "legal" S.O.P. by postal service employees.

I was sitting home all day (mostly because it was raining) waiting for an important and expensive "signature required" package via USPS. About 4PM I was notified that it was delivered and signed for and I immediately got very nervous since I didn't have it. Got a proof of delivery from USPS online and while I could barely read the scribble it turned out to be the mail employee at the mail center here and it was sitting in my mailbox with a key without any notice of it being there (usually tracking says "left in mailbox" or something like that this just said DELIVERED and SIGNED FOR).

While it actually was more convenient for me since I didn't have to go all the way down to the Lady Lake post office (18 mile RT) which is a pain in the azz to retrieve it I am wondering if that is supposed to happen. First time in 3 years it did. USUALLY a signature required package is physically delivered to my house by someone from our local postal station and if I am not home a slip is left to retrieve it in Lady Lake the following day.

On one hand I like the convenience but on the other it could create a problem under some circumstances. I can understand if I had left a signed signature release as with Fedex or UPS but I hadn't.


EDIT 11/10 9:30PM

This is what concerns me (from the USPS website). If someone from the PO local mail house accepts and signs for my package and puts the key for it in the wrong mailbox I'm SOL.

Recipient Responsibilities
When you sign for a piece of mail, you acknowledge delivery. The Postal Service’s liability ends when you sign for the mail. You may ask the letter carrier for the sender’s name and address before you accept the mail. You may not open the mail, but you may look at it as long as the letter carrier is holding it before you choose to sign for it.

How about you goo the source, the post office and ask