[NJblue]

This post is meant to be informative for those considering buying in TV as well as a solicitation for advice from those who may have experienced a similar buying experience in TV.

We just returned from a Lifestyle Preview visit. We saw and experienced enough to know that we will want to move to TV - friendly people and lots of activities. We also spent a LOT of time looking at real estate - including existing news homes ready to sell, pre-ownd homes and lots that are available for building a home on using the Personalization Package that TV now offers. After doing a lot of looking we decided that building on a lot was the right thing for us. We found a great lot at what I think was a very reasonable price relative to neighboring lots. So far so good. However the process of closing on this deal seems to have been an ever-escalating level of pressure imposed by TV sales policy. Here's the process:

1) Find a lot that will accept the model of house that you want, including expansions.

2) Tell the sales agent that you want the lot; he/she can then put a hold on it for you for 3 hours. At the end of three hours, to continue to hold it you must put down a $2,500 non-refundable deposit. Pressure Point One In our case, our home state law (which apparently also governs real estate deals in Florida) dictates that any transaction such as this requires that the builder honors a 7-day period to allow consulting with attorneys or just re-think your decision. Kudos to New Jersey! Note that at this point you don't yet know the final price of the home! All we knew was the price of the lot premium and the agent's best guess as to what the final price of the house would be based on mental additions/subtractions of assumed prices for features of existing new house ready for sale.

3) Sign a whole bunch of documents (which our agent said did not remove the 7-day protection offered by NJ law).

3) Meet with the agent to pick packages (interior, exterior, extensions, and a few minor additional options such as Roman shower or regular shower.) The packages provide zero options for modification. If you want the model with maple cabinets, then you had better like the type and color of counter tops, flooring, light fixtures, color of walls, etc. Same with the exterior - if you want a particular color, then you better also like the front door, roof and exterior light fixtures that come with that color. While I wish we had some more options, I can see that doing it this way is easier from a sales complexity, pricing and building perspective. Plus the choices are created by a professional designer - for whatever that is worth to you. I just wished that since they had simplified the feature selection process that they would also have provided at least ballpark estimates for the prices for these packages - it would have made the decison and sales process far more simple.

4) Agent submits all choices to the design team who create a firm price quote. This presumably takes 1 to 2 days. Note, in step 2, if you do not come from a state that provides a 7-day contemplation/study period and if you feel uncomfortable putting up a $2,500 non-refundable deposit on something that you do not yet know the price, you can skip the deposit but have to accept the fact that a) someone can come in a scoop the property out from under you and b) our agent said that requests for quotes that do not have deposits will be treated with lowest priority and may take up to 5 days. Pressure Point Two In our case the quote came back by 2:00 PM after being submitted at 8:00 AM. Also, to our agent's credit, the quote came in right in the middle of his estimate - even after we added a few things that the house that we were using as our "base" from which we were creating our home did not have. This price quote is good for 7 days, after which it must be re-calculated based on any price changes in materials, etc. At the end of the 7 days you must send them a check for 20 percent of the final costs and also have a signed contract.

5) If the price is too high (or low enough such that you might want to add additional features), you must resubmit your feature request and go back into the queue to be processed all over again. Meanwhile the original quote becomes null and void. If the second quote is not to your liking and you want to go back to your first quote, you must resubmit once again and hope (and have a bit of faith) that they come up with the same price that they originally did. Meanwhile, the clock is ticking on your 7-day period to get your deposit back. Pressure Point Three.

6) After getting a quote on a house that you want, you sign more papers confirming that the house that was quoted is the house that you want to have the contract built around. At this time our agent casually mentioned to us that we were lucky that we acted when we did because 10 minutes after we put a hold on the lot, someone else tried to buy it. Possible Pressure Point Four This is then turned over to the contract team who generate a final contract which also includes a non-negotiable closing date. This is the point at which we currently are at and from here on the steps are as I understand based on what our agent told us.

7) Once you have the contract you have 24 hours to sign and get it back to them. Failure to do so within that time period will make the price quote null and void and you must start all over again at step 4. Note that the original 7 day lock on the price as indicated in step 4 appears to be superseded by this requirement - that is, by getting to contract stage early, you have less time to think about it. Pressure Point Five This is the part that I have major problems with. If they were willing to lock in the price for 7 days before generating the contract, why do they then drop that to only 24 hours once the contract is generated? This doesn't make sense to me - other than forcing a final decision earlier.

So, this is the process that we experienced. Hopefully anyone else reading this and thinking of going this route will be better informed concerning what to expect. I would also like to hear from anyone in terms of having similar experiences and if they found ways to have TV be more flexible in their sales/contract approach.

[shighsmi]

You were lucky that you were able to pick some things. When we purchased in Oct. 2007, we had to find the house that had everything in it we wanted. However at no time did we feel pressured. Our sales rep was great and I would recomend her to everyone. Kay Salerno.

[nanci2539]

NJBlue; pretty much on target as we went through the same process.

The $2,500 depsoit was non-refundable if you changed your mind and decided not to puchase but the money would follow you if you changed your mind on the lot.

And the 20% deposit would have followed us if we changed our mind on the home style.

This was according to our rep. So there was a bit of flexibility.

[villages07]

NJ,

First, congrats on selecting TV and deciding on the Villages version of (limited) build-to-suit. When all is said and done, you will be very happy with what you have decided. The journey isn't always that much fun but the destination is well worth it.

Disclaimer: I bought new in July 06 (probably the final peak of the market) when you had to select from pre-built homes - no other options. And, we also had the infamous 3 hour hold window or the house goes back on the market (good thing we locked in...people were still looking at the house the next day). So, times have changed.

The Villages is all about selling houses. Buyers have to be ready to make a decision or risk losing out on their initial choice (but, there are usually many other choices available to you). They won't risk taking a property/lot off the market while someone is thinking about it for days.

I'm sure it all felt very rushed and somewhat pressured... a big decision like building your retirement home seems like it should be more carefully studied and considered. But, that's the Villages way. On the upside, and there are many, they have the home building process down to a science and you will be amazed at how fast it is built. I was taking pictures for a remotely-located fellow TOTV-er and it was 45 days from first pic to DONE.

Thank you for sharing your build to buy experience...I found it very informative.

[graciegirl]

I don't look at it as pressure at all. It makes me upset to have anyone reading this topic think that sales reps at The Villages pressure anyone. The opposite is true.

What it appears to be to me, is the difference between the "rules" in your state of New Jersey and the processes in The Villages and somethings in the state of Florida, such as the walk through is held after you buy.

If you didn't want to do it then, you could have chosen not to put the down payment down, and like the rest of us continue to look for awhile. That was not to pressure you. That is just how they do business. They don't EVER try to talk you into it.

But, since you have bought now, I welcome you to the happiest place you can imagine. I think that it is always stressful to buy a house. I had a terrible case of buyers remorse for three days after we made our decision and even walked away from the table when we were going to give our deposit.

I am so happy with buying our home in Hadley now. We did NOT have any options just two months ago. I know the options are limited, but you do have some choices not open to us.

Again. You won't be sorry.

Welcome, Welcome

[l2ridehd]

For all these reason, I believe resale/preowned is the best way to go. Many things already done, and you see the final product before making a commitment. Two major concerns with buying new. If you are still a snowbird, you are not living there enough to determine what things might need attention under warrenty and also there to get them done. The pine straw they put down withy the new landscaping is always full of bugs. If your not there to get the landscaping redone, you are at risk.

In a used home you will find many things from blinds, curtains, solar tubes, solar fans, better ceiling fans, upgraded landscaping, bird cages, extra towel bars, more tile, and more that the current owners have done. The house has been lived in a few years so any problems have been identified and resolved. and the bond is significantly less. Pick something built around 2005 and you get your best overall value.

[Shirleevee]

I2rdhd,


We bought a 2006 home and are very happy. Of course some things will be changed but we can do that at our leisure. It was a stress-free transaction.

Shirleevee

[golfpro]

NJBlue -- I'm curious to know where you were looking in TV. We also did the lifestyle just recently and I could almost repeat your list of concerns. We really wanted new in TV since we could not get everything in terms of lot or home/options to come together. We understand the pros and cons of new/used; however, as I said, we wanted new to get what we wanted so we wouldn't be bothering with the, I wish it had this or that later and having to spend our time in construction, etc.

We ended up walking away and finding what we wanted on both coasts fortunately for us. Now it's over and we can concentrate on enjoying retirement together.

Congratulations to you on being able to resolve your issues. Enjoy TV.

[NJblue]

graciegirl,

Thank you for the big welcome! I'm sure that you are typical of all the warm, friendly people that we met while on the Lifestyle Preview. I was amazed that as we were out looking at houses or lots that people would stop their golf carts or cars and talk to us and encourage us to buy in TV and in their neighborhood. It really helped ease any concern that we might have had about how well we would be accepted.

Perhaps I should have been more explicit in my listing of the "pressure points" that I felt in the process of buying a lot and house. In most cases, I didn't mean to imply that the agent was pressuring us. However, the policies as dictated by The Villages, could be interpreted as being one-sided with the effect being one of creating a feeling of pressure. Can you imagine going into a car dealership and being told that the car that you want will probably cost somewhere between $30,000 and $35,000 but to find the exact price you need to give them a check for $500 which is non-refundable? While policies such as this appear to be legal and may even make good business sense, I didn't drink enough of the water while I was down there to think that this is a customer-friendly approach to buying a house.

We are now trying to come to grips with whether we want to overlook the hard-nosed nature of their marketing policies and focus on all the positives that TV offers - including a whole lot of friendly, happy people. (Note: I am not inferring that the sales agents are hard-nosed ... just the policies that they are required to implement.)

[poromo]

NJ Blue,
Congratulations!
The Villages policy is that the price of already built new homes is not negotiable. Did the same hold true for the price of a lot? Or were they negotiable on the price of the house to be built on the lot?

[NJblue]

The bottom line is that nothing is negotiable. The good thing on lot selection, however, is that you know the exact price for the lot premium - unlike the various packages for the houses where you have absolutely no clue regarding what one will cost versus another. While I think this process could be improved, I am very grateful that it exists and that we do actually have some flexibility in terms of what we buy and where it is built. TV is on the right track with this. I just wish that they would go the next step and become a bit more transparent in their pricing of the packages as well as a bit more flexible in their quoting and contract procedures.

[KayakerNC]

Originally Posted by NJblue

Can you imagine going into a car dealership and being told that the car that you want will probably cost somewhere between $30,000 and $35,000 but to find the exact price you need to give them a check for $500 which is non-refundable?

A lot of people are going through exactly that scenario, buying fuel efficient cars (Honda Fit, Toyota Prius, etc) due to the influence of rising gas prices.

[efrahin]

There is a lot of pressure, no questions about. On my first visit to TV we went from Daleland to TV on an afternoon. The salesman was pushy and a half. We saw a beautiful Gardenia in a corner and fall in love with it, he gave me the price and told me about the 2hours. When we where looking outside he made a phone call and told us that it was sold in the last 5 minutes (I believe it like I believe in Santa-Claus), then he showed us a much more expensive). and others; but my stomach was already sick of this person. Months later I went for the 5 days tour an it was nicer (I requested a new salesmen) I did not buy because I have to sell in NY first, but I wanted to be sure that TV is where I want to go, and I did. I love the place.
Last December we rented a home for a month and spent a terific vacation, with alll the activities on that month. My new salesman was very cooperative and nice and we fall in love with the house we wanted, he tried the best to get me commited, but as I said I will not do crazy things, A few months later the house was not in the market, I inquired and was told it has been sold. OK, I said, I lost it. A week later I received a call that it was in the market again. I am getting closer, i have two very good prospects for my house, when I inquired again, was sold, The next day was available. I dont know what to think about it, but one thing is true: I will not buy until my house is sold or at leas on contract. All this mean that the house has been in the market at least since last December.

[Sidney Lanier]

We are in total agreement with 12ridehd in terms of buying a resale. We came to TV knowing that we wanted to do that for, among other reasons, those cited in 12's posting: You see exactly what you're getting. Besides, I had once before built a house and had said 'never again!' We were fortunate in that, even though the house we bought had been listed by TV Resale Dept, we saw it privately and the sellers were able to end their listing with a phone call. It had been built in spring 2004; we saw and bought it in fall 2007. Before we began negotiating on a final price, the sellers immediately deducted what would have been the 6% brokerage fee, and then we negotiated from that point. In addition, the house came with wonderful optional landscaping, a costly water purification/softening system, a screened (and furnished) front porch, lots of options that we didn't even realize were options, and the bond had been paid when the sellers had bought new. We ended up with a Designer home that cost barely more than the Patio Villas we had been looking at. No complaints about a resale!

[Irish Rover]

NJBLUE you are correct about pressure and I believe that everyone who has bought from TV would admit feeling some kind of pressure during the negotiations. I don't care how good your sales rep is, there is pressure - subliminal or otherwise. TV's sales pitch veils all outward signs of pressure, but if having to make a decision in three hours isn't pressure especially when you are talking about a future home - then I don't understand pressure. Good luck and by the way, GO BUCKEYES.