TV and recent IRS Ruling TV and recent IRS Ruling - Page 2 - Talk of The Villages Florida

TV and recent IRS Ruling

Closed Thread
Thread Tools
  #16  
Old 09-09-2013, 08:30 PM
Teeitup's Avatar
Teeitup Teeitup is offline
Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 26
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mickey100 View Post
There is no doubt in my mind there would be a class action lawsuit, and rightly deserved.
I agree.

While I applaud the developers brilliant business acumen, does anyone really think that hand picking the same folks who determine the value of what you're selling them is what the law envisioned?

I personally find it hard to believe that he didn't know that he was outside the intent of the law, but I think he figured he had enough friends in high places to protect him.

And it very well may turn out to be true, of which his brilliant (but sometimes shady) legacy will just grow.
  #17  
Old 09-09-2013, 08:39 PM
Challenger's Avatar
Challenger Challenger is offline
Soaring Eagle member
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,283
Thanks: 56
Thanked 377 Times in 168 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Kris View Post
Here is an apparent quote from a knowledgeable source. You can decide which option you think is the most likely.

"I’m concerned that the IRS appears to be making new law through an enforcement process” … “options include getting the IRS to change the decision or asking bondholders to pay the taxes” … “Village Center Community Development District could try to settle the case but that could result in an expense that may ultimately be paid by area residents.”
-Perry Israel (Bond attorney representing the district)
apparent quote from a knowledgeable source-hmmmm. Maybe from Chicken Little?
__________________
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing" Edmund Burke 1729-1797
  #18  
Old 09-28-2013, 08:16 AM
Advogado Advogado is offline
Gold member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,032
Thanks: 62
Thanked 685 Times in 229 Posts
Default

An interesting update in the Bondbuyer; Bond Buyer Online - Incoming NABL President Details Group s Agenda

The Center Districts/Developer are getting some political support in their defense of the tax-exempt status of the bonds, but the IRS apparently is showing no signs of relenting-- at least not publicly.
  #19  
Old 09-28-2013, 09:01 AM
tommy steam tommy steam is offline
Gold member
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: New York, Georgia , Arizona, Vietnam 66 67
Posts: 1,358
Thanks: 0
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
Default

I'm thinking that this is so complicated that it's going to take years before this is settled one way or another. So for right now,I am going to enjoy what I have right now . There is a lot to be said about this place some bad and a lot of good. Ill just enjoy all the good.
  #20  
Old 09-28-2013, 09:06 PM
Bill32's Avatar
Bill32 Bill32 is offline
Veteran member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 875
Thanks: 59
Thanked 150 Times in 79 Posts
Default

When did this issue arise??
  #21  
Old 09-29-2013, 07:31 AM
janmcn janmcn is offline
Sage
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 5,298
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill32 View Post
When did this issue arise??

The IRS investigation began in January 2008.
  #22  
Old 09-30-2013, 07:53 AM
mickey100 mickey100 is offline
Soaring Eagle member
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,022
Thanks: 331
Thanked 333 Times in 107 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Teeitup View Post
I agree.

While I applaud the developers brilliant business acumen, does anyone really think that hand picking the same folks who determine the value of what you're selling them is what the law envisioned?

I personally find it hard to believe that he didn't know that he was outside the intent of the law, but I think he figured he had enough friends in high places to protect him.

And it very well may turn out to be true, of which his brilliant (but sometimes shady) legacy will just grow.
That has always been my opinion - it seemed pretty obvious what the intent of the law was, and an entity totally controlled by the developer is certainly not a legitimate "political subdivision" for purposes of the tax code.
  #23  
Old 09-30-2013, 08:01 AM
graciegirl's Avatar
graciegirl graciegirl is offline
Sage
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 40,170
Thanks: 5,009
Thanked 5,784 Times in 2,004 Posts
Send a message via AIM to graciegirl
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mickey100 View Post
That has always been my opinion - it seemed pretty obvious what the intent of the law was, and an entity totally controlled by the developer is certainly not a legitimate "political subdivision" for purposes of the tax code.
I get so upset when this sort of slam occurs.

Some people do not like big business. Period. Amen.

And which side of the aisle that folks sit on politically color their opinions about the Morses too. We know to whom he donates money. For some it is the wrong whom.
__________________
It is better to laugh than to cry.
  #24  
Old 09-30-2013, 08:13 AM
TVMayor's Avatar
TVMayor TVMayor is offline
Veteran member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Village Rio Grande
Posts: 697
Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by graciegirl View Post
I get so upset when this sort of slam occurs.

Some people do not like big business. Period. Amen.

And which side of the aisle that folks sit on politically color their opinions about the Morses too. We know to whom he donates money. For some it is the wrong whom.
What if the IRS had a uniform tax code and applied it evenly? Would TV be involved in a case with the IRS?
__________________
MI, Pontiac, Waterford, Southfield, Farmington, FL.--> Ron's my name and pool's my game.
  #25  
Old 09-30-2013, 08:17 AM
graciegirl's Avatar
graciegirl graciegirl is offline
Sage
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 40,170
Thanks: 5,009
Thanked 5,784 Times in 2,004 Posts
Send a message via AIM to graciegirl
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TVMayor View Post
What if the IRS had a uniform tax code and applied it evenly? Would TV be involved in a case with the IRS?

Yes indeed. What if? Seems like some recent snafu casts doubt on that.

But what the IRS is investigating in this case is whether our CDD here in The Villages can issue tax exempt municipal bonds.

This is a tax issue and not one of wrong doing.
__________________
It is better to laugh than to cry.
  #26  
Old 09-30-2013, 08:42 AM
TVMayor's Avatar
TVMayor TVMayor is offline
Veteran member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Village Rio Grande
Posts: 697
Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by graciegirl View Post
Yes indeed. What if? Seems like some recent snafu casts doubt on that.

But what the IRS is investigating in this case is whether our CDD here in The Villages can issue tax exempt municipal bonds.

This is a tax issue and not one of wrong doing.
It sounds like you are saying tax issue violations do not fall in the category of wrong doing. Al Capone, Wesley Snipes, Willie Nelson found out that was not the case.

I could be my interpretation of the term “wrong doing” is different than yours.

As of today the IRS has not made a finial ruling on any wrong doing, so maybe it will become a nonissue.
__________________
MI, Pontiac, Waterford, Southfield, Farmington, FL.--> Ron's my name and pool's my game.
  #27  
Old 09-30-2013, 09:25 AM
graciegirl's Avatar
graciegirl graciegirl is offline
Sage
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 40,170
Thanks: 5,009
Thanked 5,784 Times in 2,004 Posts
Send a message via AIM to graciegirl
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TVMayor View Post
It sounds like you are saying tax issue violations do not fall in the category of wrong doing. Al Capone, Wesley Snipes, Willie Nelson found out that was not the case.

I could be my interpretation of the term “wrong doing” is different than yours.

As of today the IRS has not made a finial ruling on any wrong doing, so maybe it will become a nonissue.

Those folks didn't pay their income taxes.

The IRS is investigating and will rule on whether municipal bonds on this form of government are tax exempt.

They have been investigating as Janmcn says, since 2008.

One way or another. If this is an issue, sell and move, or don't move here if you don't live here or if you are another developer, wait and see. The thing about anonymity on this forum is that no one really knows who you are or what you stand for.

I am frequently accused of being a "shill" for the developer. I am not. I am a 73, almost 74 year old woman who never dreamed to have such fun at this time of my life. Or ever thought to live in Florida. I very sincerely love this place and think it is so well run.
__________________
It is better to laugh than to cry.
  #28  
Old 09-30-2013, 10:37 AM
njbchbum's Avatar
njbchbum njbchbum is offline
Sage
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Summer at the Jersey Shore, Fall in New England [Maine], Winter in TV!
Posts: 5,631
Thanks: 3,060
Thanked 755 Times in 257 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by graciegirl View Post
snipped
I am a 73, almost 74 year old woman who never dreamed to have such fun at this time of my life. Or ever thought to live in Florida. I very sincerely love this place and think it is so well run.
nicely pointed out, gracie! I, too, never thought I would be enjoying life as I do these days! and come the day that I can no longer enjoy the villages for whatever reason - I will be pleased to pick up my belongings and sell the house to the next person seeking to enjoy life as they see fit to do - and will hope that they find the same enjoyment that we have!
__________________
Not sure if I have free time...or if I just forgot everything I was supposed to do!

  #29  
Old 09-30-2013, 10:46 AM
Bizdoc Bizdoc is offline
Veteran member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Village of Fernandina
Posts: 805
Thanks: 2
Thanked 23 Times in 3 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TVMayor View Post
It sounds like you are saying tax issue violations do not fall in the category of wrong doing. Al Capone, Wesley Snipes, Willie Nelson found out that was not the case.

I could be my interpretation of the term “wrong doing” is different than yours.

As of today the IRS has not made a finial ruling on any wrong doing, so maybe it will become a nonissue.
You should note that (at least up until now), the part of the IRS involved in this has been Tax Exemption/Government Entities division. Any penalties are administrative, just as being audited or owing money after an audit. And just as owing money (and penalties) after an audit has an appeals process, the Tax Code provides due process and appeals (all the way to the Supreme Court).

If it were criminal, Criminal Investigation would be handling it. Trust me, there is a major difference. You don't want to deal with CI... (as Al Capone and Wesley Snipes learned.). Really good people work for CI, but they don't have a sense of humor when it comes to criminal wrongdoing. That's why they (and not the FBI) got Al Capone.
  #30  
Old 09-30-2013, 10:51 AM
TVMayor's Avatar
TVMayor TVMayor is offline
Veteran member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Village Rio Grande
Posts: 697
Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by graciegirl View Post
Those folks didn't pay their income taxes.

The IRS is investigating and will rule on whether municipal bonds on this form of government are tax exempt.

They have been investigating as Janmcn says, since 2008.

One way or another. If this is an issue, sell and move, or don't move here if you don't live here or if you are another developer, wait and see. The thing about anonymity on this forum is that no one really knows who you are or what you stand for.

I am frequently accused of being a "shill" for the developer. I am not. I am a 73, almost 74 year old woman who never dreamed to have such fun at this time of my life. Or ever thought to live in Florida. I very sincerely love this place and think it is so well run.
Folks not paying taxes and folks not paying taxes on tax free bonds that should not have been issued both equate to a less revenue collected by the IRS.

The thing about anonymity, if I told you my name was Buck Nacid would you know what I stand for. Would it help if I told you I have 3 computers? I think not.
The Villages Florida
__________________
MI, Pontiac, Waterford, Southfield, Farmington, FL.--> Ron's my name and pool's my game.
Closed Thread


You are viewing a new design of the TOTV site. Click here to revert to the old version.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:12 AM.