What's the Difference Between POA & VHA?

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  #31  
Old 02-21-2015, 11:39 PM
Advogado Advogado is offline
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Originally Posted by Mleeja View Post
I agree with what you are saying. However, some of the posters on this topic have a particularly sharp ax to grind against the VHA. If i was a potential buyer reading these post would make me have second thoughts!

People come on here an make blanket statements like it is the gospal. Do that, and I am going to call you out. Make a good argument supported by verifiable facts!
If you are going to "call out" other posters, could you please do it with facts and not personal attacks and the suggestion that people who disagree with you ought to move out of The Villages. I don't think that you are changing many minds with that approach.

The fact is that the posters whom you are "calling out" have a real problem with a self-proclaimed homeowners' association (the "VHA") which does not represent the homeowners. And I think we have been presenting the "facts" you ask for. Have you been doing so or merely making ad hominem arguments?
  #32  
Old 02-22-2015, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Mleeja View Post
You are going to take this in a different direction.... This discussion is about the VHA vs POA. Discusding the ACC is a whole other topic...
They control the purse strings on the class action settlement.
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  #33  
Old 02-22-2015, 10:04 AM
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You all that have been posting in support of the POA vs the VHA have been very supportive (and caustic) and I seriously doubt that what I am posting will change your minds, and quite frankly I would not expect otherwise. I made the statement that some of the posting may not contain 100% accurate information and I have been called out for that. Rightly so. If I am calling out folks for not posting accurate information, I should do the same. I have went back through this post for review.

These are all opinions, not statements of fact.

The VHA represents the interests of the Developer.

what is the difference between the POA and the VHA? The former was organized to work with the Developer by presenting factual information that may or may not have been pleasing but was well factual. The latter organization was formed to present the Developer with not only favorable information but information that discredited the POA's position. The former organization was formed to support the residents while the latter organization was formed to experience that kumbaya moment

I find the very existence of the VHA, a front organization established and subsidized by the Developer (via free delivery of its newsletter with the Daily Sun) in an effort to weaken the POA, offensive to the residents of The Villages. I cannot imagine that there is any other housing development in the country with two competing homeowners' associations like ours. Most importantly, we certainly cannot count on the VHA to protect our interests in any situation where they do not coincide with those of the Developer.

The fact is that the posters whom you are "calling out" have a real problem with a self-proclaimed homeowners' association (the "VHA") which does not represent the homeowners

There is nothing that supports any of these statements. If you review the actions taken by the VHA, they have been supportive of the residents and the community. Take the time to review their website. Do their activities support the developer? I am sure in some cases they do. Are there not times were the interest of the POA and the developer are the same? Is working to improve the community a bad thing?

This posting is full of miss-information:

In about 2000 the POA won a significant law suit ($40M) against the Developer because of lack of saving some of the profits that were received to protect the Orange Blosom Rec, Center etc.. When there was a refusal to correct the condition, (e.g.allegedly rats in the ceiling, etc.) the POA sued the Developer and won the $40 Million. In addition some of Board Members of the POA were rewarded by the court for their sacrifice of putting their own personal monies up to protect the residents. It was recognized they risked their own money to support the residents. None of them could change their life style for the amount they received from the court. The Developer allegedly was angry that the POA was awarded a win and there was a pledge to set up the VHA and the Developer would use it as a counter to the POA. This goes on as of today. It should be noted that the residents continue to receive benifits from the POA actions. Some of the carts paths improvements etc are from that $40M. I believe some of the $40M is still available to help the residents. Given these are a true representation of why the POA / VHA exist today it can be concluded that it is reasonable that the VHA supports the Developer and the POA represents the residents. Anything else is smoke to protect one or the other organization. Why POA Member meetings open to all while to VHA only open to members. It important to let the sunshine in.

1. The law suit was settled in 2008. As part of the settlement the developer agreed to pay approximately $40 million over a 13 year period. See poa4us.org Class Action Lawsuit So the money is still being paid. In my book a settlement is not a win. Both parties came to an agreement.
2. As part of the settlement, the attorney fees were paid by the developer. Plus the five residents who were the named plaintiffs received $300,000. See poa4us.org Class Action Lawsuit This works out to be $60,000 each. I guess it is in the eye of the reader if $60,000 could change your lifestyle.
3. As part of this settlement, the Amenity Authority Committee was created, not the Villages Home Owners Association. See poa4us.org Class Action Lawsuit
4. The VHA was created in 1990. See thevha.net.
5. The VHA meetings are open to all members and residents. See thevha.net. One would think, for an organizations such as this to continue to grow, the meetings would need to be open to all. Maybe only members can vote for the officers. I would suspect the POA is the same.

I think to conclude, it is up to each of us to think about what we post on this or any other site. We are all passionate about our beliefs and positions. When you do you postings follow the rule of engaging your brain before your fingers. Think about what you are saying and if it can be supported.

Ok haters, hate....

Last edited by Mleeja; 02-22-2015 at 01:46 PM. Reason: Typo correction
  #34  
Old 02-22-2015, 10:12 AM
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1. The Developer is not out to get us or cheat us. That makes no sense. If they were then that would inhibit marketing this community and drive away their livelihood.

2. Not everything done by the Developer may be completely in the best interest of all the residents. The Developer is in business to make money, and that money comes from us. They create things and sell them for a profit and they cut expenses whenever and wherever they can. That's business.

3. The ACC and VCDD's are our elected, and sometimes appointed, form of government, charged with making decisions for us all, as in any other form of republicanism.

Therefore:

A. Both the VHA and the POA serve a worthwhile purpose and we should all join both. Let's not try to turn them into political parties.

B. If you don't like what our local government is doing, then tell them, or better yet seek an appointment or run for one of the positions.
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  #35  
Old 02-22-2015, 10:59 AM
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Lightbulb Simple Question

If you had a problem would you go to the VHA for help or the POA? If the problem did not favor a solution for the Developer would you go to the VHA or the POA? If you wanted an issue investigated and the results published to the residents would you go to the POA or the VHA? If you wanted a particular issues not favorable to the Developer investigated would you go to The Village management or the President/Board Member of the POA? (Note: Almost all key decision members of The Village Management are there at the descretion of the Developer)? We all love The Villages and we all appreciate the hard work and efforts of the Developer and the family BUT it is not unrealistic to recognize that when issues arise that impact the Developers business case there is a need for an independent view that balances the Developer's business case vs the residents so that fairness rules. That is where the POA comes in !! To deny this fact is for one to give up their right to representations. Just as an aside: The court ruled in favor of the POA not because the Court favored the POA but because something was wrong with what the Developer was doing.
  #36  
Old 02-22-2015, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Cedwards38 View Post
1. The Developer is not out to get us or cheat us. That makes no sense. If they were then that would inhibit marketing this community and drive away their livelihood.

2. Not everything done by the Developer may be completely in the best interest of all the residents. The Developer is in business to make money, and that money comes from us. They create things and sell them for a profit and they cut expenses whenever and wherever they can. That's business.

3. The ACC and VCDD's are our elected, and sometimes appointed, form of government, charged with making decisions for us all, as in any other form of republicanism.

Therefore:

A. Both the VHA and the POA serve a worthwhile purpose and we should all join both. Let's not try to turn them into political parties.

B. If you don't like what our local government is doing, then tell them, or better yet seek an appointment or run for one of the positions.
  #37  
Old 02-22-2015, 11:24 AM
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Lightbulb How Sad

How sad it is that some would give up a check and balance system for a single conrol by a Developer. Even our forefathers saw this as a terrible system of Government. To demonstrate the potential power of this system are the responses to the current system and how informative of the details in realtime. To illustrate there was a quick note, in exact detail defining all the dates and times of what was an example of concerns. For the sake of argument. Lets assume the POA is really a check and balance organization? As a nation we have 3 checks and balances (Congress, President,Supreme Court). Why in heck would anyone not want a check and balance? You have to ask what motivates someone wanting a single form or Government without a check and balance. It does not make sense UNLESS.
  #38  
Old 02-22-2015, 11:37 AM
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This settlement was reached in 2008, the same year the IRS began its investigation of the tax-free bonds. Does anyone think this is just coincidence, or was the developer trying to get this resolved and not draw attention to the use of tax-free bonds?

BTW: the developer had made a one billion dollar profit selling the amenities north of 466 to himself at highly inflated prices, using the tax-free bonds to finance them, so $40 million would be chump change to him.
  #39  
Old 02-22-2015, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter View Post
They control the purse strings on the class action settlement.
Yes, I agree with you 100%. I get the impession not all is aware of this!
  #40  
Old 02-22-2015, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Diva Kay View Post
Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion....I have voiced mine....and you and all others have voiced theirs. That is what freedom of speech is all about. I not only have been a Villager almost two years, but am proud to say I am the VHA VP of the Southern Region (all Villages south of 466A). So I would say my freedom of speech opinion comes very highly regarded.
Diva Kay: Well then your username is very befitting. God bless
  #41  
Old 02-22-2015, 02:07 PM
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Question What?

Not yet 2 years and speaks of history and living in The Villages. Not even wet under the ears! A rep for the VHA? Unbelievable..
  #42  
Old 02-22-2015, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Cedwards38 View Post

3. The ACC and VCDD's are our elected, and sometimes appointed, form of government, charged with making decisions for us all, as in any other form of republicanism.
This statement is wrong. The central districts, VCCDD and SLCDD, are selected by the developer who is the only property owner in these districts. There is no VCDD.
The ACC is elected by the propert owners north of 466.
  #43  
Old 02-22-2015, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Cedwards38 View Post
1. The Developer is not out to get us or cheat us. That makes no sense. If they were then that would inhibit marketing this community and drive away their livelihood.

2. Not everything done by the Developer may be completely in the best interest of all the residents. The Developer is in business to make money, and that money comes from us. They create things and sell them for a profit and they cut expenses whenever and wherever they can. That's business.

3. The ACC and VCDD's are our elected, and sometimes appointed, form of government, charged with making decisions for us all, as in any other form of republicanism.

Therefore:

A. Both the VHA and the POA serve a worthwhile purpose and we should all join both. Let's not try to turn them into political parties.

B. If you don't like what our local government is doing, then tell them, or better yet seek an appointment or run for one of the positions.
Hi Cedwards: I appreciate your concilatory remarks however here is the rub and the reason the POA is essential.

The Districts (VCCDD & SLCDD) are limited in the scope of their authority.

I had written to them outlining suggestions that would be beneficial to residents. the reply came back that they did not have the legal or administration authority to effect any such changes which startled me because they were in keeping with current village policies.

I emailed back and asked then whom could I address these suggestions and was met with dead silence...and I knew before I emailed them why.

The Villages of Lakes-Sumter, Inc. (Developer) control all voting on issues affecting The Villages. All you are going to get from the Districts and the VHA are the state of the amenities and once again I do not view this s a vacation destination but my home.

What I have learned since moving here 8 years ago is that what was presented to me is flawed. I was told if Ii wanted this Lifestyle I had to lay out a premium amount for my home along with annual fees, etc. In other words I was paying for a Villages Lifestyle The fact is that I didn't have to buy a house here and that by renting or living in adjacent communities I could have most of it at lower the price.....and I haven't bothered to discuss prime season

So if people like me seem a little sensitive about the focus on hype vis a vis substance or that bad policy affecting living here can't legally or administratively be addressed by District (our local government) then then then .

The IRS bond issue stands out as a prime example. Anyone who has read the originals proposals by the IRS has to question exactly who it is that protects their interests?
  #44  
Old 02-22-2015, 03:07 PM
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Originally Posted by PennBF View Post
Not yet 2 years and speaks of history and living in The Villages. Not even wet under the ears! A rep for the VHA? Unbelievable..
Geeeez, leave the lady alone! Our current president only had four years as a senator, and the people though he was qualified to run this country. twice... I would think living two years in TV qualifies a petson to be on a homeowners association. The more I keep reading the post of the supporters of the POA, the more negative opinion I have of them and the orginization.
  #45  
Old 02-22-2015, 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Mleeja View Post
Geeeez, leave the lady alone! Our current president only had four years as a senator, and the people though he was qualified to run this country. twice... I would think living two years in TV qualifies a petson to be on a homeowners association. The more I keep reading the post of the supporters of the POA, the more negative opinion I have of them and the orginization.
Looks like this thread just went POLITICAL.
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