Where did the Covid19 virus originate?

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  #16  
Old 03-29-2020, 05:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexaninVA View Post
Not clear where, or how, you got the notion of a conspiracy theory ... it's simply an Italian TV news story from five years ago that seems relevant.
I don't know what this means, your response to my response.

I saw the question on our opinion of the origin of this new, dangerous virus and I said most new viruses are a cross over from animals. And if it were a release of an engineered virus in China by scientists trying to harm the U.S. that it was damned dumb because it hurt China. And no matter if it were released on purpose, we can sort that out after we do everything in our power to save lives. What ever caused it, no matter how it began, and viruses evolve and become less harmful and more harmful, that ship has sailed. I think someone ate an infected animal. That is my opinion and my answer to how this began, but I could be wrong. The only three letter organization I have worked for is the PTA.
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  #17  
Old 03-29-2020, 05:35 AM
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I think that no matter how the virus originated, countries are at least learning that using a viral agent as a bioweapon would - at some point - strike themselves.
  #18  
Old 03-29-2020, 05:43 AM
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Wuhan is home to china's largest chemical warfare factory. Of course it is more convenient for them to blame the U.S. as they are now doing.
  #19  
Old 03-29-2020, 05:51 AM
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Patient Zero, is supposed to be a shrimp vendor in the Wuhan mkt, she went to a dr , in early Dec, was treated for a cold--they had no idea what the virus was then--after she transmitted it to others, then they knew she had a problem
  #20  
Old 03-29-2020, 06:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Bwolf1 View Post
The Corona Virus has been closely examined by the CDC and scientists have determined without doubt that this virus is naturally evolved. There is no gene splicing nor are there any lab generated anomalies to this Virus. It has most certainly manifested itself through Chinese consumption of Horseshoe Bats, the source of this virus.
"Without a doubt" and "has most certainly" is 100% certainty. In this case, I don't think so. But hey, thanks for sharing your view.
  #21  
Old 03-29-2020, 06:15 AM
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Originally Posted by graciegirl View Post
I don't know what this means, your response to my response.

I saw the question on our opinion of the origin of this new, dangerous virus and I said most new viruses are a cross over from animals. And if it were a release of an engineered virus in China by scientists trying to harm the U.S. that it was damned dumb because it hurt China. And no matter if it were released on purpose, we can sort that out after we do everything in our power to save lives. What ever caused it, no matter how it began, and viruses evolve and become less harmful and more harmful, that ship has sailed. I think someone ate an infected animal. That is my opinion and my answer to how this began, but I could be wrong. The only three letter organization I have worked for is the PTA.
You initially referred to the raising of this question as a conspiracy theory, which in contemporary terms, means it's beyond the boundaries of polite discussion. and can thus be dismissed without thinking about it.

In any event, the PTA is a wonderful organization. Thank you for your service and your opinion about the catalyst being ingestion of an infected animal.
  #22  
Old 03-29-2020, 06:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Jima64 View Post
Wuhan is home to china's largest chemical warfare factory. Of course it is more convenient for them to blame the U.S. as they are now doing.
Biological lab vs chemical, but otherwise I agree with your point. The idea that the US Army started this is laughable although that propaganda plays well in some 3rd world countries which is why the Chinese said it.
  #23  
Old 03-29-2020, 06:20 AM
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>> doesn't matter now <<
Disagree. If the source is found then ways to avoid in the future can be pursed. If not found we can live the rest of our lives in ignorance, waiting for recurrence.
  #24  
Old 03-29-2020, 06:58 AM
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Originally Posted by TexaninVA View Post
Did the virus emerge “naturally” or was it at least, in part, the product of a lab experiment gone wrong? No one knows for sure. Presumably after all this blows over, we’ll have a variety of investigations to answer this and other questions.

In the meantime, here’s a pertinent news story from Italian TV circa 2015. It’s quite interesting.

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Are you kidding viruses mutate naturally all the time this is just a natural mutation of the Corona virus not a totally new virus.
  #25  
Old 03-29-2020, 07:02 AM
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From all the research I've read and heard, I agree with Bwolf1. It most likely was transmitted from live bats sold in open markets in China. I hear bats are full of viruses that can be transmitted to humans. Shouldn't the world ask them to stop this practice?!
  #26  
Old 03-29-2020, 07:23 AM
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The "conspiracy theory" referred to within the chain originates because it has been said that a couple of Chinese were arrested last fall for taking the lab animals and instead of cremating them, euthanizing them and selling them to street vendors. They hypothesize that this was the original method of transmission .... and that the lab was a research lab for weaponizing virus.
  #27  
Old 03-29-2020, 07:27 AM
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One of my life mottoes is: never conclude something is a conspiracy when human stupidity is more likely. China allows wild animal "wet" markets, and peasants buy bats and other wild creatures. The poor folk eating them, along with the hunters that capture them, allow for the transmission of viruses that are benign to the animal to humans and the combination can produce a SARS or Covid-19 epidemic. This article give ample details.

So I don't think we have to conclude there was a conscious effort by the Chinese to infect the world. Human stupidity -- authoritarian government in this case -- is an ample explanation. Read the article and remember, the smart thing to do would be to shut down the wild animal markets so people would be discouraged from eating bats, among other dreadful menu items from the wild. But don't count on the Chinese leadership to do it.

From Bats to Human Lungs, the Evolution of a Coronavirus | The New Yorker
  #28  
Old 03-29-2020, 07:29 AM
collie1228 collie1228 is offline
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It's pretty clear to the world of science that the novel virus started in a Chinese "wet market" Have you ever been in a wet market in an Asian country? I have. It's pretty disgusting to my Western sensibilities. I thought the chickens killed to order were disgusting, then saw a cage with some kind of badger in it, waiting to die for some strange diet. I never saw any bats or civets (whose butchering has also been responsible for novel viruses from China in the past), but am not surprised that people eat them. The world needs to wake up and put pressure on China to end this barbaric practice. The Chinese could at least separate the stalls that kill and butcher these wild animals to avoid the obvious cross-contamination that occurs there.
  #29  
Old 03-29-2020, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by collie1228 View Post
It's pretty clear to the world of science that the novel virus started in a Chinese "wet market" Have you ever been in a wet market in an Asian country? I have. It's pretty disgusting to my Western sensibilities. I thought the chickens killed to order were disgusting, then saw a cage with some kind of badger in it, waiting to die for some strange diet. I never saw any bats or civets (whose butchering has also been responsible for novel viruses from China in the past), but am not surprised that people eat them. The world needs to wake up and put pressure on China to end this barbaric practice. The Chinese could at least separate the stalls that kill and butcher these wild animals to avoid the obvious cross-contamination that occurs there.
One of the problems is insufficient protein in China. Hence, people literally cook and eat anything that flies, crawls or walks.

You mentioned the wet market. Since you cited that, here’s a link that shows how that market operates. I know you said you’ve seen one but most people haven’t. If any viewer has a delicate stomach, you really don’t want to look at this … it's indeed disgusting and, more accurately, revolting to most Westerners.

Wuhan Meat Market - Hell on Earth! - YouTube

The wet market is a petri dish for all types of bad things to develop therein for sure. But the question of whether, or not, there is also a bio-engineering component, using the market as an obvious cover, is no doubt being studied inside classified channels. If that turns out to be true, I think the most likely explanation is an unintentional release (i.e incompetence) accidentally introduced it into the wet market vs a deliberate unleashing.
  #30  
Old 03-29-2020, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Klatu View Post
One of my life mottoes is: never conclude something is a conspiracy when human stupidity is more likely. China allows wild animal "wet" markets, and peasants buy bats and other wild creatures. The poor folk eating them, along with the hunters that capture them, allow for the transmission of viruses that are benign to the animal to humans and the combination can produce a SARS or Covid-19 epidemic. This article give ample details.

So I don't think we have to conclude there was a conscious effort by the Chinese to infect the world. Human stupidity -- authoritarian government in this case -- is an ample explanation. Read the article and remember, the smart thing to do would be to shut down the wild animal markets so people would be discouraged from eating bats, among other dreadful menu items from the wild. But don't count on the Chinese leadership to do it.

From Bats to Human Lungs, the Evolution of a Coronavirus | The New Yorker
That's a pretty good life motto actually ... and I agree that stupidity is no doubt a huge part of this. Operating the wet market as they do is prima facie. I don't think there's any conspiracies per se here ... just incompetence, a bad breeding ground in the market and, as you say, lots of stupidity mixed in.
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