[Trayderjoe]

I am amazed and glad that this discussion has gone as long as it has with only the surface of "ban the guns" being scratched. Many ask as to when these mass shootings will end, while others point to the need to understand the WHY they are happening. Some posters have pointed to context as being important-it is!

Consider the discussion of violent video games and the influence they have on children. There are many adults who have played various role playing games, watched movies with violence, etc. and are peaceful law abiding citizens. Who here (and I assume there are many) remembers going to the playground to play in a pickup ball game? Who here had parents that told you to go out and play versus sitting in the house? How many people participated in activities and did NOT get "participation" trophies just for showing up? Many of us grew up and developed social interaction skills as well as learning that we don't always win, but we tried. How many of the youths of today plug in to the internet versus going to the playground? How many get trophies because they participated versus those who don't get participation trophies? What happens to school children who never learn that they WILL fail at something in their life, or who never hear the word NO? Once these kids get out of a sheltered life and go out into the world, how do they handle the competition and failures that they will face?

Consider too that the rate of suicide is increasing annually. You can check out the statistics from the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention here. Why is the rate increasing annually? What is different from when we grew up? Is it because we don't unplug from work anymore?

I certainly don't have the answers, but unless/until we understand the WHY, we will be unable to reduce/eliminate these tragic events. Instead of blaming the "how", put the blame exactly where it belongs, on the perpetrator of the crime and then try to find out the WHY it was done. Was it a mental health issue? A disgruntled employee? Is there just a basic lack of respect for life? Why is killing so cavalier to some people?

[Velvet]

Yes, yes, yes, the WHY is critical. The doctor has to diagnose the patient to figure out what is wrong, first.

[Aces4]

Originally Posted by ColdNoMore

OK, point taken on incorrectly using..."NOTHING."

Speaking of the horrific OKC bombing though, at least SOME THINGS were done...to try and prevent another one.

Impact of the Oklahoma City Bombing 20 Years Later | Newseum



So tell us how many things have been done to try and prevent mass murderers...who use firearms and high-capacity magazines?


I'll wait.

I guess I don’t understand the popcorn and edginess. Aren’t we all on the same page in trying to stop mass murders. So many preventions and policies have been instituted so far and much more needs to happen, unfortunately. As stated earlier, when a deluded person is hellbent on murder, they will use any method that will wreak havoc.

[Velvet]

Yes, but... this guy was an Engineer. Years of very challenging studies. Then had to qualify to become a professional engineer. Then worked for 15 years. Then he got fired.
Trying to understand what went on here.

[luperona9]

Originally Posted by Kenswing

What has changed in our society that people now think shooting a group of people is the answer to their problems or is the avenue for revenge?

I know people are going to take their usual positions about guns but we've always had guns. We haven't always had this number of mass shootings. What has changed?

What has changed... Gun-Free School Zones Act of 1990 - Wikipedia

And the internet and media have given these cowards a platform.

The most efficient killing machine is the $19.95 home Depot truck. Easiest to get, kills the most people most efficiently, luckily the government has not created any gun-free zones where you can easily take a rental truck... Yet.

[John_W]

Originally Posted by Aces4

...As stated earlier, when a deluded person is hellbent on murder, they will use any method that will wreak havoc.

This pretty much sez it all, I don't know why it took six pages to figure this out.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by Number 10 GI

Legal gun ownership in Mexico is nearly impossible unless you are connected to the right people. Back in the late 80's I read a report stating that there were more knife homicides in Mexico than homicides from all causes (knife, gun, bludgeon, beating, etc.) in the United States for the same time frame. If a person has the intent to kill they will find something to use to commit the murder.

So let's just give them easy access to the most efficient method possible. That's what you're saying. You're saying you can't stop people from doing stupid, dangerous, horrible things, so you might as well help them do it really really well.

[Taltarzac725]

Originally Posted by Jazuela

So let's just give them easy access to the most efficient method possible. That's what you're saying. You're saying you can't stop people from doing stupid, dangerous, horrible things, so you might as well help them do it really really well.

That would be grenades I would guess. Thank God no one has access to these that I am aware of anyway. And that is what you would need along with many other weapons to fight a war like some NRA 2nd Amendment fanatics put forth as the reason behind the 2nd Amendment. Militias fighting other militias which happened extremely often in Imperial Rome something that the Founding Fathers would have been very aware of when writing the US Constitution.

[Trayderjoe]

Originally Posted by Number 10 GI

Legal gun ownership in Mexico is nearly impossible unless you are connected to the right people. Back in the late 80's I read a report stating that there were more knife homicides in Mexico than homicides from all causes (knife, gun, bludgeon, beating, etc.) in the United States for the same time frame. If a person has the intent to kill they will find something to use to commit the murder.

The last sentence of the first post cited does say it all regarding the "how", that if someone is intent to kill, they will find a way.

Originally Posted by Jazuela

So let's just give them easy access to the most efficient method possible. That's what you're saying. You're saying you can't stop people from doing stupid, dangerous, horrible things, so you might as well help them do it really really well.

I did not read anything like this into the first post cited.

How easy was it to make and how long do you think it took, for the detonation of the two homemade pressure cooker bombs, at the Boston Marathon which killed three people and injured several hundred others, including 16 who lost limbs?

I would guess it wasn't too difficult to obtain a 19 ton truck and it to plow into revellers in Nice celebrating the Bastille Day holiday on July 14, 2016. Tunisian national Mohamed Bouhlel killed 86 people.

How about Timothy McVeigh, who perpetrated the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing, which killed 168 people and injured over 680 others? I wonder how easy it was to put that bomb together and how long did it take for that devastation to occur?

The internet provides a lot of information on how to build bombs and nerve agents using easily available materials. I remember a caution in high school chemistry about not mixing two common substances that can generate a toxic gas. So yes, if someone is intent on killing, they will find any means they can to do evil.

Why not try and figure out what drives these people to do "stupid, dangerous, horrible things" and work on THAT instead of focusing how they do it? Why is it so easy these days to kill people? Shouldn't we try and get our arms around that?

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by Taltarzac725

That would be grenades I would guess. Thank God no one has access to these that I am aware of anyway. And that is what you would need along with many other weapons to fight a war like some NRA 2nd Amendment fanatics put forth as the reason behind the 2nd Amendment. Militias fighting other militias which happened extremely often in Imperial Rome something that the Founding Fathers would have been very aware of when writing the US Constitution.

Last November, in California, an ex marine killed 12 people and used smoke grenades and high capacity mags.

Gunman in California bar attack used smoke grenades, high-capacity magazines

But you are correct in what you say. Most of it is not allowed to be discussed on this forum, but you are close.

[luperona9]

Massacre at Borderline Bar & Grill in Thousand Oaks, California was in another Gun-free zone: 12 murdered, 18 injured | Gun Owners of America

Almost every mass shooting is in a gun free zone.

The thing speaks for itself.

[Bucco]

Originally Posted by luperona9

Massacre at Borderline Bar & Grill in Thousand Oaks, California was in another Gun-free zone: 12 murdered, 18 injured | Gun Owners of America

Almost every mass shooting is in a gun free zone.

The thing speaks for itself.

Point was replying to the post about grenades and thinking nobody has access to them

[luperona9]

Originally Posted by Bucco

Point was replying to the post about grenades and thinking nobody has access to them

My point is clearly stated.

[Trayderjoe]

Originally Posted by Bucco

Last November, in California, an ex marine killed 12 people and used smoke grenades and high capacity mags.

Gunman in California bar attack used smoke grenades, high-capacity magazines

But you are correct in what you say. Most of it is not allowed to be discussed on this forum, but you are close.

Oh, you mean Ian David Long, the former marine. The one whom police were called to Long's home in Newbury Park in 2018 for a domestic dispute where he was found to be "somewhat irate and acting irrationally," per Ventura County Sheriff Geoff Dean.

Dean said mental health workers examined Long at the time, but decided not to take him in for further observation.

The same guy who was a "former machine gunner and decorated combat veteran of the war in Afghanistan who, authorities said, had an episode of erratic behavior that suggested post-traumatic stress disorder.

Long's various interactions with police over the years pointed to a man who needed professional help. None came". Link

So another case where people were made aware of someone who had emotional issues, did nothing, and yet finger pointing at the NRA occurs. Why aren't we looking at the breakdown in the support system?

[manaboutown]

Originally Posted by Jazuela

So let's just give them easy access to the most efficient method possible. That's what you're saying. You're saying you can't stop people from doing stupid, dangerous, horrible things, so you might as well help them do it really really well.

Well, the guy who went nuts was a civil engineer. If he could not have obtained a gun or three legally he was smart enough to have obtained them illegally as criminals and terrorists do regularly in gun controlled countries and regions of this country. Maybe he could have manufactured a shooting iron himself. He also could have made his own grenades, or horror of horrors, manufactured and used a poison gas, sprayed or poured acid on folks, or contrived other means of killing and maiming in numbers such as with bombs. He could have laced the office water supply with fentanyl.