[Kzeus4]

Originally Posted by Pugchief

The good news: FL is the second best in the nation. Bad news: The entire country has failing schools.

Why is this such a problem? Why are today's youth unable to read or do math at grade level? I know Covid caused a setback, but this was going on prior, and continues after.

As a retired teacher, I can only say that problems with our education system are complex, and I feel so sorry for both teachers and children in the public school system today. I'll share just some of my experiences and the subsequent reasons for our failing schools.

Children are coming to school from a home-life much different than many of us experienced growing up. They do not have adequate parental support, and that is part of a larger societal issue. Children come to school without having eaten breakfast and without provisions for lunch (although many schools these days do have a subsidized program). I've experienced students who can't stay awake because parents are fighting/partying/not home to supervise the children. I've had students who are victims of abuse, children who come to school from a homeless shelter, or are moving from place to place. A significant number of children had many absences due to illness, parents who don't bring them to school, or pull them from school altogether for trips across borders to be with family that may last months at a time. They then return to the classroom, and teachers are somehow expected to help bring them up to the standards of the other students who have been in attendance during the others' absence.
I didn't speak English when I started elementary school, but there was no ESL, so immersion solved that problem - not only for me, but for the many students in my class whose parents (World War II immigrants) spoke a variety of languages at home. However, we were encouraged to learn English and our parents were very supportive and always emphasized the importance of education as the foundation for a successful future.
Because of dysfunction at home and the psychological damage it can cause, there are so many more behavior problems in the classroom which can make it so very difficult to focus on teaching, when lessons are disrupted time and again by students who have little to no impulse control due to a variety of factors.
In addition, teachers and administrators are under extreme pressure to produce improvement in academic areas, while minimizing sanctions for students who hinder the ability of others to learn. In districts where funding is tied to the attendance, principals do not expel students - rather those who break the rules are given in-school suspension, where they might sit in the principal's office for the day.
Teachers receive pressure from parents, the administration, and the district, as well. They frequently pay out of pocket for supplies. They take work home with them nightly, and take time from their families to write lesson plans over the weekend. There were days when I was so very sick with fever and worse - yet I had to create lesson plans for the 5 grade levels I taught (I was a music teacher) PLUS choir, and a special needs class which had its own specialized curriculum. My lessons had to be specially prepared for a substitute who might not have any musical background, as one never knew who would be called in. Because music and physical education are constantly threatened with cuts, the District made a deal with the unions that provided classroom teachers with planning time which was fulfilled by the "specialists." Teachers would drop off the students at music class, and they transitioned to P.E. giving the teachers a one-hour block. However, for me that meant up to 8 classes a day back to back, with just 1/2 hour lunch. Bathroom breaks? Non-existent - one could not leave students unsupervised for even 15 seconds, as (heaven forbid) something might happen to a child, and that could be the end of a teaching career.
I won't go on - but I could!! I loved the children. I loved the subject matter. But the conditions became such that it started to impact my health and I'm fortunate to have retired when I did.
Finally, when my daughters began their careers in private industry (in the fields of technology and advertising), they shared with me their working conditions: Companies that support a healthy lifestyle and paid for gym memberships, encouraged workers to take time to live a healthy lifestyle, provided complimentary tickets to sporting events, concerts, etc., stocked refrigerators with beverages and fruit, and offered stock options and other benefits. Yes, there are pressures, just like any other job, but there is no comparison to the stress that teachers face on a daily basis - this, while trying to provide our students with a consistent environment that is conducive to learning.
By the way, toward the end of my career, I taught upper level classes at a local college for future classroom teachers to learn creative ways in which one can integrate the arts (such as music) with the curriculum to improve learning in such areas as literacy and math. Students were required to write papers for this class, and I received pushback from the students whose grades were lowered due to spelling and grammatical errors. Even as student-teachers, they felt that they should not have to be held accountable for literacy, since the class was considered a "music class." If future teachers hold this attitude, what can we then expect from their students?
p.s. Although my observations may come off as negative, I'm grateful to have had many wonderful and positive experiences throughout my 40+ years as a teacher and - in fact - received an award in the State where I taught as "Music Educator of the Year."
Thank you for allowing me to share my experiences and I hope it will provide some insight as to why our schools are struggling to turn out students who can meet the standards.

[jasamy2]

Originally Posted by Aces4

By all means, children who are not able to read 8 to 10 selected books before the age of 18 definitely causes ignorance and illiteracy. No wonder education is failing.

I love the panning of the trades which are crucial to the health of our country and most computer operators, administrators and security personnel are able to run circles around college graduates. One needs to come in contact with these employees outside the Florida environment. They are hardworking, bright people who deal with the real world and not tainted by a college environment where many classes are taught by a TA.

First question I have, are all of the children tested American citizens, speak English and have a dedicated home/household to which they return at night? If broad testing is being performed on all children at all levels, the results could be very skewed. A clarification would be welcome.

The majority of children are being raised in an overindulgent home life where everything is provided, chores aren't required, there isn't a dedicated homework time, sports come first and the kids faces are glued to cellphones. Reading isn't encouraged and a trip to the library is a very last priority.

Sadly, I agree 100%. Overindulgence of this generation of kids will hurt them more than the parents realize. How can kids understand they will have to work hard for anything they want as adults if everything comes so easily now?

[Cuervo]

My view is that schools are not failing as much as they do not gear children for life as it is.
They teach reading, writing, math, history, English and all the basics, but what is missing is a course in life. Now this should be something that should be the responsibility of the parents, but most are either ill-equipped or do not spend the time.
What would this course teach our children, that life is competitive, take them on a field trip to a car wash and show them the people diving up in their fancy cars and explain to them the one with a fancier car are the ones who learned and put their education to use and point out the ones who are washing the cars.
This might sound cruel, but they have to understand what life is about.
Also have classes on not only how to make money, but how to save, spend and invest.
Look at the end of the day not all the kids are going to land in the corner office with all the glass windows, but even if they take a trade, they will have a target.
Also, as seminars on marriage and I'm not talking about sex, the reality of the ups and downs.
You can call this type of study "Real Life".
The lesson is it's better to retire comfortably than poor.

[Pmelo]

Public School Rankings by State 2024

[LoisR]

Florida has some of the worst schools in the country. Look at the data, all the data.

[LoisR]

Florida has some of the worst schools in the country, not the best. Check the data, all the data, not one reviewer.

Originally Posted by Pugchief

The good news: FL is the second best in the nation. Bad news: The entire country has failing schools.

Why is this such a problem? Why are today's youth unable to read or do math at grade level? I know Covid caused a setback, but this was going on prior, and continues after.

Not even a why question. It's obvious. P C dumbing down of America plain and simple. You think all the social apps and electronics are by chance?

We are what we eat, breathe, see and hear. How does that rate to countries about to exceed us. It's pretty simple to figure out.

At least The Villages, for now, is its own brain for education. More and more are home-schooling for good cause.

[bumpa]

Originally Posted by Pugchief

The good news: FL is the second best in the nation. Bad news: The entire country has failing schools.

Why is this such a problem? Why are today's youth unable to read or do math at grade level? I know Covid caused a setback, but this was going on prior, and continues after.

Might be doing great in the 4th grade but Over all FL ranks 42th in grade school rankings.

[waterflower]

Remember who wrote the survey. The proof is in the pudding. Most people in this country do not know how to grow food. The list can go on and on. The country as a whole doesn't make anything, we are a debit-consumer nation.

[FredMitchell]

Originally Posted by Pugchief

The good news: FL is the second best in the nation. Bad news: The entire country has failing schools.

Why is this such a problem? Why are today's youth unable to read or do math at grade level? I know Covid caused a setback, but this was going on prior, and continues after.

The graph is nice, but it does not bear any relevance to your question. Your question is temporal in nature. The graph is geographical. All of the answers to this point missed this. If you want an answer that can be examined with analyiical thinking, please try to find historical data.

Then we can examine other social historical data to try to find some correlation. Maybe even one of the new AI GPT engines could assist after we start it with useful data.

[CybrSage]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

shifted emphasis to "school choice," which means poorer schools get even less funding.

It means worse schools get less funding. Why send your kids to worse schools on purpose? Not a smart move for any parent.

[CybrSage]

The teachers I know, and I know about a dozen in various states, all say it is due to the students running the classrooms. Teachers have no power to do anything but send the kid to the principal, the main punishment allowed to be given is to expel the kid, which is what they want...to be home all day. The teachers are also strongly encouraged to pass every kid regardless of learning level.
The kids know all this as well.
The main source of the problem is the parents. I have seen letters from parents that literally blame the teacher for the student cussing her out and threatening her. Even when a video shows the student was the aggressor.
Until the parents start to care, nothing will change.

[dtennent]

While it is convenient to blame teachers, education starts in the home and needs to be emphasized throughout the educational process. When the message from multiple sources makes education less important than sports, social media, etc., it isn’t surprising that our students are not performing well. From what I have observed, children from recent immigrants performed much better than average. In the home in which I was raised, my performance in school was a regular discussion. As a parent, I continued that tradition. Unfortunately, my kids haven’t been as diligent. I am guessing that is not happening much in the average home today.

[CybrSage]

Originally Posted by Bogie Shooter

wow.!
(Send them to the camps)

In your rush to be offended, you chose to miss the point.

He was asking if those who know English as their second language, having only just started to learn it, are included in the reading test scores.

Are you still choosing to be offended over nothing after reading that?

It is a good question, especially in border states where a large minority of students are just starting to learn English in 3rd grade and up. This will lower the test scores, obviously, when included with those born into English speaking families. It will make English abilities in border states worse than those far away from the border.

My thought is they do take that into consideration. I do not know for sure but it is certainly a valid question and not offensive to anyone who is not seeking to be offended.

Next time you make up a story in your head, choose to make up a good one rather than assume the worst of others. Being offended on purpose is foolish.

[Bay Kid]

America has been dumbed down since '68. Instead of bringing the bottom up we bring the top down.