[graciegirl]

My granddaughter, a college student, recently got me interested in a controversy at her large Midwestern school about an upcoming tenure evaluation. It is a hot subject and the blogs I have been reading suggest that the faculty is afraid to deny this person tenure even though he has a good many issues and difficulties that prevent him from being a good teacher and it also appears as if he is not mentally healthy.

Then we read about the shooting in Huntsville involving a tenure issue.

Should academic staff have this security, this tenure? I think that this is something that is going to cause a lot of discussion soon, along with how people are going to be educated in the future.

Whaddya think?
Gracie CE (Cheerleader Emeritus)

[krisshan]

I went to college in Texas and we had an English teacher who had tenure and just like clockwork, 15 minutes into the class, she would have us read something out of the book and she would fall asleep. Every class she did this. We complained to the president of the college and he said because she has tenure, nothing can be done. Finally, it reached the point when she fell asleep, we all quietly walked out of class so she woke up to an empty classroom. And she gave us all As and Bs for the course. Tenure is telling the teacher, ok you can goof off now or go teach the values of socialism and there's nothing we can do to stop whatever you want to teach or to express your whacky your political views. Tenure should be dropped in every college and university.

[KCinBAMA]

As a Huntsville resident, we are seeing more stories come out about the shooter. For example, she shot her younger brother and was linked to a mail bomb. I believe these stories have been picked up nationally. FWIW, I think the shooting here is more about this person than the possible motive of this specific incident.

[bkcunningham1]

I certainly don't want this post to be redirected to the political post, but tenure can really be political IMHO. Life is all about learning isn't it? Tenure and educators has been a long standing debate on the local and national levels in this country.

Of course, if it bleeds it ledes, such as the tragic case in Alabama which brought this long discussed and debated issue to light once again. The story, which by the way, I watched with hope and prayer that it wasn't one of my girlfriends' sons who was shot when I first saw the news come across television.

The National Education Association and the American Federation of Teachers are two of the largest organized unions in the nation. Their power and, in my opionion, wrongly directed downfall, have been the instigator of The No Child Left Behind campaign and the students voucher debates in this country.

Quoting you, my question would be, why is the faculty "afraid to deny this person tenure even though he has a good many issues and difficulties that prevent him from being a good teacher and it also appears as if he is not mentally healthy" ?

[njbchbum]

You wrote: "...the faculty is afraid to deny this person tenure even though he has a good many issues and difficulties that prevent him from being a good teacher and it also appears as if he is not mentally healthy."

IMHO the faculty must only deal with the facts rather than the appearance of this person's issues. If the mental health and other issues are documented facts and serious enough to need to be addressed, tenure can likely be denied. However, since medical information cannot be disclosed to all but a few individuals, I would question what the faculty actually knows about this individual's mental health.

A more responsible action might be to postpone a tenure decision until a) facts are identified and b) corrective action be mandated to insure that the individual accepts responsibility to address facts that put a tenure decision in question.

Sometimes there is no right or wrong answer and a better answer must be sought.

[bkcunningham1]

njbchbum, although postponing tenure review may seem the most "responsible" thing to do, oftentimes contractual obligations prohibit that commonsensical approach.

[Bogie Shooter]

Doesn't the administration grant tenure....not the faculty?

[donmiller3@hotmail.com]

As a retired school administrator I can tell you that tenure is earned not given in my school. And yes, tenure is granted by the board of education not teachers. Admimistrators recommend but Bd of Ed make the final decisions. Out motto was when in doubt you are out. The longer you allow a poor teacher to stay in a school district the more rights they have relative to sismissal. Tenure in Illinois is granted after 4 years of continual contractual service to the district with evaluations by the administration that recommend the tenure to a teacher. I do agree at times that a teacher is protected a little by tenure but a tenured teacher can be dismissed with great work with a good school attorney.
An administrator must remember that children and education come first and he or she has to accept the fallout from the decisions. good or bad.

[bogart]

Being from Colorado (Boulder), this discussion is beginning to remind me of our Ward Churchill/tenure issue. This was/is a very disrupting and expensive issue for all involved.

[bkcunningham1]

Depends on the circumstances of employment....

But the NEA certainly promotes peer review...


http://www.nea.org/home/33071.htm

[Yoda]

In days of old there was a good reason for tenure. Not so today. Tenure does nothing constructive for education and should be done away with. IMHO

Yoda

[graciegirl]

I should have typed administration instead of faculty but I beg the question...should there be tenure? Period?

Yes, people can be dismissed but it does take a good deal more action to do it than say, if a person was working for a private company.

My question is, why is there tenure for academia? What makes that climate different or sacred compared to any other job or profession?

[bkcunningham1]

bogart, it is sorta the same but different, as my silly friends say. In Alabama, Amy Bishop is accused of shooting and killing three peers for disputing her right to tenure. Ward Churchill was tenured and disputed who murdered nearly 3,000 on September 11. His tenure, IMHO, was a joke.

[bkcunningham1]

Gracie, I'm sorry to ignore your original question. Tenure is a German concept that started in the US in the early 1900s as a legal protection for professors studying in German universities and bringing their ideas to the states. Tenure in the US started as a way to insure academic freedom for members of academia to investigate issues and assure that controversial or unpopular "voices" weren't surpressed. The American Association of University Professors helped promote and design the 1940s Statement on Principles of Academic Freedom and Tenure
IMHO, so Professors could research and teach without threat of dismissal.

[Xavier]

Originally Posted by bkcunningham1

Depends on the circumstances of employment....

But the NEA certainly promotes peer review...


http://www.nea.org/home/33071.htm

.. to improve instruction. Peers helping peers to improve the effectiveness of instruction, etc. Mentoring so to speak. Non-threatening and more apt to be productive in bringing about the desired change. Most often it is initiated by the teacher himself/herself.

Tenure is no more than a successful end of a probationary period. It is found under different titles everywhere in businesses and industries across the country and around the world. Tenured teachers/administrators can be dismissed for cause if need be. It takes a lot of documentation and an earnest effort by their supervisor to help the individual improve before it comes to that point.