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-   The Villages, Florida, Political talk (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-political-talk-88/)
-   -   Assault on Free Speech (https://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-political-talk-88/assault-free-speech-245520/)

Sandtrap328 08-21-2017 02:34 PM
Quote:
Posted by Guest
I cannot speak for Sandtrap, but "perhaps" you are misunderstanding his meaning.

I think that the "attacks" on those "attacking" nazi slogans etc is to allow to paint a picture of the counter protesters as the bad guys and give the nazi folks credibility.

That is what our President did in both cases, and how I interpeted the OP of this thread. Do not allow anyone to know the motive behind the primary march, and then paint those who DID KNOW the purpose as the bad guys.

This is probably going to work. It will bring out more anti nazi people but that will be used over and over as an "excuse" for nazism.

I am glad you feel so comfortable with ignoring Nazi propoganda...that is how it was in the 1930's and keep in mind.

YOU CANNOT PUT THE CAP BACK ON THE BOTTLE ONCE IT IS OUT.

Free speech protects them for sure, but american values should ot allow it to become an accepted thing by our President or anyone.

Brown shirts, nazi slogans and signs, having boy scouts shout in cheers adoration for the President, led by the President should alarm every single american.

Remember, this Nazi movement was based on these marches, thESE cheers and rallies AND ATTACK ON THE MEDIA.


Sandtrap can speak for himself, but that is how I have seen this entire thread.

You can choose to not listen, they do have the right, but in my opinion, they do not need empowerment from anyone, especially the President who speaks for all of us.
Bucco,
You are more eloquent than I am - and those were my thoughts but not written as well as you did.

We must always speak out against any form of Nazism. Sitting back and ignoring it cannot be an option. If opposing hate speech is assaulting free speech, I will be assaulting it. I would be proud to have any and all who think the same linked arm in arm with me.
ST

Carl in Tampa 08-21-2017 03:29 PM
Explaining it AGAIN.
 
Quote:
Posted by Guest
ColdNoMore

Your entire premise...is pure bull$hit. :oops:

Your purposely pathetic (or maybe it's just incompetence?) attempt to try and imply that exercising free speech rights against those whose sole purpose is to spread hate, should for some reason be condemned for exercising their own free speech rights...simply exposes more of your already seen prejudices. :ohdear:

Deepest Sincere Wishes: :wave:
Well, as you see, I opted to respond to a portion of your post, in spite of your vulgar language.

You erroneously state that I "...attempt to try and imply..." that those who are "exercising free speech rights" against those who are engaging in hate speech should be condemned for exercising their own free speech rights.

You couldn't be more wrong. And I'm beginning to wonder about your reading comprehension ability because I have repeatedly stated that this is not my position.

I would be overjoyed to see a peaceful counter-demonstration against any assembly engaged in hate speech. Remember that I am the one who conducted investigations and surveillance of neo-Nazis in my federal career. I have also done crowd control duty in riot situations where police officers near me were injured.

My criticism is of the violence committed by the counter-demonstrators. Watch the videos of the riots. A principal group that engages in violence is the Antifa, typically dressed all in black and having faces covered to avoid identification because they came with the intent to break the law. In the Boston riots virtually everyone you see committing an assault on police officers is dressed all in black.

As was stated in a previous post, the counter-demonstrators in Boston were there "to silence the racists." THAT is an assault on Free Speech.


Carl in Tampa
.
.

Carl in Tampa 08-21-2017 04:08 PM
Anti-American
 
Quote:
Posted by Guest
I would not equate the Antifa group-- which looks like a bunch of extremely unorganized youth and youth-in-spirit-- with the skin heads and other neo-Nazis.
I guess you are saying that the Antifa are not as "serious" as the skin heads and neo-Nazis.

You may have that perception because Antifa has not been in the headlines as much as the others, and has no central point of organization.

But, in fact, there is a widespread network of autonomous Antifa groups that communicate through social media, and organize protests in this medium.

It is also true that Antifa groups advocate anarchism, socialism, and communism. The Antifa groups in Germany and Italy in the 1930s were anti-fascists who clashed with the followers of Hitler and Mussolini. But, they were not for the status quo, they were pushing for Communism.

Today's American Antifa often show up at demonstrations wearing all black, with masks over their faces, and carrying weapons.

Because of their frequent assaults on police officers and their support of anarchy, I regard them as Anti-American.


Carl in Tampa
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.

dirtbanker 08-21-2017 04:13 PM
Quote:
Posted by Guest (Post 1438439)
Bucco,
You are more eloquent than I am - and those were my thoughts but not written as well as you did.

We must always speak out against any form of Nazism. Sitting back and ignoring it cannot be an option. If opposing hate speech is assaulting free speech, I will be assaulting it. I would be proud to have any and all who think the same linked arm in arm with me.
ST
Sandy, I am disappointed in your thought process. The few peoe that would attend a neo Nazi speech...were already sympathetic to that cause. Knock your self out, but you are not changing them no more than they are changing you.

Rockface- go stick your head up your ass, never mind it is already there. I hope someone successfully silences your free speech and quickly!

Carl - I see your point about the counter protesters desire to silence the free speech, because they don't agree with the cause nobody can talk about it.


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dirtbanker 08-21-2017 04:16 PM
Hey Sandy - did you speak any hateful words towards the North Vietnamese? How would you feel if somebody told you you can't speak that way?

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ColdNoMore 08-21-2017 04:35 PM
Quote:
Posted by Guest
Well, as you see, I opted to respond to a portion of your post, in spite of your vulgar language.

You erroneously state that I "...attempt to try and imply..." that those who are "exercising free speech rights" against those who are engaging in hate speech should be condemned for exercising their own free speech rights.

You couldn't be more wrong. And I'm beginning to wonder about your reading comprehension ability because I have repeatedly stated that this is not my position.

I would be overjoyed to see a peaceful counter-demonstration against any assembly engaged in hate speech. Remember that I am the one who conducted investigations and surveillance of neo-Nazis in my federal career. I have also done crowd control duty in riot situations where police officers near me were injured.

My criticism is of the violence committed by the counter-demonstrators. Watch the videos of the riots. A principal group that engages in violence is the Antifa, typically dressed all in black and having faces covered to avoid identification because they came with the intent to break the law. In the Boston riots virtually everyone you see committing an assault on police officers is dressed all in black.

As was stated in a previous post, the counter-demonstrators in Boston were there "to silence the racists." THAT is an assault on Free Speech.


Carl in Tampa

Your weaseling and lying is becoming more pathetic...with every one of your posts. :oops:

The "silencing" that the overwhelming majority of counter-protestors attempted in Boston, was simply to out yell and show superior numbers against the hate-groups...and yet you still try to equivocate to make it fit your own bigotry.

In fact, let's go back to your post...that started this thread.


https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...625-post1.html
Quote:
Posted by Guest
Now I am watching on TV a small "Free Speech" event on Boston Commons which has a counter-demonstration of over 15,000 "Black Lives Matter" and "Antifa" marchers who object to the Free Speech provision of the First Amendment, and are working to OUTLAW FREE SPEECH if they deem it to be "Hate Speech."

I support the Constitution.
Sorry dude, but anyone with even a modicum of intelligence would instantly know that while there might have been a very small number of those counter-protestors who were looking for a physical confrontation (and I condemn those)...you tried to justify your own obvious prejudice by labeling the entire group as such.

YOUR words...jerk.






Now go back and read that article the article/link regarding Hillsborough County (where you were trained), their despicable racial history and then come back and try to convince anyone...that you aren't a bigot and haven't deliberately tried to mislead.

And oh yeah, you can occasionally 'say' anything you want, but your true intent is spelled out clearly...in almost every one of your posts. :ho:

You're exactly the type that give the overwhelming number of good and decent LEO's...a bad rep.




Deepest Sincere Wishes: :wave:

dirtbanker 08-21-2017 05:03 PM
Now thats why we call her (unt...

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Carl in Tampa 08-21-2017 05:04 PM
Carl Derangement Syndrome
 
Quote:
Posted by Guest
ColdNoMore


:jester:
CDS
Well, it appears that your case of Trump Derangement Syndrome (TDS) has transmogrified into a severe case of Carl Derangement Syndrome (CDS.)

You are blinded by your unaccountable animus and your sad need to spray vitriol at me.

If only you could have managed to be civil in your posts we could have had a discussion.


Carl in Tampa
.

8notes 08-21-2017 05:05 PM
Quote:
Posted by Guest
Your weaseling and lying is becoming more pathetic...with every one of your posts. :oops:

The "silencing" that the overwhelming majority of counter-protestors attempted in Boston, was simply to out yell and show superior numbers against the hate-groups...and yet you still try to equivocate to make it fit your own bigotry.

In fact, let's go back to your post...that started this thread.


https://www.talkofthevillages.com/fo...625-post1.html



Sorry dude, but anyone with even a modicum of intelligence would instantly know that while there might have been a very small number of those counter-protestors who were looking for a physical confrontation (and I condemn those)...you tried to justify your own obvious prejudice by labeling the entire group as such.

YOUR words...jerk.






Now go back and read that article the article/link regarding Hillsborough County (where you were trained), their despicable racial history and then come back and try to convince anyone...that you aren't a bigot and haven't deliberately tried to mislead.

And oh yeah, you can occasionally 'say' anything you want, but your true intent is spelled out clearly...in almost every one of your posts. :ho:

You're exactly the type that give the overwhelming number of good and decent LEO's...a bad rep.




Deepest Sincere Wishes: :wave:
:BigApplause:

ColdNoMore 08-21-2017 05:08 PM
Quote:
Posted by Guest
Well, it appears that your case of Trump Derangement Syndrome (TDS) has transmogrified into a severe case of Carl Derangement Syndrome (CDS.)

You are blinded your unaccountable animus and your sad need to spray vitriol at me.

If only you could have managed to be civil in your posts we could have had a discussion.


Carl in Tampa
.
:1rotfl:

Hey smile, you're not the first one to have been outed and eviscerated with your own words...so suck it up buttercup. :D



Deepest Sincere Wishes: :wave:

Carl in Tampa 08-21-2017 05:20 PM
Heroes
 
2 Attachment(s)
Let's not overlook the heroes at these demonstrations and riots.

They are the police officers who are present, not to take sides, but to maintain peace and order. For this thankless task they are reviled and assaulted.

To be particularly honored are the Black officers who go about doing their duty and protecting the hate speech groups that hold them in contempt due to the color of their skin, from counter-demonstrators who would assault the haters if given the opportunity.

A Black officer protecting the Klan is a picture of dedication to the First Amendment.

A White officer taking verbal abuse from a Black demonstrator is a picture of self-restraint and professionalism.

Carl in Tampa

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ColdNoMore 08-21-2017 05:26 PM
Quote:
Posted by Guest
Let's not overlook the heroes at these demonstrations and riots.

They are the police officers who are present, not to take sides, but to maintain peace and order. For this thankless task they are reviled and assaulted.

To be particularly honored are the Black officers who go about doing their duty and protecting the hate speech groups that hold them in contempt due to the color of their skin, from counter-demonstrators who would assault the haters if given the opportunity.

A Black officer protecting the Klan is a picture of dedication to the First Amendment.

A White officer taking verbal abuse from a Black demonstrator is a picture of self-restraint and professionalism.

Carl in Tampa

.

It's too late to try and hide now, you outed yourself in your first post...regardless of your faux accolades now. :oops:

You're correct about one thing though, both of your examples are of LEO's who should be mostly admired (although I'm trying to understand how you think the white cop is showing "restraint")...given that he is under no threat.

Oh wait, I forgot, you're the one that keeps touting your professional background with the attempt to bolster your desperate need to feel that your opinion is superior.

I'll bet there were many times, when you wished (did?) that you could go ahead and abuse your authority...simply because someone pi$$ed you off.

Silly me.




Deepest Sincere Wishes: :wave:

Rockyrd 08-21-2017 05:46 PM
Quote:
Posted by Guest
Let's not overlook the heroes at these demonstrations and riots.

They are the police officers who are present, not to take sides, but to maintain peace and order. For this thankless task they are reviled and assaulted.

To be particularly honored are the Black officers who go about doing their duty and protecting the hate speech groups that hold them in contempt due to the color of their skin, from counter-demonstrators who would assault the haters if given the opportunity.

A Black officer protecting the Klan is a picture of dedication to the First Amendment.

A White officer taking verbal abuse from a Black demonstrator is a picture of self-restraint and professionalism.

Carl in Tampa

.
I realize I am just bitter, as you said, but I read every post in this thread, and unless I missed it....

You never once criticized or had a harsh word for the Nazi skinheads, or thier group. Not one that I saw.

I just find that interesting since you have, in almost every other post criticized the other group, not that they do not deserve criticism, but you "seem" to endorse the Nazi white marchers, not just thier right to March.

Understand, nobody here has defended Antifa...nobody, yet you seem very reluctant to criticize the Nazi whit nationalist movement, even though it was their march, they cleansed their Facebook page and disinvited anyone who spoke at Charlottesville (although they were pRt of the organizers and the group admitted they cancelled them only because of media coverage). Nothing but praise for police on here. So everyone is in accord EXCEPT your lack of criticism if the Nazi marchers.

Just find that curious, but then again, I am simply bitter and not up to your lofty ideals.

ColdNoMore 08-21-2017 05:50 PM
Quote:
Posted by Guest
I realize I am just bitter, as you said, but I read every post in this thread, and unless I missed it....

You never once criticized or had a harsh word for the Nazi skinheads, or thier group. Not one that I saw.

I just find that interesting since you have, in almost every other post criticized the other group, not that they do not deserve criticism, but you "seem" to endorse the Nazi white marchers, not just thier right to March.

Understand, nobody here has defended Antifa...nobody, yet you seem very reluctant to criticize the Nazi whit nationalist movement, even though it was their march, they cleansed their Facebook page and disinvited anyone who spoke at Charlottesville (although they were pRt of the organizers and the group admitted they cancelled them only because of media coverage). Nothing but praise for police on here. So everyone is in accord EXCEPT your lack of criticism if the Nazi marchers.

Just find that curious, but then again, I am simply bitter and not up to your lofty ideals.
:BigApplause:

MDLNB 08-21-2017 07:25 PM
27 counter protesters were arrested, some for assaulting police officers.

I do not support the KKK/Nazis, but I also do not support the AntiFA (Anti-First Amendment) radicals either. And I do not support the BLM scumbags either.

So, for those idiots that wish to say that if I support the President, then I support the KKK and Nazis, I have preempted you. I will counter that with accusing you of supporting the radical and violent Anti-American groups out there that are tearing down statues, destroying property and assaulting those that do not agree with them. The left is Anti first amendment until proven otherwise.


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