Who was it who said, "Elections have consequences."?
Oh yes, Obi-Wan Obama.

Until we can start talking the same language, referring to the same facts, we're never going to solve the problem. for my next exhibit, I'd like to present Michele Bachman's words in response to the State of the Union:

Unless we fully repeal Obamacare, the nation that currently enjoys the finest health care in the world might rely on government-run coverage that will have a devastating impact on our national debt for generations to come,

Finest health care? Maybe if you have a spot at the concession stand. Let's look at the facts.

The CIA Fact Book says our life expectancy of 78.11 years is 50th, where Macau is #1 at over 84 years, Japan is #3 at 82, Australia and Canada are #7 & 8 at over 81 years. Countries like Greece (26th @ 79.6 years) and Bosnia (43rd @ 78.5) are ahead of us!

That's not "#1 performance" to me.

We have 10.3% of our population suffering from diabetes. Examples for comparison, Germany is 8.9%, Bosnia 7%, France 6.7%.

We have 2.43 physicians per 1,000 population as of 2007 ranking 23rd out of 30 listed countries. Worst was Turkey at 1.51. Others were the UK just in front of us with 2.48*. France is 14th at 3.37.

* - how come we're spending nearly twice what the UK spends per capita but they have slightly more doctors, per capita?

The WHO rates healt care systems:

1) France. 37) United States (between Costa Rica and Slovenia)

Infant mortality? The CIA Fact Book says Sweden is best with 2.74 deaths per 1,000 live births. France is at 3.31 and the U.S is 46th best at 6.14. *CUBA* is at 5.72!

Is THAT "#1 performance"?

The University of South Carolina did a study in 2000 that had us spending $4500 per person on health care. Switzerland was second at $3300 yet our life expectancy was over 3.5 years less than the Swiss!

Is THAT "#1 performance"?

The Commonwealth Fund (a private foundation that focuses on health care) said last year "America scored poorly in most of the five key areas of health service in comparison to the other six competitorsdespite the country's healthcare system being the most expensive in the world." ["the competitors" were Australia, Canada, Germany, the Netherlands, New Zealand and the United Kingdom]

Saying "We're #1" DOES NOT MAKE IT SO!

ANYONE who claims we are 'in danger' of 'losing' our '#1 status' IS PROCEEDING FROM A LIE.

Let me know who travels to Slovenia to have their life threatening disease treated by state of the art technology and physicians.

Last time I checked they come here.

Let me know what percentage of the population here can afford it.

I'll bet you that there are FAR more people driving to Canada for medications than there are people coming here from foreign countries.

And by "happening to be" in Montreal when I got sick several years ago, I would have had to have paid $550 for my stay if I were uninsured. If I had been at home in NH and uninsured, that would have cost me over four times that amount FOR THE SAME CARE.

Ok, you changed my mind.

Everyone who can't afford healthcare should get it.
Everyone who can't afford a house should get one.
Everyone who can't afford a car should get one. If you can't afford the gas you get some of that too along with free insurance.
Everyone who can't afford dental care should get it.
Everyone who can't afford to eat well should get more food.
Everyone who can't afford their electric bill should get electricity.
Everyone who needs a phone should get one.

All pretty basic needs to survive life in the evil USA.

All we need to do is tax everyone more and Obama can start handing out the goodies.

dk: If your measure of the 'primacy' of American health care is by how many people travel here for care then I have something that will probably cause you some cognitive dissonance - I know it surprised me.

A McKinsey and Co. report from 2008 found that a plurality of an estimated 60,000 to 85,000 medical tourists were traveling to the United States for the purpose of receiving in-patient medical care; the same McKinsey study estimated that 750,000 American medical tourists traveled from the United States to other countries in 2007 (up from 500,000 in 2006)

Think about that. A one-year increase of FIFTY PERCENT in Americans going abroad for health care.

Think about the fact that TEN TIMES as many Americans go outside the country for health care as do those foreigners coming here.

Until we acknowledge THE TRUTH - that we are NOT the 'best in the world', we will not be able to so much as TALK to people who (I'm sorry to say it) *erroneously* have the idea that we ARE the 'best'.

People, by and large, are afraid of change - that's NORMAL. But sticking your head in the sand and ignoring the facts that are continuing to mount means it'll be that much MORE time before we can come up with solutions!

What made me think of this was when I remembered a conversation I had with someone in London last year. HE was complaining about the foreigners coming to ENGLAND to take advantage of THEIR NHS (National Health System).

Originally Posted by djplong

Until we can start talking the same language, referring to the same facts, we're never going to solve the problem. for my next exhibit, I'd like to present Michele Bachman's words in response to the State of the Union:



Finest health care? Maybe if you have a spot at the concession stand. Let's look at the facts.

The CIA Fact Book says our life expectancy of 78.11 years is 50th, where Macau is #1 at over 84 years, Japan is #3 at 82, Australia and Canada are #7 & 8 at over 81 years. Countries like Greece (26th @ 79.6 years) and Bosnia (43rd @ 78.5) are ahead of us!

That's not "#1 performance" to me.

We have 10.3% of our population suffering from diabetes. Examples for comparison, Germany is 8.9%, Bosnia 7%, France 6.7%.

We have 2.43 physicians per 1,000 population as of 2007 ranking 23rd out of 30 listed countries. Worst was Turkey at 1.51. Others were the UK just in front of us with 2.48*. France is 14th at 3.37.

* - how come we're spending nearly twice what the UK spends per capita but they have slightly more doctors, per capita?

The WHO rates healt care systems:

1) France. 37) United States (between Costa Rica and Slovenia)

Infant mortality? The CIA Fact Book says Sweden is best with 2.74 deaths per 1,000 live births. France is at 3.31 and the U.S is 46th best at 6.14. *CUBA* is at 5.72!

Is THAT "#1 performance"?

The University of South Carolina did a study in 2000 that had us spending $4500 per person on health care. Switzerland was second at $3300 yet our life expectancy was over 3.5 years less than the Swiss!

Is THAT "#1 performance"?

The Commonwealth Fund (a private foundation that focuses on health care) said last year "America scored poorly in most of the five key areas of health service in comparison to the other six competitorsdespite the country's healthcare system being the most expensive in the world." ["the competitors" were Australia, Canada, Germany, the Netherlands, New Zealand and the United Kingdom]

Saying "We're #1" DOES NOT MAKE IT SO!

ANYONE who claims we are 'in danger' of 'losing' our '#1 status' IS PROCEEDING FROM A LIE.

FYI, drugs are cheaper everywhere but the United States. R&D costs are paid by US customers not by those who receive their benefits in other countries.

Nobody is refused health care in the US, now. It's the law.

Trogg

Originally Posted by Trogg

FYI, drugs are cheaper everywhere but the United States. R&D costs are paid by US customers not by those who receive their benefits in other countries.

Nobody is refused health care in the US, now. It's the law.

Yes - we pay the world's prescription drug R&D costs.

But people ARE refused care. Go ahead - try to get chemo and radiation therapy for leukemia without health insurance (like after your insurance company kicked you off).

If nobody is refused health care, why did we just have to pass a bill to cover the 9/11 responders?

Are you aware of what "dumping" is? That's when a hospital "transfers" an indigent somewhere else without treating them. I learned about that in the 1980s when other hspitals used to dump some of their patients to the hospital where I worked (Boston's Beth Israel).

And you really think the government will make it better?

I have a bridge for sale, any takers?

I think it was a noble idea but there are too many parts to this law that are bad and there are other parts that I don't think anyone understands.There are also some good parts to this law.
I do think that all Americans want good AFFORDABLE health care and I do not understand why it costs so much in the USA and why the prices continue to go up.I do know one thing:the price for certain drugs is criminal and should be investigated. Oh,wait a minute....I forgot how much the big pharms give to our Reps and Senators and the insurance companies and on and on. People we are wasting our time and energy...just follow the money

Originally Posted by waynet

I think it was a noble idea but there are too many parts to this law that are bad and there are other parts that I don't think anyone understands.There are also some good parts to this law.
I do think that all Americans want good AFFORDABLE health care and I do not understand why it costs so much in the USA and why the prices continue to go up.I do know one thing:the price for certain drugs is criminal and should be investigated. Oh,wait a minute....I forgot how much the big pharms give to our Reps and Senators and the insurance companies and on and on. People we are wasting our time and energy...just follow the money

This bill was a POLITICAL response to the problem of high health care costs. Lost in the goal of making political gain was the original idea to lower cost, which this bill does not address in anyway.

You should really read this link from this weeks news...

http://www.investors.com/NewsAndAnal...ObamaCare.aspx

I see no political slant to this at all....a few little tidbits...

"The Democrats said that under their plan, health care costs would go down and those who wanted to keep their insurance would be able to. A government official, though, says neither is true.

Appearing Wednesday at a House Budget Committee hearing, Medicare Chief Actuary Richard Foster said ObamaCare will not hold down health care costs, as President Obama and the Democrats promised it would."

AND THIS...

"Foster's office has projected, as well, that what the Democrats are calling reform "would collectively reduce the number of people with employer-sponsored health coverage by about 14 million."

I dont think any of it matters. Both sides are getting lots of money to vote a specific way. Our politicians are all bought and sold period. MSNBC,FOX its all a scam. Money runs the country. Again follow the money,thats how the votes will go.

The Health Care "bill" is now LAW. There is no reason to bring it to the Congress for seeing if there are votes to repeal the law.

A couple of teabag party controlled states have decided the law is unconstitutional because it requires people to buy health insurance. Until the LAWis overturned by the US Supreme Court, it remains law. No reason at all for Congress to waste time on discussing it.

I have not seen anyone voluntarily turning in their Medicare benefits or their Social Security benefits because they were "forced" to pay into those systems.

Just sit back, take a deep breath, be glad it is 70 degrees in The Villages, and relax. Go out and play a round of golf (it is free on the executive courses), have a half price drink at Happy Hour at one of the clubs (I invited Bucco to join me but have not had a reply), and wait for the US Supreme Court decision. Life is too short for constant complaining.

A couple of teabag party controlled states

Tisk tisk, why such hate speech?

No reason at all for Congress to waste time on discussing it.

Actually there is. Remember the election in Nov?

Originally Posted by Tbugs

The Health Care "bill" is now LAW. There is no reason to bring it to the Congress for seeing if there are votes to repeal the law.

Just sit back, and wait for the US Supreme Court decision. Life is too short for constant complaining.

FYI: The Supreme Court does not MAKE LAW. The Congress makes law. The same Congress that makes a law can REPEAL IT. This is within the purview of the Congress' authority.

If Congress does indeed succeed in repealing this law, the role of the Supreme Court in this matter is moot.