Now that there's funny I don't care who you are. Donna you crack me up. "What page is the turd collector on?" I laid in bed last night laughing about that one.

Now, my biggest complaint with yourpost and others is to paint anyone who is opposed to this bill, as some kind of heartless cold person.....you sound exactly like one of the party folks who want to make the guy who doesnt agree with you as a bad guy...I had enough of that during the campaign when every other post either said or intimated I was a racist. You can have your opinion but dont you dare even hint that I dont care about folks...you have no idea what we (those opposed) have contributed in time and moneyto those less fortunate ![/QUOTE]

I have a great deal of respect for some of the people (yourself included), who object to the health reform bill using intelligent arguments and raising good questions. You and I will probably never know how much the final proposal has been revised BECAUSE of good questions and arguments. However, I have no respect for comments which paint 30 million people with the same nasty, false stereotype, or those summarized by some silly global axiom like 'it's wrong to take anything I earned and use it to benefit someone else'.

All of my political posts have been been in one of two themes; either to challenge sweeping generalizations and stereotypical characterizations or to suggest why it is right and beneficial for the future of our nation to assist disadvantaged citizens. I keep asking why it isn't beneficial to share the wealth when the sharing process does not materially affect the lifestyle of those who pay higher amounts. We all dislike taxes, but I'd bet we would agree that taxes have a greater impact on our lifestyle than they do on anyone we know who has regularly earned 250k or more per year. And still with that impact, middle class Americans have generally continued to live well. How many more boomers will be able to sustain that pretty good life in retirement because of medicare and social security.

I am not a lover of big government, but unfortunately there are two glaring areas of need for national regulation: health care and investment finance. Effectively managing these problem areas, along with avoiding armed conflicts, will provide a direct path toward eliminating the deficit. So, I believe the opposite of some, that health care reform will bankrupt us. As implied above, the only lives changed by health care reform will be those who will be able to finally obtain and keep that protection.

As implied above, the only lives changed by health care reform will be those who will be able to finally obtain and keep that protection.

Dream on.

2) Those of us who achieved the comforts we have were lucky. There are many unlucky circumstances which could have taken away all of our comforts, and millions of real people just like us who have suffered from those unlucky circumstances. 3) If we are to continue to be a united nation, not at risk of revolution and chaos, we must pull together to make sure citizens are not disenfranchised, politically, socially or economically].[/QUOTE]


I beg to disagree with you but what I have achieved in my life was NOT due to luck. I have no need to "dump" my young hardships on you to make my point but I bristle when I hear anyone suggest my current position in life is due to luck. Also, I will never change my belief system out of fear that "the disenfranchised" will "revolt" to take from me what I have worked so hard for.

VK..I will try not to confuse you with the facts, but, the post in question, not mine, clearly stated,

Originally Posted by bkcunningham1

The FCC presented a $24 billion plan to Congress today to provide high-speed broadband Internet to every American man, woman and child.

You acknowledged your support of the expenditure with this quote:

Originally Posted by Villages Kahuna

Having repeated the oft-used phrase about how small expenditures add up to big ones, in this case I believe it's an expenditure that should be made.

I responded:

Originally Posted by cabo35

It's part of the same logic and ideology demonstrated when VK and his liberal friends supported buying $23 billion dollars of computers so every American can have one....see related thread....let them pass the hat to those who agree with them.

God Bless Our Troops

I have a modest understanding of the King's English. Accordingly, outside that little $1 billion dollar typo, I believe the above fact pattern supports my position. My comments are precisely accurate notwithstanding your snide misrepresentation of fact about reading posts. To the contrary, your snap judgement and remarks on that point are without merit or factual basis. It is a typical liberal tactic frequently employed when one cannot defend the indefensible.
This "he said, she said" game is unproductive, but if you wish to continue to engage, go for it. Personally I would prefer to agree to disagree on a wide range of philosophical differences and occasionally agree with you especially when many of your informed financial and economic opinions are enlightening.

Thank you for your service to the country.

Have a good evening.

Originally Posted by ijusluvit

The government cannot handle the deserving benefits. What in the world are we going to do with 30 million more entitlements for people who have done nothing for this great country?

Donna2,
I hate to keep citing your posts to disagree, but you have once again made a most uncharitable, outrageous, myopic generalization about 30 million of your neighbors. It betrays your true bias and stereotypical thinking.

Most of those 30 million people work hard at being contributing, law-abiding members of society. Some of them go to your church, live on your street, and would offer you help any time you asked. They work at part-time jobs, many more than one, pay taxes of all sorts and contribute to medicare and social security. It's all they can get at this time. Many literally have to decide about buying housing and food or health insurance. And I'm not even talking about the unlucky people who lose their savings, homes and jobs because they get sick.

Since you condemn the lazy non-contributors, have you ever stopped to think how many hundreds of thousands of Americans have never worked a day in their lives (or retired at age 28), and live strictly off of the money they inherited, stole or won? Do you realize there may be just as many of those people as there are poor lazy non-contributors.

Instead of all the extreme generalizations, let's recognize what will be a large source of revenue to help the disadvantaged obtain health care. The wealthy who either work and earn a QUARTER MILLION DOLLARS PER YEAR!!, or sit around and earn that much and more, will be required to increase their payments so that millions of deserving people can have decent health care. Here is one thing I feel certain about: those increases will not change the lifestyles of the contributors even one teeny, tiny bit. That is unless you think choosing a 75 ft. instead of an 80 ft yacht constitutes life change.

I'm certain you have health insurance, like many of us middle class fortunate ones. Under health care reform your insurance costs and mine will be more stable than if there is no change. Will premiums increase for you and me in the next few years? Probably. (but probably not as much as in the last few years. Here's another thing I feel certain about: with the proposed reforms in place any increases in the premiums you and I pay will not change our lifestyle.

The recurring argument that it is "wrong to take any money I earned out of my pocket to pay help pay for someone else's benefit" is wrong for at least these reasons: 1) It ignores the fact that the nation's stability, prosperity, and protection of individual freedom in many cases made it possible for us to work, earn and parlay that into a high standard of living, beyond work into retirement. 2) Those of us who achieved the comforts we have were lucky. There are many unlucky circumstances which could have taken away all of our comforts, and millions of real people just like us who have suffered from those unlucky circumstances. 3) If we are to continue to be a united nation, not at risk of revolution and chaos, we must pull together to make sure citizens are not disenfranchised, politically, socially or economically.[/QUOTE]Do you know how insulting it is to hear someone say to me that what I have achieved in the past 60 years was due to LUCK? Like my life was a Vegas slot machine and I had a lucky pull. I wont trouble you with the challenges of my life but I will assure you that my current lot was NOT due to luck! And I will never give up my beliefs and values because of fear or a "risk of revolution"from the disenfranchised.

Originally Posted by rshoffer

Donna2,
Do you know how insulting it is to hear someone say to me that what I have achieved in the past 60 years was due to LUCK? Like my life was a Vegas slot machine and I had a lucky pull. I wont trouble you with the challenges of my life but I will assure you that my current lot was NOT due to luck! And I will never give up my beliefs and values because of fear or a "risk of revolution"from the disenfranchised.

Exactly

Originally Posted by bkcunningham1

Now that there's funny I don't care who you are. Donna you crack me up. "What page is the turd collector on?" I laid in bed last night laughing about that one.

Sometimes I can't help myself. What a bunch of funny and zany characters down there at the Village. I found myself a great place to "retire" to. LOL

Originally Posted by cabo35

[/B]
Exactly

I agree too. I was brought up dirt poor. My grandmother raised me. Her husband died of WWI related injuries but not until he fathered a few children. Grandma never took charity and cleaned well to-do people's homes on the rich side of town until she was well into her 70's.
It is the "useful idiots" that will be the ruination of this once great country.

Based on the Liberal posts in this thread I have come to a conclusion.

Liberals who have achieved a level of success believe that they earned it and can keep their rewards. Liberals also believe that conservatives who have achieved success did it with luck and they should share it.

There is proof for this in that Liberals give only a fraction of what Conservatives give to charities.

Originally Posted by cashman

Based on the Liberal posts in this thread I have come to a conclusion.

Liberals who have achieved a level of success believe that they earned it and can keep their rewards. Liberals also believe that conservatives who have achieved success did it with luck and they should share it.

There is proof for this in that Liberals give only a fraction of what Conservatives give to charities.

I have seen the polls about contributions to charities, and you are correct cashman. Most liberals (or if you prefer, progressives) are not the religious types and believe in the "nanny state" Therefore they figure contributions to charities is the state's ( Feds) responsibility.

"Effectively managing these problem areas, along with avoiding armed conflicts, will provide a direct path toward eliminating the deficit."

And what unknown information would you have access to that would lead you to believe that the representatives (so called) of this country have the ability, all of a sudden, to pull off the intent of your wishful, dream on statement?

You used the wording of classifying stereotypes, which you know is a concept relative to only the eye of the beholder. Just as I see your commentary as a stereotypical supporter....with the just because rationale.

Just as Obama tries to brainwash his flock with wording like....a vote for health care reform is a vote for progress and a no vote is a vote for the status quo....according to his narrow definition.

My questions I keep harping on with little discussion is where is the money coming from for the future debt obligation? Where is the added facility and practitioners coming from to care for the additional load of 32,000,000?

Emotions, beliefs, partisanship aside.....the numbers DO NOT ADD UP.
It is a mission impossible that your quote in my opening above stereotypically ignores!!!

btk

Originally Posted by billethkid

"Effectively managing these problem areas, along with avoiding armed conflicts, will provide a direct path toward eliminating the deficit."

And what unknown information would you have access to that would lead you to believe that the representatives (so called) of this country have the ability, all of a sudden, to pull off the intent of your wishful, dream on statement?

You used the wording of classifying stereotypes, which you know is a concept relative to only the eye of the beholder. Just as I see your commentary as a stereotypical supporter....with the just because rationale.

Just as Obama tries to brainwash his flock with wording like....a vote for health care reform is a vote for progress and a no vote is a vote for the status quo....according to his narrow definition.

My questions I keep harping on with little discussion is where is the money coming from for the future debt obligation? Where is the added facility and practitioners coming from to care for the additional load of 32,000,000?

Emotions, beliefs, partisanship aside.....the numbers DO NOT ADD UP.
It is a mission impossible that your quote in my opening above stereotypically ignores!!!

btk

You will not get an answer as the liberals never address the issues heads-on. They will only read through a post quickly and pick up on some nuance and then go directly to their talking- point lecture-sermon.
Ridicule and a tone of superiority are their forte.

What an interesting time to live. We are seeing and being witness to the possible destruction of America, its Constitution and world leadership. It is greed, power and control that is driving the change and the people are raising their ire just a little late. Politicians are being threatend and bribed with the bottom line being greed as the measure of thier principles. This has not happened overnight. You had Hillary Clinton carpet bag into NY, you had President Clinton lower the morals to that of a cess pool, you had Bush declare war based on incomplete facts and thousands die, you had Osama come out of the back alley of Chicago politics based on the need of the Pelosi's and Reids of the world to find someone they could control and was from a crooked background. We are in a "tail spin" and the real question is whether it is too late to save America. Regarding the current bill: Where do people think the Dr's will come from to treat another 30+ million patients? This means treatment overall will be worse.It is a simple equations. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure this out. If you raise the need to get another 1 trillion dollars where will the additional dollars come from? Lowering medicare coverage/care..of course..increasing taxes..of course..lowering the standard of living in the USA...of course. I guess the one thing that I still can't comprehend is how many dumb people there are..It is not a case of being "labeled" like "Liberal" or "Conservative". It is being smart. My only hope is that all that voted for this stupid bill are defeated in November and that a new Congress can turn it around.
As a further example: Can you imagine what John L. Lewis in Western Pennsylvania in th e30's would have said if you said you were "downsizing". Heck you are, you are firing and laying people off but today it is an accepted term for business's who want to cover up what they are doing. How about
"undocumented" people. Heck, they are illegal's who are using the USA citizents to pay their medical bills, food stamps, rahter than improving their own country. They are riding off of the hard work the US Citizens has accomplished to make a better standard of living.
Oh well..All of this will probably not impact me but unfortunately the crooked
politicians and "I don't care" citizens will ruin a lot of our grandchildren.

They (the progressives) Keep insisting that this bill is not "socialized Medicine".

Maybe they are correct, but at the very least it is:

One giant leap for American mankind into complete Government control of
medicine, education, abortion, the lives of children and seniors and the
beginning of the end of Capitalism.

Liberals (progressives) know that , But like Their leader Obama they do not care about the destruction of The American way of life as long as they get their way.