Originally Posted by Cassie325

Perhaps then a 18+ area? Never thought about it that way...thanks! However...there are movies, music and other media types that have regulating rules about them....perhaps books should have the same thing...??

Most public libraries that I have been in have their own set of unwritten rules about what kind of books they will put out on the shelf and I do believe that local community values play a big part in these unwritten rules.

The books and DVDs I found at the Minneapolis Public Library for instance are quite different from what I would find at the Villages Public Library.

For instance, I have found very few public libraries which have Playboy in their stacks. Some do but very few.

So many good points have been said. What books are you talking about? That in itself would make a HUGE difference.

I am sure the far left will dig into this and probably if it is not a 'true' story they will 'make' it a big spin. But what about all of the inunedos about Obama and Biden (heard his sons are in big financial problems) the far left media...doesn't touch any of it and they won't because they are so pro Democratic.

Why is everyone trying to compare Palin and Obama? One is running for VP and the other Pres. The reason I hear is that McCain is old and she might become Pres within the next four years. As one add about Cancer on the television says there is 'no experation date' . Who are we to say that McCain won't be able to finish his term? Everyone has known of a young healty person come to an early untimely natural death.

chels

When there were "allegations "that Obama was muslim you guys went nuts about the unfairness of it all, But you choose allegations about reps as fair to discuss. Benj

The librarian's reply stated the books in the library were all part of a national selection criteria, so that would imply there already was a form of censorship as to what books are there. There was no mention of what books Palin might have an objection to. As a matter of fact, supposedly Palin never mentioned exactly what books she might object to, just that if she objected to certain books would they be removed.

I don't like censorship but do understand the need. I certainly wouldn't want X-rated books (like "Dial H for Hotel" -- my introduction to porn when I was about 10 [my brother's book]} to be available for kids to check out. At the same time, censorship has caused books like the Tropic of Cancer to be banned throughout the US when it was first published. I like even less the idea that an elected official would even consider having books banned because they don't fit his/her moral standards. Fortunately, so far as we know, Palin never acted on this question. Hopefully, she never will.

As to Biden and his family, I stand with it ain't none of my bizwhacks. Neither is any of the stuff about Palin's family unless she chooses to make it public and is willing to discuss it. Even then, I doubt I will sit and listen to the comments.

Palin stands a good chance of becoming President within 4 years if not sooner if McCain wins. While 72 is not really all that old by today's standards, being a POW has to have affected him physically and I'd be very surprised if his body really isn't that of a much older man due to the abuse and deprivation. Melanomas are notorious for coming back. Worse yet, melanoma patients have an 80% chance of getting a tumor-based cancer in another part of their body within 10 years of the original cancer. Being POTUS is very stressful -- it ages even the youngest and healthiest men. What will it do to a 72 YO man with a history of cancer and deprivation in his youth? He is at higher risk for dying in office than Obama (barring an accident or assination).

The Republicans have made a big deal of Obama's lack of experience, something which all of us should factor in when we vote. I think the reason for the comparison between Palin and Obama is the hypocrisy of the Republican bigwigs (although it is fun to listen them try to back track and eat their past words). The lack of experience of both people should be a consideration. Not the only, but certainly one.

Originally Posted by Cassie325

But who is it to say what is ok and what is not....isn't it a parents job to dictate what a children can and can not see or read?

Cassie I don't totally subscribe to it's only a parents responsibility. I think we all have responsibility to do no harm to children. There are a wide range material and activities that are not appropriate for children and require more than a parental responsibility to control i.e. it takes librains, teachers, babysitters, neighbors, judges etc to abide by laws and often go further by use of judgement based on individual values. Seems like the judgement safest for children is a more conservative approach when the possibility of harm exists. Its a bit comparable to wearing a helmet or a seat belt. The methods to protect children do not need to be a restriction for adults.

Lil Dancer,


Here you are on totv.


NOW WOULD BE A GREAT TIME FOR YOU TO APOLOGIZE TO ME FOR THE LIES YOU POSTED ABOUT ME.

PLEASE HAVE THE MORAL FORTITUDE TO ADMIT YOUR LIES AND SAY YOU ARE SORRY.
ON THIS FORUM IN PUBLIC WHERE YOU SLANDERED ME....BENJ

Looks like Wasilla is a suburb of Anchorage, Alaska. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wasilla,_Alaska This is where Palin was Mayor.

I would hope that a public library director in that area would be a little more urbane with her choices of what she has available than someone in a more rural area of Alaska.

I do find this troubling if Palin as a Mayor tried to put pressure on a public librarian in an area where the parents should be more aware of what may be out their which their kids might get a hold of at some time.

Originally Posted by Bernie

Cassie I don't totally subscribe to it's only a parents responsibility. I think we all have responsibility to do no harm to children. There are a wide range material and activities that are not appropriate for children and require more than a parental responsibility to control i.e. it takes librains, teachers, babysitters, neighbors, judges etc to abide by laws and often go further by use of judgement based on individual values. Seems like the judgement safest for children is a more conservative approach when the possibility of harm exists. Its a bit comparable to wearing a helmet or a seat belt. The methods to protect children do not need to be a restriction for adults.

Bernie...while I do agree in a sense that it "takes a village" to raise a child or rather protect them...ultimately it is the parents responsibility. All of those people....teachers, babysitters, neighbors etc, etc....are very important to a child's life....however as a parent....if any of them are inappropriate or just not good for or to my child...then ULTIMATELY...it is MY job to make sure they are good...and appropriate for MY child.

I would not consider this to be onlong the same lines as wearing a seat belt or bike helmet....those are laws! For everyone....not just children. They are put there to protect ALL humans....

A book should not be removed just because one type of person disagrees with it. If it is adult oriented then it should be placed in an adult only section or mature eyes section. Libraries now a days are very high tech and can easily check the age of someone checking out a specific book.

Originally Posted by Bernie

Cassie I don't totally subscribe to it's only a parents responsibility. I think we all have responsibility to do no harm to children. There are a wide range material and activities that are not appropriate for children and require more than a parental responsibility to control i.e. it takes librains, teachers, babysitters, neighbors, judges etc to abide by laws and often go further by use of judgement based on individual values. Seems like the judgement safest for children is a more conservative approach when the possibility of harm exists. Its a bit comparable to wearing a helmet or a seat belt. The methods to protect children do not need to be a restriction for adults.

A voice of reason. Parents have a great deal of responsibility for what their children read, and watch on TV and in movie theatres. But others also have a responsibility, as Bernie pointed out. That is why some movies are designated as not suitable for children.

When I started this thread, I really did want it to be a discussion point and something to watch for those who are interested. It's about a lot more than just an election. And like I said, considering the rancor in the ranks over censorship this past week, right here on TOTV, I really did think it was well worth posting, for many, many, oh so many reasons.

Tal knows a lot about libraries. I think he may have an MLS. Not sure. But I think so.

The books in Public Libraries are selected by librarians with masters degrees. The Master of Library Science degree is now more often known as the MLIS. Master of Library and Information Science. With so much computer based info now, the curriculum has changed for those graduate programs.

And you really need to know that overall, librarians self-censor. They want to keep their jobs. They know the lay of the land for their libraries. Librarians who know what they are doing have a written selection policy in place. And librarians who know what they are doing have in place a protocol to follow if a book is demanded banned. People cannot just walk into a Public Library and demand books be removed.

The Public Library is a Bastion of Freedom.

And most of your Public Librarians have a major clue, especially if they are doing book selection. You hire them for what they know how to do. You hire good ones and you let them do their jobs.

I am waiting to see if Palin, elected under a democracy, thought she had the right, due to her position, to ban books.

I have to finish cleaning my house for company coming tonight. (I hope we don't talk about politics.) But anyway, I can't look this up right now. Really must go make a path for company. But I am hoping somebody will post it here. (Uh oh, sorry Tal, I just sounded like I was trying to give you homework or something. )

You know, there is a saying, "If you absolutely have to know, ask a librarian." Does not mean they know everything. Just means they know where to find it.

I will look this up another day if nobody finds it first and posts it. I really need to go clean. But here is what I hope to have posted here:

There are lists out there somewhere. The lists of books that have actually been banned in some places. If you have never seen these lists,you might be surprised.

One I remember seeing on a list, maybe it was for a children's library, was "The American Heritage Dictionary." I think that was the one. It might have had dirty words in it. Maybe even a picture or two. You know, human body stuff maybe.

Another one that you grandmas who read to the kids will appreciate is one of Shel Siverstein's funny poetry books. It might have been "Where the Sidewalk Ends." It's the one with the poem "Who Ate the Baby" laughing about that old sibling rivalry thing when the new baby comes home. Well, those who wanted it banned said that it promoted cannibalism.

So this thing is indeed a slippery slope. A slippery, slippery slope.

Public librarians are a lot like teachers. Hire good smart ones with common sense and let them do their jobs. And Freedom will continue its reign.

I sure hope that list of books shows up here. And I sure hope you will talk about it. And enjoy the discussion. I would love to stay here with you and talk all day about books and freedom and all that good American stuff. But I can't right now. But true to my last name, I will "be back."

Boomer, sounding a little like Marian today

The list of books that I was given came from the minutes of the Wasilla Library Board. What I found "amusing" was that a number of them are included in elementary, middle school, and high school curriculums across the United States. That list includes A Wrinkle in Time by Madeleine L'Engle, Huckleberry Finn by Mark Twain, I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings by Maya Angelou, The Catcher in the Rye by J.D. Salinger, and To Kill a Mockingbird by Harper Lee.

Originally Posted by Boomer BeBack

When I started this thread, I really did want it to be a discussion point and something to watch for those who are interested. It's about a lot more than just an election. And like I said, considering the rancor in the ranks over censorship this past week, right here on TOTV, I really did think it was well worth posting, for many, many, oh so many reasons.

Tal knows a lot about libraries. I think he may have an MLS. Not sure. But I think so.

The books in Public Libraries are selected by librarians with masters degrees. The Master of Library Science degree is now more often known as the MLIS. Master of Library and Information Science. With so much computer based info now, the curriculum has changed for those graduate programs.

And you really need to know that overall, librarians self-censor. They want to keep their jobs. They know the lay of the land for their libraries. Librarians who know what they are doing have a written selection policy in place. And librarians who know what they are doing have in place a protocol to follow if a book is demanded banned. People cannot just walk into a Public Library and demand books be removed.

The Public Library is a Bastion of Freedom.

And most of your Public Librarians have a major clue, especially if they are doing book selection. You hire them for what they know how to do. You hire good ones and you let them do their jobs.

I am waiting to see if Palin, elected under a democracy, thought she had the right, due to her position, to ban books.

I have to finish cleaning my house for company coming tonight. (I hope we don't talk about politics.) But anyway, I can't look this up right now. Really must go make a path for comapny. But I am hoping somebody will post it here. (Uh oh, sorry Tal, I just sounded like I was trying to give you homework or something. )

You know, there is a saying, "If you absolutely have to know, ask a librarian." Does not mean they know everything. Just means they know where to find it.

I will look this up another day if nobody finds it first and posts it. I really need to go clean. But here is what I hope to have posted here:

There are lists out there somewhere. The lists of books that have actually been banned in some places. If you have never seen these lists,you might be surprised.

One I remember seeing on a list, maybe it was for a children's library, was "The American Heritage Dictionary." I think that was the one. It might have had dirty words in it. Maybe even a picture or two. You know, human body stuff maybe.

Another one that you grandmas who read to the kids will appreciate is one of Shel Siverstein's funny poetry books. It might have been "Where the Sidewalk Ends." It's the one with the poem "Who Ate the Baby" laughing about that old sibling rivalry thing when the new baby comes home. Well, those who wanted it banned said that it promoted cannibalism.

So this thing is indeed a slippery slope. A slippery, slippery slope.

Public librarians are a lot like teachers. Hire good smart ones with common sense and let them do their jobs. And Freedom will continue its reign.

I sure hope that list of books shows up here. And I sure hope you will talk about it. And enjoy the discussion. I would love to stay here with you and talk all day about books and freedom and all that good American stuff. But I can't right now. But true to my last name, I will "be back."

Boomer, sounding a little like Marian today

This contains some of the books banned from libraries. http://title.forbiddenlibrary.com/

Boomer you are right that I have a M.L.S. which is a Masters of Librarianship and Information Management. It is from University of Denver. Same University that Condoleezza Rice received two of her degrees from. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condoleezza_Rice

Tal,

Thank you. That is one heckuva list. I knew you would know where to find it.

Now, could somebody please come here and help me clean my house? There is company 'round the bend.

Thanks again, Tal.

I gotta get away from this screen. Iwas back here just to dust it. Yeah, that's it.

Boomer

Originally Posted by barefoot at last

A voice of reason. Parents have a great deal of responsibility for what their children read, and watch on TV and in movie theatres. But others also have a responsibility, as Bernie pointed out. That is why some movies are designated as not suitable for children.

I am not disagreeing about certain books not being suitable for children! I am just saying they shouldn't be bained from a library....they should be moved to a seperate area and should be monitored as to who is borrowing them...at least their age...

Tal, I sat on the Souderton Area School Board during the entire "The Color Purple" debacle mentioned in your link. We did not ban the book "The Color Purple". This book was on a required reading list for our 10th graders. We had it removed from the required reading list but not banned from the high school library.
The SASD was a predominantly white school district in 1992. For many of our students, this book would have been their first look into the lives of African American families. I personally felt the book was a poor representation of the African American community as a whole. Kids at that age are so terribly impressionable. It dealt with incest and brutality. IMHO "To Kill A Mockingbird" was a better choice. I enjoined the NAACP to help me in my quest to remove the book from the sophomore required reading list. This book was not banned from our school library. It was simply replaced on the required reading list but remained as an optional selection .
That book was not banned. Your article is incorrect regarding SASD and The Color Purple.