[Ptmckiou]

Two choices:

1. Possibly contract a deadly disease, or live with the possibility of life long organ damage from the disease, or be an unknown carrier and give it to others which are then harmed and perpetuating the chance of more variants being created, or...
2. Get vaccinated and help eliminate the food for the virus (unvaccinated people) with zero chance of getting sick enough to land in the hospital, and little chance of being able to be a carrier...

Seems like a no brainer on the choice. I’ll take the chance and go with science any day!

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by oneclickplus

Well, let me augment the statement then:

Can't trust Big Pharma or the government or scientists drawing paychecks from either of them.

People who work for supplement manufacturers, alt-med devices, the Silva-Sol folks, and "positive thought healing" practitioners, also draw paychecks. And they don't even need valid, useful, products, and they don't have to prove they actually DO anything. Alt-med is a thriving, hugely profit-making category that has NO science, NO proof, NO testing, NO evidence, and people line up with cash in hand to pay for it.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

I'll toss another wrench in the "the deaths weren't covid" propaganda:

MOST covid-related deaths, were the result of the pneumonia that is caused by the virus. So MOST of these people died from complications of pneumonia. The virus itself didn't directly cause their death. It DID, however, directly cause the pneumonia, which in turn caused the death.

Anyone who already had a lung illness, EVEN IF THEY WOULD HAVE OTHERWISE LIVED ANOTHER 20 YEARS - was at super-high risk of death and - many of those people did die, once they caught the pneumonia that Covid helped create in their lungs.

The same goes for heart illnesses. Diseased hearts, diseased arteries, which - with medication, nutritional support and appropriate excercise/physical therapy, could delay death for decades, were suddenly stopped - due to the pneumonia caused by the Covid.

So no - Covid was definitely NOT the direct cause of many (maybe even most) of these deaths. But it was the direct cause of the pneumonia that rendered the body incapable of continuing to live.

[kcwhel]

Believe and do what you will. When enough vaccine has been made available so that all who want to be vaccinated have done so. Then stop all the pandemic panic and open things up completely with no masks, distancing and the other preventive measures and let Darwin's law prevail. Hospitals will not be overloaded and the data will supports the facts as they unfold.

[roscoguy]

Originally Posted by oneclickplus

...With a 99.97% chance of NOT DYING from COVID, I personally judge the risk of the shot (not a vaccine) to be higher than just waiting my turn to be exposed to the virus.

Where did this figure come from? According to the CDC Covid Data Tracker (CDC COVID Data Tracker) and covidusa.net (United States COVID-19 Statistics: 31,085,251 Cases / 561,074 Deaths / 363,825,123 Tests / Avg cases/day 68,121 declined 25.1% from 14 days ago Avg deaths/day 2,034 declined 17.22% from 14 days ago (Updated Apr 10, 2021 @ 11:10am)), there have been about 31,000,000 total Covid cases in the U.S. and around 560,000 related deaths. I'm not a math major but that seems to translate to approximately 1.8% NOT .03%. Also, that rate is only those who have actually died after contracting Covid, it doesn't say anything about the number who spent weeks or even months in the hospital on ventilators, needed lung transplants or suffered other long-term ailments or side-effects from the infection.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by merrymini

Some people posting here “believe the science.” In fact, the science frequently is inconclusive or directly opposed to other science, much like economists and climate control “geniuses.” You choose to believe you did the right thing by taking inoculations and falsely conclude that people who do not will die or are “wrong” not to take or are antivaxxers. In fact, many people want to consider their options before rolling with the masses. The death number of 2019 and 2020 are about 50,000 different (50,000 more deaths in 2020) not 500,000 different, indicating 500,000 MORE people did NOT DIE OF THE CHINESE VIRUS. The virus has been a useful political, control and money tool and continues to be so since big pharm is now coming out with a booster shot. Get in line.

99% of America believes that CV deaths number 560,531 deaths, as of today. I don't see the point of anyone disputing that? What do they expect to gain? When someone's opinion is so much out of step, maybe, just maybe, they should re-think their ideas. Just trying to help.

[Tmarkwald]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

I'll toss another wrench in the "the deaths weren't covid" propaganda:

MOST covid-related deaths, were the result of the pneumonia that is caused by the virus. So MOST of these people died from complications of pneumonia. The virus itself didn't directly cause their death. It DID, however, directly cause the pneumonia, which in turn caused the death.

Anyone who already had a lung illness, EVEN IF THEY WOULD HAVE OTHERWISE LIVED ANOTHER 20 YEARS - was at super-high risk of death and - many of those people did die, once they caught the pneumonia that Covid helped create in their lungs.

The same goes for heart illnesses. Diseased hearts, diseased arteries, which - with medication, nutritional support and appropriate excercise/physical therapy, could delay death for decades, were suddenly stopped - due to the pneumonia caused by the Covid.

So no - Covid was definitely NOT the direct cause of many (maybe even most) of these deaths. But it was the direct cause of the pneumonia that rendered the body incapable of continuing to live.

Yep, I would agree with that - similar in some ways to AIDS - it's the weakened immune system that can no longer fight off the infection.

[tuccillo]

It doesn’t matter what is on the death certificates. There were 500K additional deaths, over what would normally be expected, in the last year. Either directly or indirectly, they were caused by the coronavirus. I expect that we will see a decrease in deaths for the next few years as the coronavirus killed off a bunch of people before their time.

Originally Posted by Larchap49

The trouble is I don't believe the numbers because almost everybody that died in 2020 was blamed on covid. The news has been full of families that had to take legal action on cause of death to collect insurance. Hospitals are rewarded monetarily for covid deaths but not any other cause. In my opinion and it's only my opinion I would bet only 50 to 60 percent were strictly from covid (I think that is being generous) the rest had serious other health issues or were so old that any minor illness would have killed them, or both. Just my opinion and as an American who hasn't had my free speech taken away yet I choose to express it.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by oneclickplus

Another statement that many people accept as fact but in no way proven. Used only to coerce those who refuse to follow the crowd.

Time will prove which group made the correct choice the anti-vaxxers or those that got their shots. Until then society hangs on a delicate balance. Michigan is one giant hotspot. The medical experts around the country are WORRIED. If there are too many anti-vaxxers, then the US will NEVER reach herd immunity and CV cases will NEVER fall to zero. Right now around 50% of the people in Mississippi say that they will NOT get vaccinated. What happens under that scenario? New CV variants every 6 months and booster shots for life. And society going around wearing masks for the next 20 years? And what if like France and Europe - the US must go back to lockdowns? What if the economy of the US falls apart. Then China and Russia will keep getting more aggressive internationally. All of that because a small group of anti-vaxxers wanted to express their "rugged spirit" and individuality - and they said screw society and "who needs government"?

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by oneclickplus

Oh - you mean like how the media and mainstream pooh pooh'd the use of Hydroxychloriquine after the word passed Trump's lips? Proven effective when used VERY early (link Zinc), it was rejected because of a topic we're not allowed to mention in this forum without getting our asses reamed. But, it's true. You could go google now and find all kinds of citations about how HCQ is not effective for COVID early on and that is all the result of Mr. Trump citing the claims of it working by medical professionals that were on the ground treating patients. When have you ever seen a drug that has been around for decades ... is still available ... is declared ineffective for a particular disease (COVID) ... and then banned for that purpose? I mean, aspirin won't cure leukemia but no one is banning its use for that. HCQ was banned (and many people died) so Trump wouldn't look good.

Both the former President and Gov. DeSantis have taken the CV vaccines.

[Pat2015]

Originally Posted by Tmarkwald

Studies and clinical trials on RNA vaccines for other viruses – and even cancers – have been going on for a decade.

Nobody getting the Moderna or Pfizer vaccine is a test subject of any kind. These are not experimental vaccines in any way. And they do not modify your dna.

Three ways RNA is being used in the next generation of medical treatment

Disagree, as we are part of a clinical study with getting vaccines that have not been FDA approved and the studies are continuing on with data being obtained on all of us as to the efficiency of the vaccines, potential of reinfection, side effects, and ability to transmit the virus.

[coffeebean]

Originally Posted by tvbound

The sad part is, that if one certain person were to publicly say "I received the Covid vaccine and you should too," there would be millions of current anti-vaxxers - who would instantly do a 180.

Trump was interviewed by Maria Bartiromo and (I heard it myself) he confirmed that he and Melania were both vaccinated. They just did not do it publicly which is an absolute shame. I cannot express my disappointment in both of them enough for being vaccinated secretly. That was a bad decision on his part not to have the cameras capture the vaccination event. Same goes for our governor. I'm very disappointed in him too.

[Boffin]

Not learning much the subject: mRNA. Too much discussion about other vaccine related subjects.

[Boffin]

This thread is titled: The real truth about messenger RNA. As opposed to what, The fictitious truth about messenger RNA?

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by Boffin

This thread is titled: The real truth about messenger RNA. As opposed to what, The fictitious truth about messenger RNA?

Yes, as opposed to the fiction that some are attempting to spread.