[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by mainelovr

Though not all noncitizens in this country are working within legal channels -- i.e., paying federal and/or state tax -- quite a few are. In 2010, according to data highlighted by AARP, undocumented immigrants' wage income netted Social Security approximately $12 billion in payroll taxes. Yet, the program's rules are crystal clear: noncitizens aren't able to receive Social Security benefits. Thus, numerous undocumented immigrants are likely paying into a Social Security program that'll never supply them with a red cent in benefits.
The Biggest Social Security Lies You've Believed | The Motley Fool

I have no problem with that.

[LoisR]

Originally Posted by Rwirish

This is a stupid decision by the President regardless of party affiliation.

Best response yet. My compliments. Follow up with your November vote.

[jklfairwin]

Social Security is a very complicated issue and often provokes very heated views. The program was set up outside the regular budget with its own "trust fund" and its own revenue stream from a separate payroll tax to guard it as much as possible from the future whims of Congress. It is not a true insurance program in that it is actually the contributions of today's workers who are paying the benefits to today's retirees; they in turn will be receiving benefits paid for by tomorrows workers. It is probably the most carefully thought out, successful, and useful program ever created in the US. There are many reasonable solutions to the future minor problems of SS such as simply including all income in the payroll tax and raising or eliminating the taxable income cutoff.

If the payroll tax is eliminated, the only other source of revenue to pay benefits is the general fund and this puts the whole program subject to the whims of any new Congress and removes all stability from the program. Far better and safer to simply send out checks to everyone from the general fund as has already been done and is now being considered for extension or repeat.

[vermonster]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

Allowing people to opt out would end Social Security. Do the math. The system is designed so that high income people get ripped off for the benefit of low income people. So, if you can opt out, the high income people would opt out, and the system would collapse. Social Security is a cleverly designed welfare program.

Actually it is quite the opposite. The social security part of the payroll tax is capped at an income level somewhere north of $100k; the part that covers medicare is not (although it was previously). Thus the higher your income is above the cap, the lower your effective rate of social security tax. This is known as a regressive tax, which means that the rate decreases as incomes rise. The other types of tax (in regard to their impact) are flat rate (medicare, e.g.) and progressive (the federal income tax, although it has become much less progressive than it used to be). That is why Warren Buffet decries that the effective tax rate (including all income and payroll taxes) on his income is lower that of his secretary.

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by vermonster

Actually it is quite the opposite. The social security part of the payroll tax is capped at an income level somewhere north of $100k; the part that covers medicare is not (although it was previously). Thus the higher your income is above the cap, the lower your effective rate of social security tax. This is known as a regressive tax, which means that the rate decreases as incomes rise. The other types of tax (in regard to their impact) are flat rate (medicare, e.g.) and progressive (the federal income tax, although it has become much less progressive than it used to be). That is why Warren Buffet decries that the effective tax rate (including all income and payroll taxes) on his income is lower that of his secretary.

You are referring to the taxes paid on income while working. That has very little to do with the monthly Social Security income that a retiree receives when they retire. A low income worker can receive as much as 90 percent of their pre-retirement income as a SS retirement income benefit. But, a high income person will only receive about 15 or 20 percent of their pre-retirement income as a retirement benefit.

Also, both low income and high income workers will receive the exact same Medicare benefit, even though the high income worker paid a lot more in Medicare taxes while working. And, after you turn 65, you have to pay a monthly premium for Medicare Part B. But, that premium is based in your income. Low income people pay about $140 per month, but high income people can pay about $400 per month for the same health insurance benefit.

So, high income workers pay more SS and Medicare taxes while working, pay a higher Medicare premium when they retire, and receive substantially less money, on a pro-rated basis, in benefits than low income workers. That is just the way math works.

[Neils]

Just print more money to fill the tank. No different that the $1,200 payments. Money from nothing.

[jmcote]

Originally Posted by Samfl

The president made it clear he will not do anything that will hurt SS. You must be getting your info from the MSM

You believe that I know of some prime real estate for sale, in the Everglades. 😂

[pcacace]

The alternative funding will be the general fund. Trump said this in an article. Don’t worry about it. Your SS will be there for you. It might be different for the next generation.

[Stu from NYC]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

You are referring to the taxes paid on income while working. That has very little to do with the monthly Social Security income that a retiree receives when they retire. A low income worker can receive as much as 90 percent of their pre-retirement income as a SS retirement income benefit. But, a high income person will only receive about 15 or 20 percent of their pre-retirement income as a retirement benefit.

Also, both low income and high income workers will receive the exact same Medicare benefit, even though the high income worker paid a lot more in Medicare taxes while working. And, after you turn 65, you have to pay a monthly premium for Medicare Part B. But, that premium is based in your income. Low income people pay about $140 per month, but high income people can pay about $400 per month for the same health insurance benefit.

So, high income workers pay more SS and Medicare taxes while working, pay a higher Medicare premium when they retire, and receive substantially less money, on a pro-rated basis, in benefits than low income workers. That is just the way math works.

It is even worse if still working after collecting SS. Get to pay into SS and medicare while paying for part B and a supplemental policy.

One thing I think you are overlooking. Higher income folks pay into SS up until a certain salary and than it stops. So if someone is making say $ 300,000 a year they only pay into SS for the first 150,000 or so in salary. (do not remember the cutoff as it changes year by year and no long in that category.

[ficoguy]

I think with the Corona Virus the actuaries need to look at the mortality rates and recalculate the insurance benefits. If you believe the media 200,000 beneficiaries of social security will be off the rolls very soon.....

[retiredguy123]

Originally Posted by Stu from NYC

It is even worse if still working after collecting SS. Get to pay into SS and medicare while paying for part B and a supplemental policy.

One thing I think you are overlooking. Higher income folks pay into SS up until a certain salary and than it stops. So if someone is making say $ 300,000 a year they only pay into SS for the first 150,000 or so in salary. (do not remember the cutoff as it changes year by year and no long in that category.

Correct. The maximum salary you need to pay the Social Security tax on is $137,700. But, there is no income limit on the 1.45 percent Medicare tax. If you make the income maximum, and collect your benefit at age 62, you will only receive about 20 percent of that income in a SS retirement benefit. However, my point is that those in the lowest income bracket can receive about 90 percent of their pre-retirement income in SS retirement benefits. I am not saying it is wrong, but SS retirement benefits are greatly skewed in favor of low income workers. And the Medicare benefit is even more skewed.

[jimjamuser]

Originally Posted by ficoguy

I think with the Corona Virus the actuaries need to look at the mortality rates and recalculate the insurance benefits. If you believe the media 200,000 beneficiaries of social security will be off the rolls very soon.....

It is NOT true that ONLY older people die of CV. So plenty of young people will NOT be paying into the SS system