Why I will NOT be vaccinated ( and maybe you shouldn't too)

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  #211  
Old 02-22-2021, 11:54 AM
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Dr Winston O Boogie jr Dr Winston O Boogie jr is offline
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Originally Posted by graciegirl View Post
To whom do you speak??? I am tired of these kinds of jabs. Everyone I know understands climate change....what they disagree about is spending money on things that don't work to change it. I am disappointed that people are not getting vaccinated against Covid-19. It does kill people. I know of three personally.

I wonder at people discussing 80 years old's with such a Cavalier attitude. I don't understand why someone would think that their life was not precious to them and their children at fifty or at 80.

I am overwhelmed sometimes and the harshness and extremely insensitive posts on this forum sometimes.

P.S. I still don't know exactly the point Boomer was trying to make. Was it this one???
The interesting thing about climate change is that while 90% of all scientists agree that it is happening they don't all agree on how serious it it.

Al Gore used to say, "Our planet has a fever". When some people get a fever it's a sign of a very serious condition. For other's it's a mild cold or other condition that will be gone in short order.

The devil is in the details. 90% of all scientists do not agree on the long term effects of climate change or whether it is permanent or things will turn around in 100 years.

We've been hearing about the end of the world because of climate change for decades. In 1983 a paper was published saying that the world would end by the year 2000 as we would all be burned to a crisp. Since that didn't happen, many climate change alarmists like Al Gore have predicted things such as all of the polar ice melting and the oceans over flowing. These things were predicted to have happened by now. In fact, none of the predictions of doom have come true.

So does the planet have a mild cold or does it have a serious life threatening condition? Since none of the predictions have come true, I'm betting on the latter and so are a lot of scientists.
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  #212  
Old 02-22-2021, 03:42 PM
Robbie0723 Robbie0723 is offline
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Originally Posted by Two Bills View Post
Article on todays BBC site regarding early results of those who have been vaccinated.

Covid vaccines - '''spectacular''' impact on serious illness - BBC News
Similar results from Israel

Israel eases restrictions following vaccine success - BBC News

Israel eases restrictions following vaccine success

Israel is easing lockdown restrictions as studies there reveal the Pfizer vaccine is 95.8% effective in preventing hospitalisations and death.
From Sunday, shops, libraries and museums can open but social distancing and masks are still required.

The health ministry says it is the first stage of returning to normal life.
Israel has the highest vaccination rate in the world. More than 49% of people have received at least one dose.

The country entered its third lockdown on 27 December after a resurgence of the virus.
Under the easing measures, people are now able to enter shopping malls and tourist attractions such as zoos.

A number of other facilities are now able to reopen including gyms, hotels and synagogues. However they require a "green passport", a certificate that can only be obtained once you have been vaccinated. A small number of people who have recovered from the virus and are not currently eligible for the vaccine are also able to obtain the certificate.

The passport, which is contained in an app, is issued by the health ministry and will be valid for six months, one week after the second dose.
Crowds are now allowed back at concerts and sporting events have reopened at 75% capacity but they have a cap of no more than 300 people inside and 500 outside.
Despite the easing of restrictions, Israel's airport will remain closed for another two weeks.

On Saturday, the health ministry said studies revealed the risk of illness from the virus has dropped 95.8% among people who have had both doses of the Pfizer vaccine.
It also found that the vaccine was 98% effective in preventing fever or breathing problems.

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says he expects 95% of Israelis over 50 to be vaccinated over the next two weeks.

Earlier this week, the Gaza Strip received its first doses of the vaccine after Israel approved the transfer through its border. The shipment included 2,000 doses of Russia's Sputnik V vaccine which will be used on patients who have had organ transplants and those with kidney failure, an official told Reuters news agency.

It comes as the Palestinian Health Ministry struck a deal with Israel's Health Ministry to vaccinate 100,000 Palestinians who work in the country.
  #213  
Old 02-22-2021, 11:51 PM
EdFNJ EdFNJ is offline
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Originally Posted by Dr Winston O Boogie jr View Post
When virtually every doctor in the world tells me that I should get vaccinated I tend to believe them. As opposed to a few outliers who might happen to be retired nurses.
WOW! That was the perfect answer! Just aAdd retired EMT's, professional plumbers and hairdressers to that.
  #214  
Old 02-25-2021, 10:29 AM
jeblam jeblam is offline
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David Dallas, RN: Read today's DAILY SUN (Thursday, Feb. 25). The reasons you state as to why you won't get the vaccine are based largely on misinformation and conspiracy theories. According to the experts (of which you are obviously not one!) you CAN endanger others by not wearing a mask even if vaccinated. However, the most important point is this: By not being vaccinated, you die, not me. The nearly 50 million vaccines administered to date have proven to be100% effective in preventing death from Covid.
  #215  
Old 02-25-2021, 12:39 PM
Lindsyburnsy Lindsyburnsy is offline
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I wonder how the family of the 500,000+ dead Americans' family members and the thousands currently in the hospital with COVID and those with long lasting affects of the disease, feel about your statement. Most or all of your statements are not based on research, science or facts. Misinformation is not at all helpful. I didn't see Virologist in your resume.

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Originally Posted by dhdallas View Post
Myself, my family, my neighbors, and millions of others have already had COVID and are actively (or sometimes called naturally) immune. A person who is now immune cannot get or give the disease. The COVID virus is NOT one of those diseases in which an immune person can be a carrier. Therefore we do not need to get vaccinated or wear a mask. Even if I did not previously have had COVID I would still refuse a vaccine for the reasons that follow.

Many people will argue that active or natural immunity is different from vaccinated immunity. Here is what the CDC says; “Active immunity results when exposure to a disease organism triggers the immune system to produce antibodies to that disease. Exposure to the disease organism can occur through infection with the actual disease (resulting in natural immunity), or introduction of a killed or weakened form of the disease organism through vaccination (vaccine-induced immunity). Either way, if an immune person comes into contact with that disease in the future, their immune system will recognize it and immediately produce the antibodies needed to fight it.”

The WHO (World Health Organization) had this to say. “Vaccines train our immune systems to create proteins that fight disease, known as ‘antibodies’, just as would happen when we are exposed to a disease . Even people without symptoms develop an immune response.”

Who else should consider abstaining from the vaccination? “People with underlying health conditions that weaken their immune systems (such as cancer or HIV) or who have severe allergies to some vaccine components may not be able to get vaccinated.” - WHO

“Vaccines can cause anaphylaxis and other dangerous life-threatening side effects.” - NIH (National Institute of Health)

Example: “The United States stopped giving mandatory smallpox vaccinations 30 years ago. Some people die from it; and others have serious reactions, some permanent. Scientists say it's the most dangerous vaccine known to man.” - CBS News, 60 Minutes

These new COVID vaccines containing genetic instructions were rushed into use with extremely short trial periods. According to the IFPMA, the development of novel vaccines is a long endeavor. “It takes usually between 10 to 15 years to develop a novel vaccine, as well as establishing its quality, safety and efficacy.” states the International Federation of Pharmaceutical Manufacturers & Associations.

The NIH, CDC, Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority (BARDA), and the Department of Defense (DoD) combined to find the vaccine and dubbed the project OWS which stands for “Operation Warp Speed”. - Source/NIH’s National Institute of Infectious Diseases.

So bear in mind when you are being told that this vaccine is safe that this is the same government whose EPA said the air quality at the 9/11 site was safe for the cleanup workers, the DoD who had no qualms conducting LSD experiments on unsuspecting soldiers and said there was no cancer link to Agent Orange, and for-profit drug companies who market drugs in third world countries even though the same drugs have been banned in the U.S. and Europe due to harmful side effects. From 08/30/2017 to 02/03/2021 327 drugs previously approved by the FDA as safe & effective were recalled. This information was obtained from the FDA’s official website.

My final concern is that the COVID vaccines utilize genetic engineering. Messenger RNA vaccines (mRNA) vaccines have strands of genetic material called mRNA - source/CDC

I am NOT an “anti-vaxxer” nor a conspiracy theorist. I have had the DPT, pneumococcal polysaccharide vaccine, HBV, and the zoster vaccine. I am susceptible and was routinely exposed to these diseases at my workplace. These vaccines have a proven record and were not rushed into production.

For those who have NOT already had a positive COVID test, I would carefully weigh the pros & cons of a new, relatively untested vaccine developed at “warp speed” (their words not mine) that uses genetic engineering against a virus that is just a nuisance for most people. Before you jump on me for stating it is “just a nuisance for most people” here is another direct quote from the WHO; “Most people infected with the COVID-19 virus will experience mild to moderate respiratory illness and recover without requiring special treatment.” COVID is not on a plane with Ebola, the Plague, Cholera, Malaria, or Yellow Fever. Not even close!

Unfortunately I have found that logical arguments backed by proven science (not “may happen” or “might not be”) fall on deaf ears. It is similar to having an argument over religion. The true believers have blind faith and no person will ever sway their belief no matter how sound the opposing view.

My previously published views on COVID have stirred such animosity that people have gone so far as to wish me “homeless” and that my children “die of cancer”. I have also been called a “quack”, a “know-it-all”, “part of the problem”, a “disgrace”, “brainwashed by Tr_ _p” (of course) and the list goes on and on.

I refuse to be bullied into silence when I see so many people who have been paralyzed with irrational fear and making decisions about their health based on largely one-sided views without fully examining all sides of the issue. Human beings are capable of independent thought and reason. We are not sheep or lemmings.

I am a retired RN, EMT-Paramedic with an ASN degree graduating summa cum laude, a member of 2 national honor societies, with past American Heart Association certifications in Advanced Cardiac Life Support and Pediatric Advanced Life Support. I also am a certified coroner after receiving my training at the Pennsylvania State Police Academy and served as the Chief Deputy Coroner for a county in Pennsylvania. I worked during the onset of AIDS/HIV, H1N1, MRSA & Necrotizing Fasciitis (flesh eating bacteria) and never have I seen such a level of misinformation and a bombardment of articles that focus on rare atypical cases and the hypothetical.

I only include this professional background information to distinguish myself from authors with absolutely no background in healthcare whatsoever and who state unproven theories often with no scientific support. I do not claim to be an expert, just experienced. As the actor Walter Brennan was often quoted from an old television show, The Guns of Will Sonnett; “No brag, just fact".

- David H. Dallas, RN-ASN, EMT-P, retired
  #216  
Old 02-25-2021, 12:48 PM
Tmarkwald Tmarkwald is offline
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Originally Posted by billethkid View Post
Let us all hope and pray the same positive results here at home.

Unfortunately I do not think the improving results will be reported in the USA.

It just seems like there is a need for many special interest groups to keep the USA population on it's knees, afraid and dependent.

I wonder why there are not more comments on the article/results?
217 Million Vaccinated - ZERO deaths due to the vaccine!

Mass 'real world' study confirms Pfizer vaccine's efficacy
  #217  
Old 02-25-2021, 12:56 PM
Tbrazie Tbrazie is online now
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I agree. So far only 5 cases of 38 Million are confirmed reinfection, at least one was a different strain. I am also a scientist and my son is an MD. I have had Covid and am not getting the vaccine.
  #218  
Old 02-25-2021, 01:02 PM
Tmarkwald Tmarkwald is offline
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When we get to the point where the only people being infected and dying from Covid are those who refuse to get the vaccine, it is time to take off the mask.

Like anything else, if you want to roll the dice and take a chance, that's your prerogative, but it should not affect the well being of others.

Survival of the fittest... you can lead a horse to water... etc... People make conscience decisions to forgo the science and place themselves in harm's way all the time... Those people are responsible for their actions, not the rest of us.
  #219  
Old 02-25-2021, 03:28 PM
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Well, there is a saying, some people are born to dig their own graves.
  #220  
Old 02-25-2021, 04:50 PM
C. C. Rider C. C. Rider is offline
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Just because something doesn't kill you or make you seriously ill within a month or two of exposure to it is no guarantee that it won't do so at some time in the future. The jury is still out on the efficacy and safety of the vaccines.

In the short term, the vaccine seems to be doing very well. However, the same thing could be said about 99.85% of the population of this country with regard to Covid-19.
  #221  
Old 02-25-2021, 05:28 PM
Bill14564 Bill14564 is offline
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Originally Posted by C. C. Rider View Post
Just because something doesn't kill you or make you seriously ill within a month or two of exposure to it is no guarantee that it won't do so at some time in the future. The jury is still out on the efficacy and safety of the vaccines.

In the short term, the vaccine seems to be doing very well. However, the same thing could be said about 99.85% of the population of this country with regard to Covid-19.
I don't have time to show the problem with your 99.85% figure. Maybe later.

I believe we are over four months for the safety and effectiveness of the vaccine. And we now have a sample size, in the US alone, of over 45M. That certainly doesn't mean that no adverse side effect will ever be discovered but I'm not willing to wait until "anytime in the future" to protect myself from this virus - I will be happy to see you step out of line and allow me to move up.
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  #222  
Old 02-25-2021, 08:52 PM
C. C. Rider C. C. Rider is offline
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Originally Posted by Bill14564 View Post
I don't have time to show the problem with your 99.85% figure. Maybe later.

I believe we are over four months for the safety and effectiveness of the vaccine. And we now have a sample size, in the US alone, of over 45M. That certainly doesn't mean that no adverse side effect will ever be discovered but I'm not willing to wait until "anytime in the future" to protect myself from this virus - I will be happy to see you step out of line and allow me to move up.
I haven't even gotten in line for the vaccine yet, so you are welcome to take my place as the guinea pig at any time you wish. Perhaps at some later date when I see how it's worked (or not) on all the test volunteers like you, I may decide to take it... or not.

Another advantage of not being first in line is that with all the variants of the virus going around, it's likely that those later in line will get a vaccine that covers a wider range of variants than those at the front of the line. In which case, you'll need to get in line again for your supplemental shot.
  #223  
Old 02-25-2021, 10:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Neils View Post
If you decide not to get a vaccine, do you know that will allow someone else to get theirs quicker?? They will appreciate your decision.

Covid is not a “mild” virus. It kills.
Yes, it does kill. So does flu , slips in the bath, and systemic infection from a simple cut in the kitchen making dinner. How many people did each year in each state ? How many cancer deaths per year ? Is cigar smoking on the rise of ebbibg, what about baking ? Should candy and baked goods be sold to those with diabetes ? So many questions to ponder. How many died shoveling snow last week, car someone loose consciousness and crash an auto into a golf cart full of grandkids...can you did from a terrorist bomb just watching a parade? Life is rather dangerous and we are all best advised to do what we believe is best for us based on our formal and informal knowledge and experience.
  #224  
Old 02-25-2021, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by C. C. Rider View Post
I haven't even gotten in line for the vaccine yet, so you are welcome to take my place as the guinea pig at any time you wish. Perhaps at some later date when I see how it's worked (or not) on all the test volunteers like you, I may decide to take it... or not.

Another advantage of not being first in line is that with all the variants of the virus going around, it's likely that those later in line will get a vaccine that covers a wider range of variants than those at the front of the line. In which case, you'll need to get in line again for your supplemental shot.
You are absolutely correct in that last paragrapg...very likely.
  #225  
Old 02-25-2021, 10:29 PM
Pairadocs Pairadocs is offline
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Originally Posted by jeblam View Post
David Dallas, RN: Read today's DAILY SUN (Thursday, Feb. 25). The reasons you state as to why you won't get the vaccine are based largely on misinformation and conspiracy theories. According to the experts (of which you are obviously not one!) you CAN endanger others by not wearing a mask even if vaccinated. However, the most important point is this: By not being vaccinated, you die, not me. The nearly 50 million vaccines administered to date have proven to be100% effective in preventing death from Covid.
100% now, didn't realize it had risen to that now...
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