[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by Pugchief

Ya, okay, I didn't express my point with the best wording - nothing to do with reading comprehension.

Bill implied that the Flu vax was, while not 100% effective, was close:



The point I was trying to make was that it is not anywhere close to 100% effective, and that's assuming they even guess right on the strain du jour.

I promise to do better next time.

That may be what you read but that is not what I meant. I meant exact what I wrote: the flu vaccine is not 100% effective. (It looks like on its best days it is 60% effective but I don’t recall if that was preventing the flu or preventing serious illness)

[Pugchief]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

That may be what you read but that is not what I meant. I meant exact what I wrote: the flu vaccine is not 100% effective. (It looks like on its best days it is 60% effective but I don’t recall if that was preventing the flu or preventing serious illness)

Fair enough. I shouldn't be mind reading. Nonetheless, if it is 60% effective at best, wouldn't you agree that's not particularly effective? The MMR vax is supposedly 97% effective after the second dose. That's what I would want from a vaccine. Not <60%, and certainly not whatever the Covid jab gets you.

[blueash]

Originally Posted by Pugchief

After the whole Covid vax scandal, I'm wondering what the retired MDs on here think about the flu shot. Still worth getting or more worthless propaganda?

I don't know what you mean by worthless propaganda as I am not aware of any reputable doctor promoting anything worthless, although there are some you tube doctors pushing quackery... but I digress

The flu vaccine is of some value. It is one of the less effective vaccines available but there are lots of things in medicine of some but not great efficacy. It is a very safe vaccine with many decades of use so the risk to benefit ratio in the general population is good.

There are medical conditions where the benefit is greater such as existing lung disease, COPD, asthma etc. Years ago any egg allergy was a reason not to get the shot, but that is no longer a concern. Now only anaphylaxis is a concern. Just hives? not a problem

Some years there is a lot of circulating influenza, others see much less disease. Obviously in a low risk season, the benefit of the shot is diminished. One other factor in deciding whether to not get vaccinated is unlike many viral illness, there are medications that can be taken to reduce disease severity if begun early in the course of influenza. Now, these medication do have side effects, more than the shot.

To summarize, the chance of you getting sick enough from flu to require a doctor visit is reduced 50% by getting the shot in a year with a good match of circulating virus to vaccine component

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by Pugchief

Fair enough. I shouldn't be mind reading. Nonetheless, if it is 60% effective at best, wouldn't you agree that's not particularly effective? The MMR vax is supposedly 97% effective after the second dose. That's what I would want from a vaccine. Not <60%, and certainly not whatever the Covid jab gets you.

As I mentioned earlier, the Covid vaccine tested 95% effective at preventing serious illness or death in the trials and I haven’t seen any real world data that says otherwise.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Bill is 100% correct. We got sidetracked with COVID and a new type of vaccine that some considered controversial. But every year 35-70,000 Americans die of the flu. Not during COVID, of course, since it all got coded as COVID for $14,000 extra/patient.

The flu shot is a "traditional" vaccine---and except for some intranasal forms is a dead virus, not a live attenuated one. The most likely "side effect" of a flu shot is a sore arm. Period.

As far as RSV goes, when I was practicing it was a disease of young children, possibly a few immunocompromised folks. I never saw a case in and adult in 30+ years. Now that some company invented a vaccine, we are being told that seniors are at risk and should get the shot. From my perspective, the jury is out on that one.

Bottom line, IF I were to give advice, which I don't do, it would be to unequivocally get your flu shot.

When you were practicing, did you not get the memo that virii are able to mutate? I mean, you started 30+ years ago, supposedly. There are all kinds of virus strains now, that didn't exist 30+ years ago, or 20+ years ago, or even 5 years ago. The flu is one of them, and every year, the vaccine is adjusted to cover the newest strains they're able to catch while developing the new vaccine. That's why it isn't a one-and-done vaccine. Because every year, the flu is a little different from the year before.

RSV was only known to affect infants - at first. Now, 30+ years later, it's also known to affect the elderly.

To those who actually don't know, rather than those who insist they do know:

RSV isn't a sickness. It is a virus that CAUSES sickness. You can have RSV and not ever get sick. Or, you can have RSV and die. There's an inbetween as well: you can have RSV and just assume it's a cold, nothing more or less. That is the MOST common experience with RSV no matter what age you are. But some people die. There are more people who die with RSV when they're infants, immuno-compromised people of all ages, and older adults, than any other demographic.

Whether big pharma, the CDC, the American Lung Association, or your local supplement store is telling you this or not, it's just how it is. You don't have to like facts, but them's the facts.

[Pugchief]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

As I mentioned earlier, the Covid vaccine tested 95% effective at preventing serious illness or death in the trials and I haven’t seen any real world data that says otherwise.

I never said it didn't, but it certainly doesn't prevent you from getting Covid.

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by golfing eagles

Maybe you were too busy injecting Clorox

I prefer Heroin, like my Dr "Keef" Richards prescribes... Seems to have worked for him...

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by Keefelane66

It all started with “operation Warp Speed”

And then it was bastardized into "mandates"...

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by gatorbill1

Good to see there is still intelligent people out there. You are 100% correct in what you said. I had all the covid shots and got covid, but I did not die even though I a high risk person.

Except he's NOT correct. Initially, we were told it PREVENTED the disease and that it PREVENTED TRANSMISSION of the disease.

It wasn't until much later that they changed the narrative...

[Arctic Fox]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

I just got my flu shot today at Walgreens. Some will say it is too early, but I always get it when I can.

That's strange?

Reading the above, this thread seems to be about the flu shot.

Yet most of the replies are about the Covid shot.

Why do so many people on TOTV find it so hard to stick to the topic?

If you want to argue the toss on Covid once again, start your own thread on it.

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

As I mentioned earlier, the Covid vaccine tested 95% effective at preventing serious illness or death in the trials and I haven’t seen any real world data that says otherwise.

When that testing was done, the virus had already mutated to a weaker strain (as viruses tend to do)...

Initially, there was minimal testing done before they made their claims...

For example, they initially claimed that the vax stopped transmission by decreasing the viral load in the nasopharynx. Later, they came out and said it did no such thing...

[Michael 61]

What ever happened to civility?

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by JMintzer

When that testing was done, the virus had already mutated to a weaker strain (as viruses tend to do)...

Initially, there was minimal testing done before they made their claims...

For example, they initially claimed that the vax stopped transmission by decreasing the viral load in the nasopharynx. Later, they came out and said it did no such thing...

Who is the "they" that claimed that? I didn't see that in the Pfizer trials report.

[Garywt]

My doctor tells me to get the flu shot so I get the flu shot but he has me wait until November as he says it does no good to get it early. My doctor also told me to get the Covid shots and the first booster so I got them, no questions asked.

[Two Bills]

Originally Posted by Garywt

My doctor tells me to get the flu shot so I get the flu shot but he has me wait until November as he says it does no good to get it early. My doctor also told me to get the Covid shots and the first booster so I got them, no questions asked.

Exactly.
My doctors have got me to my 84th year in reasonable running order.
Why would I, or anyone with a few brain cells still intact, suddenly pass their health care over to a conspiracy faction, or social website?