[APovi]

Originally Posted by Plinker

This is common real estate terminology. Every realtor knows what it means. I agree that the selling realtor must put in time when marketing the same home to a buyer but, as a seller, I would never allow it. The reason is because there is a huge conflict of interest. How can the selling realtor ONLY serve my best interests when negotiating the terms? I have had realtors say they can but when large dollars are at stake, I have my doubts. Under the new law, a realtor would need to sign contracts to represent both the buyer and the seller. Is the realtor going to ask for the seller to cover the buyer’s fee or stand firm and represent only the seller?

-My reading of the settlement says that a Realtor can only represent one party, For example, at an Open House, the Host Realtor is deemed to represent only the seller. They can still sell you the house but you, the buyer, are 'unrepresented'.

[APovi]

Originally Posted by retiredguy123

Open houses are very popular in The Villages. What would prevent a buyer from attending an open house and making a cash offer? That is what I would do, and it would not include a buyer's commission to an agent.

-Obviously an owner/seller has no Realtor, so no commission fees are applicable.
BUT if it's a Realtors open house, then their commission is built into the asking price.

[APovi]

Originally Posted by CoachKandSportsguy

you may not be allowed to do so under the new rules. . . just because you think you can at the moment, you may not be able to in the future without a signed buyers agreement.

its all still in the pre execution / pre reality stage. . which is why I typed, will be interesting to see how this shakes out. .

-The rules for the Realtors Multi List changed on August 5th. Please note that BUYERS AGREEMENTS do not have to include a fee.

[BrianL99]

Originally Posted by APovi

-The rules for the Realtors Multi List changed on August 5th. Please note that BUYERS AGREEMENTS do not have to include a fee.

There it is folks. All you need to know.

[CoachKandSportsguy]

I read the changes, effective Aug 8th as follows:

1) there will be no commission / fee data allowed on the MLS site, not for selling agents, nor buyer agents, nor agreements between buying and selling agents, in any form, such as typed, a link or with a photo.


2) for commission / fees
a) commissions are not set by law and are fully negotiable
b) the commission structure, for both selling agents and buying agents, will be disclosed in a legal written agreement between parties. No assumed fees or undocumented payments splitting.

:
Section 5.1 Required Consumer Disclosure

Disclosure of Compensation: MLS Participants and Subscribers must:

Disclose to prospective sellers and buyers that broker compensation is not set by law and is fully negotiable. This must be included in conspicuous language as part of any listing agreement, buyer written agreement, and pre-closing disclosure documents (if any).
Conspicuously disclose in writing to sellers, and obtain the seller’s authority, for any payments or offer of payment that the listing Participant or seller will make to another broker, agent, or other representative (e.g. real estate attorney) acting for buyers. This disclosure must include the amount or rate of any such payment and be made in writing in advance of any payment or agreement to pay. (Adopted 8/24)

3) A buyer agent commission agreement will be in a written legal agreement.
Section 5.3 Written Buyer Agreement

Unless it is inconsistent with state or federal law or regulation, all MLS Participants working with a buyer must enter into a written agreement with the buyerprior to touring a home. The written agreement must include:

a specific and conspicuous disclosure of the amount or rate of compensation the Participant will receive or how this amount will be determined, to the extent that the Participant will receive compensation from any source.
the amount of compensation in a manner that is objectively ascertainable and not open-ended.
a term that prohibits the Participant from receiving compensation for brokerage services from any source that exceeds the amount or rate agreed to in the agreement with the buyer; and
a conspicuous statement that broker fees and commissions are not set by law and are fully negotiable.
In order to enforce these new mandatory rules, the MLS Committee and Board of Directors have approved the following penalties for violations of the No Compensation on the MLS rules. These penalties will go into effect on August 8, 2024:

1st Violation – Immediate $2000 fine and the verbiage will be removed by MLS Staff
2nd Violation – $3000 fine and the verbiage will be removed by MLS Staff
3rd and Subsequent Violations – $5000 fine, 30-day suspension from the MLS, and the verbiage will be removed by MLS Staff.
Examples of violations that would incur these fines include but are not limited to:

Stating commission in any field of the MLS:
Having something in the photo displaying compensation
Mentioning compensation in a virtual tour video placed on the MLS
Including compensation on a supplement uploaded to the MLS


So the August 8th agreement for the MLS is basically:
No commission data in any form in the MLS site.
All commission fees must be in a written legal agreement, and easily able to be executed (assumed at closing)

And finally, this is where I question about the open house / schedule a showing rules:
Any MLS agent working with a buyer (assumed to be a buyer's agent) must have a written agreement prior to the showing.

So fine, how is this buyer agreement to be stored / validated prior to showing? verbally? uploaded document?
Can the MLS site force a buyer's agent agreement upon anyone scheduling a showing via the MLS site, prior to the showing?

This is what happened to my wife's niece when she went to tour the family home which had been sold to a flipper, and the house was up for sale. The buyer's agent was assigned to her through the web site, and accompanied her to the showing, trying to get her to sign a buyers' agreement . . . (in July)

[BostonTom]

You do not need a buyers agent go to the open house tell the listing agent YOU want to make offer You do not have to pay a buyers agent fee. Realtors trying to put their spin on it to continue to get big commissions. Think when you go into a VLS pre-owned listing open house you make the offer yourself to the agent which I did and they sell way more houses in the Villages that way than any MLS agents. What's the difference walking into MLS open house. NONE. Everything the so called buyer agent have access to you also have it on the internet. The buyers / sellers agent sounds nice but the truth is they work for neither no sales, no commission for them. It's that simple. They only care about the commission. Remember travel agents everyone was utilizing them to book vacations now with the internet they are dinosaurs. You can obviously tell Realtors are posting on these sites trying to put their spin on it to save the commissions.

[BrianL99]

Originally Posted by CoachKandSportsguy

I read the changes, effective Aug 8th as follows:

I think folks are missing basic facts and misunderstand what's really going on here.

These supposed "new laws" are not new laws. They are part of a settlement agreement, with a Trade Organization. There are at least 25 other federal lawsuits involving the same or similar issues. Some of which have been previously settled..

The settlement agreement effects the parties to the agreement, not anyone else. The parties to this particular agreement, are the NAR and their MLS. The "rules" don't effect anyone, unless they're buying or selling a home, using the MLS or the services of a REALTOR®.

There's a very good chance this settlement is going to undermine the MLS system as we know it and things might look very different in a couple of years. There are plenty of other "listing systems" out there. I bet LoopNet is licking their chops right now.

In the short run, this might prove to be a windfall for the VLS system, because they still get to play by their own rules.

Anyone who suggests they know how this is going to play out in the long run or what's going to be required when you try to buy a home next month, is speculating. I talked with the president of a state association of realtors, this morning. They're still unsure of the implications and aren't even close to having a set of documents that comply. if they're not really sure how to comply, I doubt many posters on TOTV know.

[APovi]

Originally Posted by Plinker

..... This law will reduce double dipping by selling agent and reduce seller fees by offering half of the usual 5 - 6 % commission as the buyers are on their own.

Maybe I'm nitpicking but It's not a new 'law'. The NAR was sued and this is their attempt to placate the plaintiffs
Also Listing/Selling commissions have always been 'negotiable. It's just that, in The Villages, sellers (and buyers) seem to think that, if you 'pay less; you get less".

[APovi]

Originally Posted by Snakster66

No one is required to have a buyer's agent. An individual can absolutely walk into a house and make on offer on their own accord.

The whole thing is about buyer's agent compensation. No buyer's agent, no compensation worries.

Agreed.

[APovi]

Originally Posted by frayedends

A lot of misinformation in this post.

Like what?. Everything quoted is from the proposed NAR agreement and the FAQ's.

[APovi]

This topic applies only to Realtors. Members of the National Association of Realtors and our Multi List System.
The Villages sales team are licensed by the state too, but are not members of the NAR

[APovi]

Originally Posted by CoachKandSportsguy

If the seller refuses to pay the buyer's agent, then the buyer has to cough up the 2-3% or whatever the agreement is. If the buyer can't roll that into the mortgage, a buyer will have to save for a 20% down payment and a 3% agent fee. On the Average $450,000, that's an extra $13,000 + out of pocket. That just might change what a buyer can buy, and may reduce the potential buyers who aren't real estate savvy enough to buy it themselves.
Yes, this agreement is about eliminating dual agent roles, as well as compensation for each role. The problem is not the rules, it's always about the implementation with legal agreements and state laws.
I read one real estate agent, who was also a lawyer, mention a suit in progress:
One person bid on a house with a buyer's agent. Didn't get the house, but the buyers agent had them sign a 6 month exclusive agreement in the offer letter. Then the buyer's agent wouldn't release the buyer after the failed bid. . off to court! (and don't ask me for details or suggest that everyone would catch that! I have personal examples of lawyers not signing documents during meetings to sign documents)
Again, all in the implementation and execution of agreements. And dealing with hoomans.

-Thanks for the example. My reason for the posting, is that, as you report, buyers are likely to be ripped off if they sign these new Buyers Broker Agreements and also that there's no need to take that risk. If you go to the Listing Broker, you don't have to. sign or pay. AND you costs of sale (fees/commissions) will be rolled into your mortgage as they always have been. Not so if you pay a Buyers broker.

[APovi]

Originally Posted by Pairadocs

Great reply ! The poster is trying to be helpful I'm sure, but you also bring out that people ARE also responsible for their own protection.

I agree with your comment. Perhaps only a few people need this info. But, it's said that 'knowledge is power" Maybe it is?

[APovi]

Originally Posted by BrianL99

I think folks are missing basic facts and misunderstand what's really going on here.

These supposed "new laws" are not new laws. They are part of a settlement agreement, with a Trade Organization. There are at least 25 other federal lawsuits involving the same or similar issues. Some of which have been previously settled..

The settlement agreement effects the parties to the agreement, not anyone else. The parties to this particular agreement, are the NAR and their MLS. The "rules" don't effect anyone, unless they're buying or selling a home, using the MLS or the services of a REALTOR®.

There's a very good chance this settlement is going to undermine the MLS system as we know it and things might look very different in a couple of years. There are plenty of other "listing systems" out there. I bet LoopNet is licking their chops right now.

In the short run, this might prove to be a windfall for the VLS system, because they still get to play by their own rules.

Anyone who suggests they know how this is going to play out in the long run or what's going to be required when you try to buy a home next month, is speculating. I talked with the president of a state association of realtors, this morning. They're still unsure of the implications and aren't even close to having a set of documents that comply. if they're not really sure how to comply, I doubt many posters on TOTV know.

- It's encouraging when a poster, like this, provides researched facts over speculative opinions. On or about August 17th the presiding judge in the NAR case is expected to accept (or reject) the proposed NAR settlement.
Unfortunately the Realtors have mandated that their members use new forms which includes, what I consider to be terms which threaten buyers, and could cost a seller a sale (because their potential buyer is 'scared off'.

[Bonanza]

Originally Posted by Plinker

Also, the law states that you can attend open houses and ask questions without signing anything. You don’t need an agent to buy if you prefer to DIY.
This law will reduce double dipping by selling agent and reduce seller fees by offering half of the usual 5 - 6 % commission as the buyers are on their own.

There is no "usual 5-6%" in real estate.
To express that is against the Sherman Anti-Trust Act.