[PennBF]

Going back to the original note. There is a book "The Believing Brain" being written by a very respected researcher and as mentioned in prior notes the question is raised regarding the theory that first a person decides what they
believe and then proceed to build support for that belief. . The book is meant to raise some interest in the subject and stimulate the brain to consider the theory. I guess the note was to pass on the question to readers and not to try to get a specific answer nor proposing anyone accept the theory. It is clear that most readers did and do not understand the purpose behind the note and misunderstood it as a means of trying to convince rather than stimulating thought.

[KayakerNC]

Originally Posted by PennBF

Going back to the original note. There is a book "The Believing Brain" being written by a very respected researcher and as mentioned in prior notes the question is raised regarding the theory that first a person decides what they
believe and then proceed to build support for that belief. . The book is meant to raise some interest in the subject and stimulate the brain to consider the theory. I guess the note was to pass on the question to readers and not to try to get a specific answer nor proposing anyone accept the theory. It is clear that most readers did and do not understand the purpose behind the note and misunderstood it as a means of trying to convince rather than stimulating thought.

You seem to be trying to abscond with Sesack1's original thread.

[alwann]

[QUOTE=PennBF;1073732]Just of interest is how many have the same religion as their parents? Using 3 basic categories, Catholic, Protestant, or of the Jew Faith?

Is "Jew faith" a typo on your part? It's Judaism. And there are almost as many varieties of it as there are Chrisitian sects. Debating religion, like politics, is pointless. People believe what they believe and nothing, save for death, can change their minds.

That goes for the non-believers, too.

People with no religious affiliation make up the third-largest global group in a new study of the size of the world's faiths, placing after Christians and Muslims and just before Hindus. Incidentally, Hindus believe there are 330 million gods. Must be damned hard for them to pick a church to join.

[Carpe Diem]

"There is a great book out titled, "The Believing Brain" Author is Michael Shemer. It brings forth the theory that first a person decides what he wants to believe and then goes through the process of proving what he/she already believes."

Nice theory to write a book on. It all boils down to the extent to which an individual is "intellectually honest." We all fall on a different place on that continuum . . . so the theory applies more for some than for others. In other words, you can't put everybody in that box.

[Carpe Diem]

The church one goes to doesn't matter as much as one's relationship with God. A church's primary significance pertains to the extent that it enhances that relationship. Other benefits are nice, but not of any eternal significance.

Also, although there are many churches and many religions . . . and everybody can believe what they want to and have their own truth . . . the fact is, there is only ONE TRUTH (by definition).

[NYGUY]

Originally Posted by PennBF

....It appears most of the readers did not understand the underlying question/theory and wanted to use the question to defend, discuss or pass on religious messages which did not belong in a response as they are not related to the original question.
I was amazed at the unrelated responses and their being inappropriate to the question.

You should not be amazed, posters often only respond to questions they want to be asked, not those that are asked. I don't think it is a matter of reading comprehension, although, maybe in some cases. Maybe they just don't care what the question was, but they do care about their answer. This might be a good subject of another book!!

[PennBF]

This is the last note I will send on this subject. I continue to be amazed as to how many want to argue or be offended by positive thoughts. Is it just because of anger? I am not sure. Regarding the question of "hijacking" the subject. My intent was just the opposite. It was to provide some intellectual thinking as to the considerations for the basis for choices. On that I failed and should withdraw and allow the discussion to proceed by the ones who have and continue to want to have a more specific discussion on religion(s). I agree and subscribe to the individual who said to avoid discussions on Politics and Religion. He/She was certaintly correct. Had I thought I was getting into a "Religious" discussion I
would have honestly avoided that path. I would ask that my input to this grouping be totally disregarded as it will not be a value add to your religious discussions. It was meant to be much more broad and not religious in any way

[chachacha]

PennBF, i believe the original post, not your later question, was what people were responding to, which is as it should be...the original post gave a direct opinion on why anyone should or would choose a church. thus the ensuing replies. as to how our brains coddle us into believing that which we want to believe, that probably has quite a bit of merit in most cases.

[Villager Joyce]

Originally Posted by PennBF

This is the last note I will send on this subject. I continue to be amazed as to how many want to argue or be offended by positive thoughts. Is it just because of anger? I am not sure. Regarding the question of "hijacking" the subject. My intent was just the opposite. It was to provide some intellectual thinking as to the considerations for the basis for choices. On that I failed and should withdraw and allow the discussion to proceed by the ones who have and continue to want to have a more specific discussion on religion(s). I agree and subscribe to the individual who said to avoid discussions on Politics and Religion. He/She was certaintly correct. Had I thought I was getting into a "Religious" discussion I
would have honestly avoided that path. I would ask that my input to this grouping be totally disregarded as it will not be a value add to your religious discussions. It was meant to be much more broad and not religious in any way

///

[Barefoot]

[quote=alwann;1074146]

Originally Posted by PennBF

Just of interest is how many have the same religion as their parents? Using 3 basic categories, Catholic, Protestant, or of the Jew Faith?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Is "Jew faith" a typo on your part? It's Judaism. And there are almost as many varieties of it as there are Chrisitian sects. Debating religion, like politics, is pointless. People believe what they believe and nothing, save for death, can change their minds. That goes for the non-believers, too.

People with no religious affiliation make up the third-largest global group in a new study of the size of the world's faiths, placing after Christians and Muslims and just before Hindus. Incidentally, Hindus believe there are 330 million gods. Must be damned hard for them to pick a church to join.

Alwann - good post.
I have no interest in knowing anyone's religious beliefs. I think it's a very private matter.
I'd like to think that we all try our best to simply follow the Golden Rule.

[manaboutown]

People believe all sorts of things whether they are true or not. For example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modern...arth_societies
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_creation_myths

[HimandMe]

Originally Posted by PennBF

Going back to the original note. There is a book "The Believing Brain" being written by a very respected researcher and as mentioned in prior notes the question is raised regarding the theory that first a person decides what they
believe and then proceed to build support for that belief. . The book is meant to raise some interest in the subject and stimulate the brain to consider the theory. I guess the note was to pass on the question to readers and not to try to get a specific answer nor proposing anyone accept the theory. It is clear that most readers did and do not understand the purpose behind the note and misunderstood it as a means of trying to convince rather than stimulating thought.

I haven't read the book but have some background in adult learning.
I guess my question is whether MOST people decide what they believe or is there much less intent with MOST people? I know that if I find some new idea that shatters my belief on something else, I tend to want to read more about it. Eg. Read several books by the same or recommended authors on the subject and mull that over. I often share the ideas with others in my excitement but then, I might come across another theory that seems more plausible and begin the process again. If I'm closed in a particular area, often I don't notice it until someone points it out. I may balk before I listen. The people who tell me are usually close to me. As the saying goes, "The ones that tell you you have goop on your nose are those who care about you". The rest stay silent.

[NYGUY]

Originally Posted by HimandMe

...."The ones that tell you you have goop on your nose are those who care about you". The rest stay silent.

So true....

[sunnyatlast]

Part of the problem, I think, is that Judeo-Christian belief is based in faith in the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, while skeptics and outright atheists try to disprove God and ridicule faith in Him from a purely intellectual, logical standpoint.

But there are many types of faith we all exercise daily, regardless of being "religious" or not:

From Merriam-Webster:

faith

noun \ˈfāth\

a: strong belief or trust in someone or something

b: belief in the existence of God : strong religious feelings or beliefs

c: a system of religious beliefs

Examples of "strong belief or trust in someone or something" and how we pretty much have to have "faith" in them every day would be:

- Faith (trust) that our government and all our armed forces are all on our side in protecting us and our nation from enemies who would nuke us;

- faith that the city water supply really is treated and sanitized every day as it's supposed to be, so we aren't drinking microbes from pond scum, fungus and duck droppings;

- faith that the clean drinking water is going to continue to be pumped to our houses everyday without fail and without contamination;

- faith that the sewer system is going to continue every day to carry our household sewage out of the property instead of backing up into it;

- faith that the natural gas pipe lines will continue to bring us heating fuel in below-zero weather up north;

- faith that the air traffic controllers are up-to-date on their continuing education and they are not asleep in the tower when our flight is about to take off or land.

-faith that the 911 operator really is going to send the police when we call about an intruder breaking into our house

So the question I'd ask here is: Are we and everybody across the land "fools" for having faith in such institutions and systems above?

I don't think so.


Examples of b: Belief in God who keeps His promises to the patriarchs for all future generations who believe God are best illustrated in this New Testament letter to the Hebrews, Chapter 11:

(a few examples among many.....)

11 Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see. 2 This is what the ancients were commended for.

3 By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command....

7 By faith Noah, when warned about things not yet seen, in holy fear built an ark to save his family......

8 By faith Abraham, when called to go to a place he would later receive as his inheritance, obeyed and went, even though he did not know where he was going....

17 By faith Abraham, when God tested him, offered Isaac as a sacrifice. He who had embraced the promises was about to sacrifice his one and only son, even though God had said to him, “It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned.”
19 Abraham reasoned that God could even raise the dead, and so in a manner of speaking he did receive Isaac back from death....

23 By faith Moses’ parents hid him....

24 By faith Moses, when he had grown up, refused to be known as the son of Pharaoh’s daughter.
He chose to be mistreated along with the people of God rather than to enjoy the fleeting pleasures of sin.....

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...11&version=NIV

[Bavarian]

Originally Posted by chachacha

As a Catholic i do not have to go around searching for a church i like. as a teen i did study the tenets of many world religions and determined i believed as a Catholic. so no matter if the priest is a great orator or the music is entertaining (fortunately locally both are true) i go to church to receive the Body and Blood of Christ and to share community with my fellow believers. as they say "Bloom where you're planted!" I am at home all over the world when i enter into a Catholic church and attend Mass in any language.

Mass used to be the same World Wide when we had the Traditional Latin Mass. One could have a Missal like I have with Latin on left English on Right, could use anywhere. Had an interesting experience last Summer in Budapest, Mass in Latin but Novus Ordo. Readings and Homily in Ungarn. But did get to Mass and fulfill Sunday Obligation.

That is my wife and I like Holland America Line for sea cruises, always a priest onboard, non-denominational Protestant and Rabbi.

I guess my hope is that everyone finds a Faith to guide them, especially members of my family.