[Laker14]

Originally Posted by jimbomaybe

Of course any one would get out of the way of a golf cart that is a threat to your life or safety, the driver of the golf cart should not put the pedestrian in that position , that is the point, the person driving the machine has a greater responsibility

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

You do you. But I won't be betting my life on 100% of all golf cart drivers who approach me as I'm walking down the street, having 100% full control of their faculties. We live in a community where many golf cart drivers have had their CAR keys taken from them, and are no longer allowed to drive cars. There's a reason for that. So I'll put my money on "this driver might hurt me" and walk to the side. Not because I think all cart drivers are irresponsible. But rather, because only ONE of them needs to be irresponsible to end my life.

OBB, you seem to be arguing against the position that "golf cart drivers should be courteous and give walkers as much room as they can" with an argument that says "I don't trust golf cart drivers to not hit me," as if they are somehow contrary positions.

Actually, your concern about the capability of a few golf cart drivers is EXACTLY why we should give the walkers room. When we do that it lets the walker know they have been seen, and will be avoided. If I don't see any action on the part of the golf cart to acknowledge my presence, by adjusting their path a bit away from me, I am on high alert and looking for my "out" which might needlessly put me in danger.

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by Laker14

OBB, you seem to be arguing against the position that "golf cart drivers should be courteous and give walkers as much room as they can" with an argument that says "I don't trust golf cart drivers to not hit me," as if they are somehow contrary positions.

Actually, your concern about the capability of a few golf cart drivers is EXACTLY why we should give the walkers room. When we do that it lets the walker know they have been seen, and will be avoided. If I don't see any action on the part of the golf cart to acknowledge my presence, by adjusting their path a bit away from me, I am on high alert and looking for my "out" which might needlessly put me in danger.

A golf cart driver, if he's paying attention, has the reflexes of someone who can drive a golf cart safely and responsibly, doesn't need to cross over into another lane to avoid hitting a pedestrian. That is, IF the pedestrian is doing his own job correctly by walking near the edge of the road/path.

The two need to be doing their jobs. If one isn't doing his job, then it's up to the other person to do the job of both of them.

As a pedestrian, I will never trust that the driver of the golf cart is going to be capable of avoiding hitting me. I'll always scoot closer to the edge of the road/path, or step onto the grass/curb if such is available when a golf cart driver approaches.

The why is obvious (or should be): I am at more risk of death as a pedestrian being hit by a golf cart, than I am as the driver of a golf cart who hits a pedestrian.

So again - you do you. Here lies the dead Villager, who had the right of way. Or, you can do like the Muslims do: "Trust in Allah, but tie up your camel."

[OrangeBlossomBaby]

Originally Posted by jimbomaybe

Of course any one would get out of the way of a golf cart that is a threat to your life or safety, the driver of the golf cart should not put the pedestrian in that position , that is the point, the person driving the machine has a greater responsibility

Yes, the driver has the greater responsibility. But not all drivers are responsible. Ask every pedestrian who has been killed by an irresponsible driver. Hm, wait - you can't do that - they're dead.

Yes, pedestrians have the right of way. But having the right of way won't save your life if the driver coming toward you don't care, or is too drunk to notice, or lost their glasses and is driving without them, or is too busy talking on the phone to even look at the road in front of them.

[mtdjed]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

Yes, the driver has the greater responsibility. But not all drivers are responsible. Ask every pedestrian who has been killed by an irresponsible driver. Hm, wait - you can't do that - they're dead.

Yes, pedestrians have the right of way. But having the right of way won't save your life if the driver coming toward you don't care, or is too drunk to notice, or lost their glasses and is driving without them, or is too busy talking on the phone to even look at the road in front of them.

So back to the OPs original statement. If as a pedestrian, I see an approaching golf cart slowing and safely moving out to give me more room, I will feel safer. Isn't that the issue? No need for a lecture about the non-caring, irresponsible, speeding, blind, phone talking, drunken driver having a stroke.

No one has said that the pedestrian can perform that way either. Both parties have responsibility. Courtesy shows by actions of both parties. As a driver, I feel that slowing and safely allowing more spacing shows my intent. As a pedestrian, I feel that going single file or even moving off the path when carts are approaching from both ways shows my intent.

[Garywt]

Originally Posted by CoachKandSportsguy

There are golf cart round abouts in Marsh bend on the golf cart paths, one near everglades rec center and the other near the Waterlilly bridge on the Marsh bend side

Also just outside Brownwood and one up by 466 across from the Hampton in. And of course the huge and dangerous one on Morse Blvd just outside Spanish Springs.

[Laker14]

Originally Posted by mtdjed

So back to the OPs original statement. If as a pedestrian, I see an approaching golf cart slowing and safely moving out to give me more room, I will feel safer. Isn't that the issue? No need for a lecture about the non-caring, irresponsible, speeding, blind, phone talking, drunken driver having a stroke.

No one has said that the pedestrian can perform that way either. Both parties have responsibility. Courtesy shows by actions of both parties. As a driver, I feel that slowing and safely allowing more spacing shows my intent. As a pedestrian, I feel that going single file or even moving off the path when carts are approaching from both ways shows my intent.

Exactly correct. Suggesting the driver let the pedestrian know they have been seen (by giving a little extra space ) in no way suggests that the pedestrian should "play chicken". The friendly wave from the pedestrian lets the driver of the cart know they have been seen, and that the extra space is appreciated.
There is no need nor suggestion of a confrontation. Both parties have a role here in making the MMP as safe as possible.

[jimbomaybe]

Originally Posted by OrangeBlossomBaby

Yes, the driver has the greater responsibility. But not all drivers are responsible. Ask every pedestrian who has been killed by an irresponsible driver. Hm, wait - you can't do that - they're dead.

Yes, pedestrians have the right of way. But having the right of way won't save your life if the driver coming toward you don't care, or is too drunk to notice, or lost their glasses and is driving without them, or is too busy talking on the phone to even look at the road in front of them.

I have seen no posts suggesting that a pedestrian should ignore any danger and rely on their right of way, I have seen posts to the effect , You need to get out of my way, you could get hurt, posts that are incredulous to the idea that a pedestrian isn't required to dodge out of the way, the instinct for self preservation and common sense are two things that should always present when you might encounter the "get out of myway" attitude driver

[MX rider]

Originally Posted by jimbomaybe

I have seen no posts suggesting that a pedestrian should ignore any danger and rely on their right of way, I have seen posts to the effect , You need to get out of my way, you could get hurt, posts that are incredulous to the idea that a pedestrian isn't required to dodge out of the way, the instinct for self preservation and common sense are two things that should always present when you might encounter the "get out of myway" attitude driver

Well said.
As a long time runner, I always acknowledge a courtious driver that gives me room by giving them a thank you wave. Both in Indiana when I'm running on the road, and here on the mmp.

It's not that hard. A little courtesy goes a long way. That includes everyone on the mmp, runners, walkers, bikes and carts.

[Velvet]

Originally Posted by jimbomaybe

I have seen no posts suggesting that a pedestrian should ignore any danger and rely on their right of way, I have seen posts to the effect , You need to get out of my way, you could get hurt, posts that are incredulous to the idea that a pedestrian isn't required to dodge out of the way, the instinct for self preservation and common sense are two things that should always present when you might encounter the "get out of myway" attitude driver

I’m guessing but I think the original upset responses perhaps were effected by the sexist suggestion from the OP that women are less polite, more entitled etc. I had to bite my tongue myself.

[Bill14564]

Originally Posted by Velvet

I’m guessing but I think the original upset responses perhaps were effected by the sexist suggestion from the OP that women are less polite, more entitled etc. I had to bite my tongue myself.

I didn't take the suggestion as sexist at all, just an observation. Notably, the observation appears to have been written by a woman. The observation was bolstered by post #5 which stated (and I'm obviously paraphrasing): I'm a woman and I resemble that remark.

I haven't paid any attention to who was driving the carts that pass me. Once the weather warms a bit and I start walking again I will.

[fdpaq0580]

Originally Posted by Bill14564

I didn't take the suggestion as sexist at all, just an observation. Notably, the observation appears to have been written by a woman. The observation was bolstered by post #5 which stated (and I'm obviously paraphrasing): I'm a woman and I resemble that remark.

I haven't paid any attention to who was driving the carts that pass me. Once the weather warms a bit and I start walking again I will.

Agree with "just an observation". Too many people reading between the lines, maybe?

[MightyDog]

Originally Posted by fdpaq0580

Agree with "just an observation". Too many people reading between the lines, maybe?

No, not at all. As I mentioned in a prior post, a few pages back, if the OP wanted to address a safety issue then the sex of the drivers is irrelevant (and the claim was only based on their observations...maybe not careful ones and, perhaps, biased ones) then purely the issues of safety and consideration should have been stated.

Given I haven't noticed another post from the OP on this long thread, I can't help but, wonder whether the actual intent wasn't sexist in nature. Why not come back on to describe WHY the OP believes pointing-out the sex of drivers is more relevant than discussing specific enhanced safety ideas, etc? See what I mean? It's highly possible that what the OP observed was the same 2 or 3 women who comprised more than 50% of their observances. If so, then that discredits the original claim to begin with - and what difference does the sex of the driver make anyhow? It doesn't. Better safety ought to be the conversational goal here. So, you see, the whole thread originated based on a sexist claim.

[jimbomaybe]

Originally Posted by Velvet

I’m guessing but I think the original upset responses perhaps were effected by the sexist suggestion from the OP that women are less polite, more entitled etc. I had to bite my tongue myself.

If you wish to brand me a sexist , so be it, buy my perspective , from my experience is that women tend to be more conciliatory where men tend to be more confrontational, I confess to being of the male persuasion but not to being the confrontational type

[fdpaq0580]

Originally Posted by MightyDog

No, not at all. As I mentioned in a prior post, a few pages back, if the OP wanted to address a safety issue then the sex of the drivers is irrelevant (and the claim was only based on their observations...maybe not careful ones and, perhaps, biased ones) then purely the issues of safety and consideration should have been stated.

Given I haven't noticed another post from the OP on this long thread, I can't help but, wonder whether the actual intent wasn't sexist in nature. Why not come back on to describe WHY the OP believes pointing-out the sex of drivers is more relevant than discussing specific enhanced safety ideas, etc? See what I mean? It's highly possible that what the OP observed was the same 2 or 3 women who comprised more than 50% of their observances. If so, then that discredits the original claim to begin with - and what difference does the sex of the driver make anyhow? It doesn't. Better safety ought to be the conversational goal here. So, you see, the whole thread originated based on a sexist claim.

Sorry I didn't interpret it that way. Like making the observation that men are generally taller than women doesn't infer that either sex is better or worse, just different in certain ways. A coin has a "heads" side and a "tails" side. Neither side is better or more valuable, but you will discern differences, and that doesn't mean you are a "coinist".

[Velvet]

Originally Posted by fdpaq0580

Sorry I didn't interpret it that way. Like making the observation that men are generally taller than women doesn't infer that either sex is better or worse, just different in certain ways. A coin has a "heads" side and a "tails" side. Neither side is better or more valuable, but you will discern differences, and that doesn't mean you are a "coinist".

Yes, but… there is a difference between attributes and behaviors. We are responsible for our own behavior. The coin is not.