[HORNET]

PS: Sounds like someone is out to make out! Nobody gives you nothing for nothing!

[vinnytalk]

Originally Posted by Retired55

This is a different view on an AED program that a group on Facebook is implementing, for the Village of Newell. It is a view no one on Facebook in the Group will comment on for fear of being outcast or attacked. That’s why its being posted here. This is not meant to attack the organizers or anyone who supports or has donated to the program. The organizer has mentioned to the group that some people where opposed to the Program but they do not understand why.

The group wants to install 25 AED devices throughout the Village, and is asking $100 per household.

First, the AED devises are a great Lifesaving tool and I think they are wonderful as I am also certified to operate one. But the program itself is not the issue.

Simply said, a Facebook group should not be making decisions for the entire Village, no matter how good or well meaning the project is. It is just a Facebook group; no one voted anyone in for this. It has created a situation where you are making people uncomfortable and pitting one side against another. This should not happen. The group is aggressively collecting money by going door to door, setting up tables at the mail and rec centers and other ways. Some people do not appreciate that and shouldn't have to explain why they do not want to contribute.

The Village of Newell is a beautiful community, with friendly neighbors who look out for each other and enjoy each others company. While this program is very thoughtful and well meaning, please understand that there may be some neighbors who do not agree, for their own reasons.

I'm sure money can be an issue with some people, and they shouldn’t have to explain that to anyone, or be made uncomfortable because of it.

There are lots of questions about the program itself but that is for a different conversation and is not really relevant to this view.

Please, this is just a different view not an argument.

I am curios what others in the Villages have to say on the issue.

Retired

They have the right to organize whatever they want ,your option is to either join or not, but if you don't they may not come to your aid if you need it one day.

Why is this troubling you?

[Topspinmo]

Originally Posted by Retired55

This is a different view on an AED program that a group on Facebook is implementing, for the Village of Newell. It is a view no one on Facebook in the Group will comment on for fear of being outcast or attacked. That’s why its being posted here. This is not meant to attack the organizers or anyone who supports or has donated to the program. The organizer has mentioned to the group that some people where opposed to the Program but they do not understand why.

The group wants to install 25 AED devices throughout the Village, and is asking $100 per household.

First, the AED devises are a great Lifesaving tool and I think they are wonderful as I am also certified to operate one. But the program itself is not the issue.

Simply said, a Facebook group should not be making decisions for the entire Village, no matter how good or well meaning the project is. It is just a Facebook group; no one voted anyone in for this. It has created a situation where you are making people uncomfortable and pitting one side against another. This should not happen. The group is aggressively collecting money by going door to door, setting up tables at the mail and rec centers and other ways. Some people do not appreciate that and shouldn't have to explain why they do not want to contribute.

The Village of Newell is a beautiful community, with friendly neighbors who look out for each other and enjoy each others company. While this program is very thoughtful and well meaning, please understand that there may be some neighbors who do not agree, for their own reasons.

I'm sure money can be an issue with some people, and they shouldn’t have to explain that to anyone, or be made uncomfortable because of it.

There are lots of questions about the program itself but that is for a different conversation and is not really relevant to this view.

Please, this is just a different view not an argument.

I am curios what others in the Villages have to say on the issue.

Retired

IMO in some areas waste of money, they never get used, someone with key has to be available and get there before first responders. Course I live in area that has excellent fire and first responders response times. ( within mile from sub station). Sumter county probably not from past history of wait times for first responders? But, if makes you feel may good worth it. In my villa there are 84 or so residents donation amount was $100 for 3. Yes, I donated even though they probably never get used. So far in 7 years they haven’t.

[CarlR33]

Originally Posted by edtherock

One more perspective: our village has had AEDs for around 20 years. I believe not a single one has been used in 20 years. But batteries must be replaced every few years and maintained etc and a plan of action must be in place to use and find the AED and who is the main person, who is the backup etc etc. Are they really worth it? CPR= fast and no cost and is the most effective way to revive a person. This actually just happened to one of our fellow villagers who stopped breathing on a pickleball court. CPR saved his life, not an AED. I am not seeing the value of the AED. It’s not a perfect world and we are all going to die at some point. Maybe it’s better to have a village CPR class instead of buying a bunch of AEDs?

Yes, I would agree. With any effort a (cost) benefit analysis must be done. Before you say a life is priceless has anyone realized that you would need to have a minimum of three people to utilize one of these AED’s, the victim, the spouse or responder who now has to now call 911, the third person to go get the AED or will the spouse just let the person wait there without administering CPR because getting the AED is more important? Lastly, I have not seen one of these at the community pools? Is there one at the community recreation center buildings or pickle ball courts, etc.? Sadly, what if one that was promised in a location is missing, not working, etc?

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by MandoMan

In the group of courtyard villas where I live, there are at least two AEDs, and perhaps another one I don’t know about. One is a hundred feet from my door. But I don’t know who has the key. I don’t know who to call. I don’t know if the person I called actually knows how to determine if my heart is beating. The person might be shopping or playing golf or on the phone. I live alone, and my doors are locked. If my heart stops, I’m not able to call anyone. If I have a heart attack but my heart is still beating, will I be able to call 911 and open the door?

Most people don’t realize that even if an AED is used within a couple minutes, there is a high likelihood that there will be temporary or permanent mental impairment, even if the heart stops in a hospital. I think most people don’t know that there is very little chance that even if I had a spouse who knew who to call and the person was home, that the person could reach me in under five minutes, and it would probably be longer. In that case, I am almost sure to suffer brain damage. Where these AEDs are most useful is in places like restaurants, stores, and sporting events. I think having them in neighborhoods is mostly the manufacturers trying to make money.

You sound like a candidate for "Life Alert"...

Pushing the button will call 911, which will initiate the AED process.

Now, if you can't get to the door to open it, sorry, but that's a major problem. You'll have to wait for EMS to arrive and break in...

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by JamesLove

My respectful suggestion is to simply avoid over-thinking the issue.

On a yearly basis the cost is less than $20. If you can’t afford to pay then don’t.

If you would like to be involved in the organizing committee or as a responder then do so. If not then don’t.

Simple, isn't it?

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by SusanStCatherine

There are Villages supplied AEDs at the rec centers and on some Villages owned property. A neighborhood needs committed residents to form a response team and The Villages cannot dictate that.

Exactly! Let's say TV places the units where needed. Who's gonna' man them?

It's up to the neighborhood...

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by Blueblaze

It just strikes me as a scam to sell AED's. But when the AED guy down the street showed up at my door a month after I moved in, $100 seemed cheap to avoid becoming an outcast in my new neighborhood. I paid it and that's the last I ever heard from the guy again. He doesn't even wave if he's in his yard when I walk my dog past his house . Oh, well... I guess that's the price we monkey's pay to live in the troupe.

I don't doubt the noble intentions of the the guy with the AED in his yard. I just can't imagine the scenario where it would save anyone's life but his own. So, what are we saying? I grab my shoulder one morning while trimming the shrubs, and some guy in a golf cart happens by who just happens to know CPR, and the phone number for the guy with the key to the AED just happens to be one of the "favorites" in his phone? Luckily, the AED guy two blocks away happens to be home, and moments later, here he comes screaming down the street with the gadget to save my life? And while the gadget is shocking me back to life, he pulls out his phone and dials 911 to fetch the EMT's from the fire station three blocks away?

I dunno. Seems like a stretch. But never accuse me of challenging monkey customs! Just pay it and quityerbichen!

Somebody didn't read the thread before responding... All of your mistaken assumptions have been addressed, multiple times...

And no one in your neighborhood cares if you donate or not...

[BrianL99]

Originally Posted by Kenswing

A little understanding of the program can go a long way. There’s no calling the guy with the combo to the AED. As soon as someone calls 911 and reports a cardiac arrest, the AED responders are sent an alert simultaneously to the fire department being toned out.
Our village is broken into zones. When the call goes out the trained responders in the zone where the incident is gets a text alert along with an automated phone message. In most cases the two adjacent zones to the incident will also be activated just to ensure an adequate number of people respond.

Originally Posted by jayteadunn

I wanted to add some info to this. I've been in the fire service and ems since the mid 80's.

Most importantly the chance of survival diminishes by 10% for every minute it takes to get an AED physically on the patient. The fire dept has a goal of a firehouse within 2.5 miles of a home. With the 911 call, getting on the engine, and driving to the call its 5 minutes. 50% chance. The neighborhood groups add 20% to 30% to the chance of survival.

Absolutely early CPR is the key BUT imagine you rearranged your spark plug wires on your car in the wrong order. You can try to start that car all day and it will never run. A heart rhythm is like those spark plug wires. You can do CPR until the cows come home BUT if the heart is in the wrong rhythm the cpr isn't going to help. Shock the heart into the right rhythm and you are ready to have cpr start than engine.

I read a lot in this thread about the fire dept arriving first. The Villages Fire Rescue is BUSY. They do tons of medical calls every day. You don't need to believe me. Download the pulsepoint app to your phone. Choose sumter county and watch the calls. The unit numbers for the vehicles are shown for each call. Look how many do call after call. While the villlages wants firehouses every 2.5 miles to each home realize your unit can easily be on another call and now your waiting for the one 5 miles or 7.5 miles away. It is what it is. Look at the app and see how busy they are. You will be surprised.

Someone said "AED's run on batteries and in some cases are $2,000" I think they meant the brand new AED is $2,000. The unit the FD recommends now is a little under $2,000 which includes the battery which often is good for several years.

Someone said "what prevents these from being stolen?" many have padlocks and are keyed the same for the AED program and the rescuers are issued padlock keys.

Someone said "Actually the fire department has a program that a box holding a key can be placed on your home to gain entry" this is called a knox box and the villages fire rescue has keys which open the knox box. All of the knox boxes in the village are keyed alike so they can open it in an emergency and pull out your home key. I installed one, it was easy. With sales tax and shipping it was under $230. The vendor is VSC Fire & Security in Orlando 407-679-3332. You want the residential one. here is a short video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N-xXB2510o

Well this thread has seemingly turned the corner, into substantive and important information.

Thank you both for bringing some value to the conversation.

[JMintzer]

Originally Posted by CarlR33

Yes, I would agree. With any effort a (cost) benefit analysis must be done. Before you say a life is priceless has anyone realized that you would need to have a minimum of three people to utilize one of these AED’s, the victim, the spouse or responder who now has to now call 911, the third person to go get the AED or will the spouse just let the person wait there without administering CPR because getting the AED is more important? Lastly, I have not seen one of these at the community pools? Is there one at the community recreation center buildings or pickle ball courts, etc.? Sadly, what if one that was promised in a location is missing, not working, etc?

The responders will not be contacted until 911 is called. The 911 operator alerts the neighborhood responders...

The training does not have you leave a patient to go get the AED. You are trained to stay with the patient and perform CPR (if necessary) until additional help arrives...

They definitely have them at the rec center pools. The postal station pools don't, because there is no local group to respond. The pickleball courts are located by rec centers, so they should have them, as well..

[pokeefe45@aol.com]

Originally Posted by BigDawgInLakeDenham

I'll be nice and point out that's exactly what I said....but also you must in exact detail tell us what you will do, after waiting around the most precious moments in someone's life, when the AED says..."No Shock advised". I would appreciate it immensely if you would also explain why you waited for the AED to tell you what I've been saying all along. Tell us how you've contributed to a brain dead victim that you witheld CPR from? Lack of knowledge kills people. Also....you really want to represent Harvard?....

I have always feared that having a complete 'AED' program would be a barrier for anyone to actually learn and practice CPR-The mention in another reply about a Village having had AED's for 20 years without ANY use is eye-opening-Are we able to gather any facts from VPSD about the existing programs? And how do we educate people to ensure CPR is the initial response and ensure we have a neighborhood filled with residents trained in CPR? I'm just a 'little dawg' in Lake Denham-but your posts are making sense to me-How do we engage and redirect now before it's too late? Noone is ill intentioned-but maybe ill-informed?

[asianthree]

Originally Posted by JMintzer

You sound like a candidate for "Life Alert"...

Pushing the button will call 911, which will initiate the AED process.

Now, if you can't get to the door to open it, sorry, but that's a major problem. You'll have to wait for EMS to arrive and break in...

As mentioned earlier The fire department has a program for entry to homes without breaking down a door. Box with a key is added to outside home. No major problems involved.

Originally Posted by Retired55

This is a different view on an AED program that a group on Facebook is implementing, for the Village of Newell. It is a view no one on Facebook in the Group will comment on for fear of being outcast or attacked. That’s why its being posted here. This is not meant to attack the organizers or anyone who supports or has donated to the program. The organizer has mentioned to the group that some people where opposed to the Program but they do not understand why.

The group wants to install 25 AED devices throughout the Village, and is asking $100 per household.

First, the AED devises are a great Lifesaving tool and I think they are wonderful as I am also certified to operate one. But the program itself is not the issue.

Simply said, a Facebook group should not be making decisions for the entire Village, no matter how good or well meaning the project is. It is just a Facebook group; no one voted anyone in for this. It has created a situation where you are making people uncomfortable and pitting one side against another. This should not happen. The group is aggressively collecting money by going door to door, setting up tables at the mail and rec centers and other ways. Some people do not appreciate that and shouldn't have to explain why they do not want to contribute.

The Village of Newell is a beautiful community, with friendly neighbors who look out for each other and enjoy each others company. While this program is very thoughtful and well meaning, please understand that there may be some neighbors who do not agree, for their own reasons.

I'm sure money can be an issue with some people, and they shouldn’t have to explain that to anyone, or be made uncomfortable because of it.

There are lots of questions about the program itself but that is for a different conversation and is not really relevant to this view.

Please, this is just a different view not an argument.

I am curios what others in the Villages have to say on the issue.

Retired

The old section of DeLuna by Tate Gregory Villas put one in like 3 years ago. $75 per house.

14 minute response time for EMT care BACK THEN. What is the value of saving a life now $50 to $100. Is saving a life worth it??

No idea if everyone participated in paying their fair or not fair "share". Happy to have seen it everytime I drove by as a 2x CABG zipper-club member.

What does one waste on beer, wine, golf, painting their driveways while living in T V?

FB drama... life is too fricken short to let that raise blood pressure.

[Maker]

Originally Posted by CarlR33

Yes, I would agree. With any effort a (cost) benefit analysis must be done. Before you say a life is priceless has anyone realized that you would need to have a minimum of three people to utilize one of these AED’s, the victim, the spouse or responder who now has to now call 911, the third person to go get the AED or will the spouse just let the person wait there without administering CPR because getting the AED is more important? Lastly, I have not seen one of these at the community pools? Is there one at the community recreation center buildings or pickle ball courts, etc.? Sadly, what if one that was promised in a location is missing, not working, etc?

The benefit of having CPR trained people nearby is huge. Consider that many nearby neighbors are now trained in how to do proper CPR. And these people will come to help asap.

They might not be comfortable breaking ribs as they do compressions, but they understand it happens and will continue.
Performing CPR is very exhausting. Having more people there is always better then just one person.
Multiple people splits up the work. Most do CPR, and others grab the AED. I look at the AED boxes in my neighborhood and would notice if one unit was missing. They are extremely reliable, and most likely to work when needed. If two were grabbed for a call, I'd say 100% reliable.

What happens at locations like sports courts? There is a good chance that someone already there has been trained in CPR because of the AED programs. Even without an AED right there, trained people are critical to saving a life.

An AED also monitors the chest compressions. It will instruct the responder to press harder, faster, etc, as needed. That alone improves the quality of CPR.

There are plenty of what-if games people can imagine. Over the years of AEDs being available, and the nationwide data collection that happens from their use, guidelines are developed to make the overall system as best as it can be. Those what-if things are already considered and addressed. Is it 100% perfect - pretty close.

[beckylou152]

Originally Posted by BigDawgInLakeDenham

Thanks for posting this perspective on Facebook groups. I have wondered "who appointed them boss?"....obviously themselves. It's wonderful that people take initiative to do stuff, but your ideas are valid. I along with you am not chastising any group and I believe them to have good intentions.

That being said, the same thing is happening in Lake Denham and I believe my neighbors want AED's but the only thing I know is.....they're collecting money.

Why I don't know more is purely my fault because:
1. I don't use Facebook
2. I'm a Snow Flake and I'm rarely at my TV home at this point,
but soon to be there full time
3. I haven't sought out the person spearheading the initiative
4. I can't commit to do anything at this time

Here are my thoughts on an AED program:
1. The best why to give an unresponsive person with no pulse is
IMMEDIATE INITIATION OF CPR...so teach everyone CPR
2. There is a good chance that the pulseless victim is in an
UNSHOCKABLE RYHTHM AND THE AED DOESN'T HELP SO
TEACH EVERYONE CPR
3. AED's do not provide CPR
4. AED's run on batteries and in some cases are $2,000
disposable equipment. Are you purchasing replacement
batteries and who is funding that over the years? Who is
routinely checking for proper functionality? A dead AED is
worthless

I would think that someone wanting AED's would first talk to the entire neighborhood and rally the troops. Find out who knows ACLS and CPR. Who has done CPR. Who has used defibrillators to shock people into a survivable rhythm. Get a team of folks that are in the know and not afraid to help in an emergency. Have a phone list of folks that can and will help. An AED looking nice in a weatherproof box may give you warm and fuzziness but is worthless until properly utilized.

Again I'm not being mean.....I'm being realistic

It is recommended to have both CPR and AED training as AED with CPR is twice as effective as CPR alone. Attention Required! | Cloudflare.