[Yoda]

You have to take into consideration that the income stated is not the average income of the average retiree (frog). A lot of 2 income second home income is counted. The Village Sun is trying to attract advertisers.

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by Yoda

You have to take into consideration that the income stated is not the average income of the average retiree (frog). A lot of 2 income second home income is counted. The Village Sun is trying to attract advertisers.

It will be interesting to read the demographics after the next census is posted.

[Russ_Boston]

Gracie - I assume by that you mean that the current economy will slow those numbers down. But I think this economy has very little impact on those that are already down there.

Those people affected will be those that can't sell their home up north and are stuck between a rock and a hard place. Or have lost their job and have had to put their retirement dreams on hold.

Those that have made the move have lined up all their ducks and calculated their income prior to the move. Sure there may be a small decrease but I'll bet the vast majority of TV residents have a steady, fixed stream of income. Most don't rely on a full time job and are conservative in their investment goals.

Just my 2 cents (pun intended!). Russ

[Dirigo]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

It will be interesting to read the demographics after the next census is posted.

http://www.thevillagescommercialprop...ges-market.asp

Click on Fig 1: Average Income per Household link. The Villages average homebuyer's income at the last census was $74,300.

I wonder what the mean retiree income is? $50K-$70K?

Let's find out! Is there a way to do a blind income survey on TOTV?

[collie1228]

I'm certainly no statistician (I got only two C's in college - in Statistics I and its follow-on course), but I think that if you want to look at meaningful data, you should concentrate on "median" income, not "average" or mean income. While we like to say "what is the average income in TV?", what we really want to know what is the "typical" income. By using average income, you are probably looking at an artificially high number, as the average includes both mortals with retirement income in the range of 50-60K, and those who live in those $1M+ houses along the championship courses, whose incomes certainly drive the "average" retirement income number up. The median retirement income is calculated by determining the point at which 1/2 of all incomes are lower and 1/2 of all incomes are higher. IMHO, the median income number would be more typical, and is therefore more useful in comparison. When I see "average income" used in the newspaper (especially in the New York Times), I start looking deeper to see what the writer's real intention is, as the "average" can be very deceptive.

[Dirigo]

Originally Posted by collie1228

I'm certainly no statistician (I got only two C's in college - in Statistics I and its follow-on course), but I think that if you want to look at meaningful data, you should concentrate on "median" income, not "average" or mean income. While we like to say "what is the average income in TV?", what we really want to know what is the "typical" income. By using average income, you are probably looking at an artificially high number, as the average includes both mortals with retirement income in the range of 50-60K, and those who live in those $1M+ houses along the championship courses, whose incomes certainly drive the "average" retirement income number up. The median retirement income is calculated by determining the point at which 1/2 of all incomes are lower and 1/2 of all incomes are higher. IMHO, the median income number would be more typical, and is therefore more useful in comparison. When I see "average income" used in the newspaper (especially in the New York Times), I start looking deeper to see what the writer's real intention is, as the "average" can be very deceptive.

Median is even better!

Does anyone know if a blind poll is do-able?

[Russ_Boston]

If you start a poll here it is blind as far as the answer to the poll. You don't need to make a comment. So start one if you wish.

BUT

Is it really important to any of us what the average or the median income is? Unless you planning to open a business and need to do some analysis then who cares?

What IS important is your monthly budget calculation. You can find all the info you need in this forum to help you estimate a monthly expense flow. Then simply figure you monthly income flow and make sure that you have enough. Obviously you need more than the typical expense flow (add in some trips back north, savings, extra fun things, medical, dental, travel etc.)

[Dirigo]

Originally Posted by Russ_Boston

If you start a poll here it is blind as far as the answer to the poll. You don't need to make a comment. So start one if you wish.

BUT

Is it really important to any of us what the average or the median income is? Unless you planning to open a business and need to do some analysis then who cares?

What IS important is your monthly budget calculation. You can find all the info you need in this forum to help you estimate a monthly expense flow. Then simply figure you monthly income flow and make sure that you have enough. Obviously you need more than the typical expense flow (add in some trips back north, savings, extra fun things, medical, dental, travel etc.)

Russ-Yes, you're right, of course. It all boils down to an individual's income stream vs. anticipated costs.

The reason for a poll would be to cut through the TV marketing hype regarding average income, and to get some perspective about what is the median income level. What is the real situation?

If some TOTV'ers are grousing about prices and the average income is $65K, someone with a projected retirement income of $55K might realize they will have to budget carefully to live in TV, while someone with a projected retirement income of $75K might feel reassured that they can live comfortably in TV.

Being a relative newbie I don't know how to start a poll and I'm not sure how to make it a blind poll.

[Muncle]

The real issue is not "average" income in TV vs "Median" income in TV. The real issue is the definition of "in TV." As I and others have stated elsewhere, amongst Villages homeowners (not residents), you have those who are fully retired living on retirement income, interest on investments, SSI, and similar income streams. Add to those, households with those incomes who also work part time for TV or for Lowes or the like. That income isn't great but does skew the numbers. Then you have others who continue to work in their career jobs, either from here or commuting. That income is very significant and will likely be close to double post retirement money. All of the above could/would be full time TV residents.

Then you have the snowflakes and snowbirds who spend varying amounts of time in TV. Many of these have single or dual incomes from career jobs "up north" and those numbers would generally be way higher than the average frog. Yes, their expenses would be greater, but we're ignoring those for this question. when these folks actually retire that income should drop considerably.

So no, I don't think one can accurately determine any meaningful income statistics for TV people. No, contrary too what some believe, we're not all rich. We have some residents subsisting solely on SSI. We have others who have accumulated exceptional retirement portfolios and have very comfortable 6 figure incomes. And we have other owners who maintain successful businesses into their later years and couples who work 9, 10, 11, or more months year ands net really large incomes. And we are all "in TV" as buyers, owners, residents.

So if you are trying to determine these economic demographics for TV, you can't get there from here.

[LELANDJANE]

I've been interested in this thread for several days, as I'm trying to move to tv. The more I've read, the more I wonder if I CAN afford it. I'm 63 and widowed so will be on a fixed income (ss and retirement from my husband and me). I guess I'll have to wait till I see how it works out financially here in Alabama after I retire March 1. In my heart, I really want to sell my house and be in tv fulltime. I'll be visiting there this weekend, so maybe I'll see you then. I'm enjoying getting to know you through this form.

[njgranny]

I don't have any idea what your income will be, but I'm sure you could find something in TV that would allow you to retire there. Enjoy your visit.

Jan

[baybob]

Originally Posted by JohnN

baybob, all the new patio villas are 2BR - 1-1/2 car garage, about 1160'
in fact there's a price reduced/very private villa in the neighborhood next to ours for $133K (2 sides fenced) and it's a steal (IMHO)

about the same as most of the courtyard villas and ranch homes,

if you want 3BR or 2 car garage, you'll pay somewhat more,

check the TV listings and you can sort by those factors

Thanks John,

This is a great thread for those considering TV. It seems like the "wealth numbers" are kept artificially high by TV management to convince businesses that folks in TV are loaded with greenbacks. It also seems that the reality is that couples with incomes in the neighborhood of $50 K can find their place in TV and enjoy a nice retirement. We can't even buy a shed up north for $133K even with the collapsing economy.

[graciegirl]

BayBob.

You need to come down here and see for your selves if you haven't done so.

I am a huge cheerleader for the developer and I really don't think that it is the Morses who are presenting the income numbers as high. They don't have to do anything to get business to move here, every store I have been in is crowded or close!

I have received our first utility bill and it is much lower than up north. The groceries are a little higher and the country club restaurants are very affordable.

Come on down so we can welcome you properly. It is so wonderful, I wonder why I just didn't want to ever live in Florida.

GracieGirl

[graciegirl]

Originally Posted by graciegirl

BayBob.

You need to come down here and see for your selves if you haven't done so.

I am a huge cheerleader for the developer and I really don't think that it is the Morses who are presenting the income numbers as high. They don't have to do anything to get business to move here, every store I have been in is crowded or close!

I have received our first utility bill and it is much lower than up north. The groceries are a little higher and the country club restaurants are very affordable.

Come on down so we can welcome you properly. It is so wonderful, I wonder why I just didn't want to ever live in Florida.

GracieGirl

I have found this old thread on the same subject fyi

[aljetmet]

I've been reviewing posts on how much it cost in TV. To me it's really just a little more than it would cost to live anywhere. Especially if you currently own a house. The amenity fee of $135 is low. The other costs of home ownership is the same or less in TV. I get the feeling that people concerned of the cost are current non home owners. I can't blame them. However, if you can afford $1,500 plus the cost of the mortgage and the bond you're fine.

All other costs will be the same as anywhere else you plan to live in retirement.
Federal taxes are the same. Medical costs I'm sure will be the same in FL as it would be anywhere else. The same for Food , clothes, entertainment...
Don't be scared, you can do it!